99 replies to this topic

[Ghostrider]

That single lancer, along with the Sovereign's compliment of TIE fighters, will eventually wipe out all of the B-wings. Consider how long it will take those B-wings to destroy the Sovereign with the amount of hull integrity it has. The Rebels will have to continually send in reinforcements and suffer heavy losses before destroying the Sovereign.

There is a lovely quote in one of the X-Wing books, probably referring to the eventual destruction of Lusyanka when the NR is considering ways to defeat an Executor-class star destroyer. One of the admirals is quoted as saying that although the Lusyanka an extremely expensive destructive force, while it can be defeated with a much cheaper opposing fleet, this is only possible with a massive loss of life!

So SSD's offer a conundrum. Do you waste credits defeating them with big ships, or do you waste lives defeating them with little ships?

[Valter]

That single lancer, along with the Sovereign's compliment of TIE fighters, will eventually wipe out all of the B-wings. Consider how long it will take those B-wings to destroy the Sovereign with the amount of hull integrity it has. The Rebels will have to continually send in reinforcements and suffer heavy losses before destroying the Sovereign.

There is a lovely quote in one of the X-Wing books, probably referring to the eventual destruction of Lusyanka when the NR is considering ways to defeat an Executor-class star destroyer. One of the admirals is quoted as saying that although the Lusyanka an extremely expensive destructive force, while it can be defeated with a much cheaper opposing fleet, this is only possible with a massive loss of life!

So SSD's offer a conundrum. Do you waste credits defeating them with big ships, or do you waste lives defeating them with little ships?

The only problem is that the Lusyanka had no superlaser, therefore larger ships had a fighting chance against it. The Sovereign can only be defeated by starfighters, considering the fact that the Sovereign's shields are just too strong for turbolaser-fire to penetrate, so only proton torpedoes and concussive weaponry will have effect. The superlaser will prevent Independence-class cruisers from getting within firing range anyway.

Now that I think about it, it all depends on the recharge time of the superlaser; if it requires a minute or so for the superlaser to recharge then I suppose it may be possible to attack the Sovereign with large cruisers after all, assuming of course that there are dozens of them to spare. But if the recharge time is a matter of seconds...well, that's a different story.

[Dr-Ludvig]

basicly, just run if you se The Sovereing coming at you!

[Valter]

The only problem is that the Lusyanka had no superlaser, therefore larger ships had a fighting chance against it. The Sovereign can only be defeated by starfighters, considering the fact that the Sovereign's shields are just too strong for turbolaser-fire to penetrate, so only proton torpedoes and concussive weaponry will have effect.

Lusankya was an executor-class destroyer. The executor-class and the sovereign class have the same shield strength. The executor-class, may not have a superlaser, but it has 5000 guns, plus it carries way more fighters and bombers than the sovereign-class.

But the Sovereign has a tougher hull and a superlaser that can destroy an Independence class in one shot. Even with the number of guns on the Executor, it would take some time before it takes down the shields of the Independence-class, and then finally attack the hull.

[Dane Kiet]

would that make the soveriegn unstoppable practically? after all, it takes time to build alot of star fighters, but it takes less time to build one small, station killing fleet. so, while the soveriegn is causing havoc and the rebs are concentrating on that, you can raid their planets with smaller, faster moving fleets. In doing so, you would force the rebs to both defend their territory AND try to kill the sovereign, which is a daunting task. The rebellion would have to gamble and pray their first attack works, otherwise they are dead. they wouldn't get a second shot.

[EduardPais]

And remember, you can have as many sovereign-class ships as you want. But one ship will most likely drain you out of every credit you have.

[Pred the Penguin]

would that make the soveriegn unstoppable practically? after all, it takes time to build alot of star fighters, but it takes less time to build one small, station killing fleet. so, while the soveriegn is causing havoc and the rebs are concentrating on that, you can raid their planets with smaller, faster moving fleets. In doing so, you would force the rebs to both defend their territory AND try to kill the sovereign, which is a daunting task. The rebellion would have to gamble and pray their first attack works, otherwise they are dead. they wouldn't get a second shot.

Consider how much credits it takes to build one single Sovereign, and it actually costs a lot of time to build, too. You'd have Rebels swarming all over by the time you have one.

[Ghostrider]

PS : srry about the Guest thing, i am on a school computer adn have nothing better to do........

What do you mean nothing better to do?

Posting on Phoenix is the most important thing we do.. Mu HA HA HA

[jdk002]

Sovereign-class Star Dreadnoughts take a very long time to build.

[Dane Kiet]

PS : srry about the Guest thing, i am on a school computer adn have nothing better to do........

What do you mean nothing better to do?

Posting on Phoenix is the most important thing we do.. Mu HA HA HA

lolz, and the rebs wouldn't build the fleet to kill the soveriegn until after its built and the reb sees it (and i have ways to keep it secret after construction), so the problem still stands......... how to defeat it

[EduardPais]

Well, the first eclipse was destroyed by Palpatine's lightning storm, the second eclipse was hacked by r2-d2 and set on a collision course with the galaxy gun, which in turn fired on byss where the sovereigns (4 of them) were being built and blew byss with all the sovereigns, thus the rebels never really had to fight a ship to ship battle with a ship fielding a superlaser.

Edited by EduardPais, 21 December 2007 - 01:52 AM.

[Phoenix Rising]

How long do you think it would take to kill the soveriegn? using 48 fully upgraded b-wings?

Generally anything you throw at it will take 20-30 minutes at the least. I can't say specifically, but you'll be able to test it yourself soon enough.

Maybe 2-3 Mon Cal 120 Dreadnoughts. Assuming the Sov doesn't fire its super beam.

Heh, never assume. The Home One types are probably the worst thing you can throw at it.

That single lancer, along with the Sovereign's compliment of TIE fighters, will eventually wipe out all of the B-wings. Consider how long it will take those B-wings to destroy the Sovereign with the amount of hull integrity it has. The Rebels will have to continually send in reinforcements and suffer heavy losses before destroying the Sovereign.

Heh, I feel like we're arguing in some Imperial war room. Awesome .

Anyways, this would be the case if the B-wings are focused on the dreadnought. If they take time to dogfight the TIEs, the Rebels will easily win.

There is a lovely quote in one of the X-Wing books, probably referring to the eventual destruction of Lusyanka when the NR is considering ways to defeat an Executor-class star destroyer. One of the admirals is quoted as saying that although the Lusyanka an extremely expensive destructive force, while it can be defeated with a much cheaper opposing fleet, this is only possible with a massive loss of life!

So SSD's offer a conundrum. Do you waste credits defeating them with big ships, or do you waste lives defeating them with little ships?

Great quote . And even better that that's exactly how it works out in-game .

Now that I think about it, it all depends on the recharge time of the superlaser; if it requires a minute or so for the superlaser to recharge then I suppose it may be possible to attack the Sovereign with large cruisers after all, assuming of course that there are dozens of them to spare. But if the recharge time is a matter of seconds...well, that's a different story.

It's set to 15 seconds, mainly to put it's DPS output on par with the Executor. Never underestimate the destructive power of thousands of turbolasers...

But the Sovereign has a tougher hull and a superlaser that can destroy an Independence class in one shot. Even with the number of guns on the Executor, it would take some time before it takes down the shields of the Independence-class, and then finally attack the hull.

At point-blank range, surprisingly not much. I think the RPG game which gave us these stats basically allows for a broadside attack from the Executor to destroy any smaller ship in a single round, which is roughly six seconds. It's not that much longer in PR.

would that make the soveriegn unstoppable practically? after all, it takes time to build alot of star fighters, but it takes less time to build one small, station killing fleet. so, while the soveriegn is causing havoc and the rebs are concentrating on that, you can raid their planets with smaller, faster moving fleets. In doing so, you would force the rebs to both defend their territory AND try to kill the sovereign, which is a daunting task. The rebellion would have to gamble and pray their first attack works, otherwise they are dead. they wouldn't get a second shot.

The idea with the dreadnoughts is that they will come into play if you ignore your enemy for too long. My goal, in most scenarios, is that building one of them should grind your other production to a halt, so regularly harassing your enemy should prevent that from happening, even if you aren't bordering his shipyards. In that sense, they function as a superweapon archetype, but unlike many other RTS superweapons, they are not an end-all option for winning as they do have their weaknesses and a good commander can minimize/exploit those depending on which side he is fighting.

PS : srry about the Guest thing, i am on a school computer adn have nothing better to do........

What do you mean nothing better to do?

Posting on Phoenix is the most important thing we do.. Mu HA HA HA

Heh, indeed .

[Dane Kiet]

would that make the soveriegn unstoppable practically? after all, it takes time to build alot of star fighters, but it takes less time to build one small, station killing fleet. so, while the soveriegn is causing havoc and the rebs are concentrating on that, you can raid their planets with smaller, faster moving fleets. In doing so, you would force the rebs to both defend their territory AND try to kill the sovereign, which is a daunting task. The rebellion would have to gamble and pray their first attack works, otherwise they are dead. they wouldn't get a second shot.

The idea with the dreadnoughts is that they will come into play if you ignore your enemy for too long. My goal, in most scenarios, is that building one of them should grind your other production to a halt, so regularly harassing your enemy should prevent that from happening, even if you aren't bordering his shipyards. In that sense, they function as a superweapon archetype, but unlike many other RTS superweapons, they are not an end-all option for winning as they do have their weaknesses and a good commander can minimize/exploit those depending on which side he is fighting.

refer to my last post where i said that, while you can't build other ships as fast, you can still build them even when you have a mamoth project like the soveirgn. Now, this logic may be dated since it is based of the mod as it is, but still.......
And, it would be great if you could play a galactic campaign real time with 4vs4.......... THAT would be interesting........... like if people can build fleets under their command that follow their orders, and they fight that battle..... ooooooooh, i am going to make a new topic!!!!

[Phoenix Rising]

And, it would be great if you could play a galactic campaign real time with 4vs4.......... THAT would be interesting........... like if people can build fleets under their command that follow their orders, and they fight that battle..... ooooooooh, i am going to make a new topic!!!!

Not really possible with this engine I'm afraid.

[Valter]

Anyways, this would be the case if the B-wings are focused on the dreadnought. If they take time to dogfight the TIEs, the Rebels will easily win.

Can B-wings, being bombers after all, really take on TIE fighters while being saturated by laserfire from the Sovereign and being fired upon by lancers? Well, I suppose you would know, having designed the mod and all.

[Dane Kiet]

Not really possible with this engine I'm afraid.

i know, but it would have been awesome, and look under com suggestions, you'll see it

[Theempirewins]

Come on guys, leave Phoenix working on his mod...

He is busy with our christmas present

Nice to have you back Phoenix !

[Phoenix Rising]

Come on guys, leave Phoenix working on his mod...

He is busy with our christmas present

Nice to have you back Phoenix !

My responses will likely be slim until it's out, but sometimes I post just to do something different besides looking at XML for hours. And thanks.