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MB's ideas for WotE


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#41 Karsh

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 12:20 PM

Maybe they need to have some sort of stealth while moving.
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#42 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 02:01 PM

Maybe. Perhaps they could be stealthed when moving near trees. I'll consider about it.

PS: Yay ! Here it is ! The Elven Sage for the Elves ! Okay, I know this is a bit supid name, but I didn't find any better at the moment. So feel free to suggest a better name :p

This unit works in a similar way like the Sorcerer for Angmar, but it's rather a defensive than an offensive spellcaster. It has powers like Cure, Power of Light and Protection ! Check it out, and comment !
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#43 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 03:36 PM

I really like your Elven ideas, they're awesome! I'm not good at making up any Elven units, so I'll leave that to you ;) The creep ideas sound really interesting too...

About Isengard, I think Goblin Firestarters is a good unit, but where should it be trained from (not the inn, it's already filled with 3 units), if I remove Half-Orc Spies and Orc Drummers from a new structure called Hall of Orthanc, only 1 unit can be trained from that building. But that leaves some space for the Sentries of Isengard... :p

#44 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 05:08 PM

Heh, thanks, Ithron ! The elves has lost many units when Dorwinion came to the mod anyway - since many units, like the Dorwinion Soldiers, Cuiveinen Pikemen and Alatar were removed to Dorwinion. They just need some more now :p

I believe the Woodsmen and the Elven Sages will be cool if they come ingame !

As for the creeps, I'm glad you like them, too - altrough we've discussed about them already via PM, remember ;) ?

Isengard... hmm... man, this is a really troublesome faction ;) ; what kind of units are in the Inn ? The only unit I know there is the Goblin Archer horde.

...Hall of Orthanc, eh ? Me like it Ithron, sounds cool :p ! The Isengard Sentries could be trained from there, yeah, and maybe one more unit - perhaps the Uruk Raiders (they were amongst the first Uruk-hai anyway, so they would deserve this honor). Or you could consider about Randor, as a "structure hero".
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#45 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 05:18 PM

- Elves will get a new late-game hero to replace Alatar: Galadriel. Their new Ringhero will be Gil-galad. So you don't need to make up any Elven heroes, but new units are needed :p

- Info about the Inn units of each faction and the new Ally system can be found here: http://forums.revora...showtopic=50551 ;)

#46 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 05:25 PM

Yeah, I know about the hero replacements at the Elves. Thanks for the link to the Inn units !

Hmm... perhaps the Orcs of Lugburz could be moved to the Hall of Orthanc and then you could add the Goblin* Firestarters to the Inn.

*to be more fitting, the Firestarters would be called as "Moria Goblin Firestarters".
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#47 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 05:45 PM

Orcs of Lugburz are weak early game units, and Hall of Orthanc is an expensive late game structure :p

#48 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 06:05 PM

...damn. And the Ruffians* ? If you remove them to the hall, you could make the Goblins (both the Archers and the Firestarters) inot "Northern Allies" (Moria lies north of Isengard, doesn't it :p )

*They are rather mid-game or mid-late game units, aren't they ?
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#49 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 06:11 PM

OK, you win :p Goblin Firestarters will be the Northern Allies unit for Isengard, Ruffinans will be moved to Hall of Orthanc. But what should the Firestarters look like?

#50 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 07:05 PM

Heh... don't forget, you are the boss, Ithron, so you can say "No" anytime. Still, thanks ;)

Hmm... I made a basic description for the Firestarters, dunno if it's enough:

Goblins from Moria, wearing ragged clothes and a few metal plates (maybe one on the shoulder and another piece on the chest ?), carrying torches in right hand, and small bottles in the left hand (in the bottles, they keep the oil to spill and make the traps, you know...).

Mwehehe... I just can't wait to make a HOT suprise for Men of the West and kill them with a Goblin Firestarter / Isengard Sentry combo ! BWAHAHAHA :p
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#51 Karsh

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 08:27 PM

I think Firestarters are a bit like the ork guy in the film. You remember in Return of the King that ork who finds Frodo after he was wrapped in a cocon by Shelob? Probably that setting. Altough they will look a lot like Azog (but he disappears, so...)
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#52 MorrisB

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Posted 14 July 2007 - 09:04 PM

Hm, I don't remember exactly... and originally, the idea of the Firestarters came from "The Hobbit" where the goblins try to burn up the trees where Bilbo, Gandalf and the dwarves are on, but are rescued by the eagles just before the flames could reach them.

And Azog... well... who knows, perhaps Ithron will consider about him. Azog, after all, is the goblin who killed Thorin Oakenshield's grandfather (see in "The Hobbit")... and besides, Azog is a more fitting goblin hero than the Goblin King itself with its scorpion and that dragon-summoning skill.

PS: 51 posts, and the thread became a hot topic ! YIPPIE !!!

PPS: not to mention that THREE of my ideas WILL get implemented (Akrothir, Isengard Sentry, Goblin Firestarter) !

Edited by MorrisB, 14 July 2007 - 09:05 PM.

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#53 JEV3

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 12:29 AM

I think the Goblins should use flint and steel to make fire. It would just look cooler that way! :p
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#54 MorrisB

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 08:19 AM

Yeah, I agree, but there are two problems with it:

1.: how would they spill oil then ? Easier to make it if they carry small bottles with oil in them.

2.: it would be harder to animate them with flint and steel. A torch is more simple, YET you get a point, for with the torches they can't hide too well...

3.: ...but also don't forget that I want them to be able to burn buildings and units even without the oil.

Some crazy things are coming later today ! be ready !
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#55 Karsh

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 08:44 AM

Great! I'll give my opinion about the new stuff then.

But yeah, the Firestarters are pretty complicated to create, due to the many diversities they have.
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#56 MorrisB

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 12:41 PM

Yeah... little, troublesome Firestarters... but I couldn't resist to create them :ninja:

PS: okay, the new stuff is up ! Go and look at the CREEP BASES, you can see the new things there: Wildman Village and Black Numenorian Outpost !!!

PPS: and I put up a Special Note:

SPECIAL NOTE: I decided to make up these ideas about creep bases because I find the old Goblin Cave / Cave Troll Lair / Warg Cave a bit boring, and the Spiderling Lair and the Fire Drake Lair weren't enough for me. Call me insane or whatever, but I really would like to have a greater variety of creep bases, especially because the "Untamed Allignance" gives them another way of use, making them even more unique.


I think these new creep bases would make "creeping" a bit more interesting. Please comment !
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#57 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 03:35 PM

Really cool ideas, and what about a Vampire lair creep base with a flying vampire?

BTW, Dragonslayers will be put into the game :ninja:

#58 MorrisB

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 04:05 PM

Really cool ideas, and what about a Vampire lair creep base with a flying vampire?

Um... is this sarcasm or a suggestion ? Maybe it's just me, but I don't remember that Tolkien mentioned vampires in his books... but true, I've read only "The Hobbit" and the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy from Tolkien so far.

BTW, Dragonslayers will be put into the game :)

Then so far it's my FOURTH idea that WILL get implemented... or should I also count Randor ?

:p

Thanks for addig them ! At last I don't have to use these Dwarven Phalanxes anymore... however, I might make an improved description for the Dragon Slayers.

PS: I also had the thought that Dragon Slayers could be the new dwarven Hero Horde(s): 4 unit per horde ---> max. 3 hordes ---> 12 Dragon Slayers... and Thorin Oakenshield had 12 other dwarves in his company...

:ninja:
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#59 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 04:10 PM

vampires and their leader, Thuringwethil are mentioned in the Silmarillion :ninja:

#60 MorrisB

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Posted 15 July 2007 - 04:18 PM

Thurigwethil... hm... I've heard that name somewhere one... oh, yeah ! I get it ! I downloaded a custom campaign for Warcraft 3 once, which was about the Silmarillion (or something like that), and Thurigwethil was an opposing hero !

Hm... but I still dunno... I don't know how vampires appear in Tolkien's world. They are like "classical" vampires (like Dracula, but in other clothes), or else ?

But the basic idea is cool, I admit :ninja: ; but the Vampire Lair (let's call it like this) should be very rarely used, even more rarely than the Mountain Giant's Cave. It should appear only on maps like the Weathertop, or Angmar... so where there are ruins and/or signs of great evil, but is not-so-Mordor-like (so it's not a land of ashes).
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