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MB's ideas for "WotE" 2


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#41 Sheephoof

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Posted 27 September 2007 - 10:29 AM

Ah yes, but then again we're not talking about a real event in history, we're talking about a game - and in a game balance comes hand in hand with gameplay at a top priority, followed by realism. You can't say how important it is to make it 'fun' because you'l find that fun comes from the other three factors ;)

So yes, I'd say it's very important it is balanced; however you did actually display some good knowledge of balance. If an army vastly outnumbers another army, and hte vast army has weak sick men and the other army has a few elite; then in theory that is balanced. A balanced game doesn't mean everyone has to have the same stats - balanced means that it comes down to who controls their units better, not who has access to a unit that beats everything irrelevant of micromanagement skill.

And here's a quote about the Balrog:

"Two great trolls appeared; they bore great slabs of stone, and flung them down to serve as gangways over the fire. But it was not the trolls that had filled the Elf with terror. The ranks of the orcs had opened, and they crowded away as if they themselves were afraid. Something was comming up behind them. What is was could not be seen: it was like a great shadow, in the middle of which was a dark form, of man-shape maybe, yet greater; and a power and terror seemed to be in it it and to go before it. It came to the edge of the fire and the light faded as if a cloud had bent over it. Then with a rush it leaped across the fissure. The flames roared up to greet it, and wreathed about it; and a black smoke swirled in the air. Its streaming mane kindled, and blazed behind it. In its right hand was a blade like a stabbing tongue of fire; in its left it held a whip of many thongs.

BLA BLA BLA

His enemy halted again, facing him, and the shadow about it reached out like two vast wings. It raised the whip, and the thongs whined and cracked. Fire came from its nostrils. But Gandalf stood firm."

There's a quote from the Fellowship... not all the same as the movie Balrog :)

Edited by Sheephoof, 27 September 2007 - 10:31 AM.


#42 MorrisB

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Posted 13 December 2007 - 11:58 AM

And if I'm already at work... wait; I can't update the first post ! WT* ?!? <Sigh>... yeah, this is the technology of the 21th century. Great. Oh well, I'll post my two new complaints here:

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- Make Wraiths of Rhun more unique -

The Wraiths of Rhun should be more unique units than they are right now. If you ask me, there's not much sense in recruiting them at the Inn. They could be replaced by Variag Horse Archers (see my other idea topic) and then the Wraiths of Rhun could be summoned by Pallando's "Dark Poison", which really would make sense, since - basically - the Wraiths of Rhun are the results of Pallando's "experiments".


- Rhun Royal Guard should be trained in Hall of Rhun -

I guess the title says it all. If they are RHUN Riyal Guard, why can't they be trained in the Hall of RHUN ?


What do you guys think ?
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#43 Elendil the High

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Posted 13 December 2007 - 03:47 PM

If you hadn't said it, i would.
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#44 Rudager Jones

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 03:17 AM

Yeah I play WotE (dorwinion beta), and I think in the long run it's pretty kick a**, but I have some ideas for improvements.
-Original Voices
- More in-depth palantir portraits
-Mordor could have some sort of "exchange" system through some evil men emmisary building or something....
- Creep heroes (shelob, drogoth, smaug)
-4 Isengard, have orcs of lugburz replace ruffians at the hall of orthanc, and put ruffians in the clan steading.
- More distinct models
- 4 evil men, have the soldiers of rhun replace easterlings, and have the soldiers of rhun trained in the same building as Rhun archers and the dark easterlings. Also, have corsairs trained in a tavern (touch up the tavern physically), and have haradrim archers trained w/ haradrim spear throwers at the king palace thing
- Other things like that!
-------------ALSO----------------
There should be a hobbit faction. Heroes could be, Merry, pippin, sam,tom bombadil, beorn, radagast, and bilbo or frodo should be the ring hero.
soldiers - hobbit sheriffs, bywater pikemen, hobbit archers, men of bree, bree cavalry, etc.....
and the hobbits could build inns or something..

I have had some performance issues, but for the most part, they are quite minor.

#45 lacrossman930

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 03:53 AM

There should be a hobbit faction. Heroes could be, Merry, pippin, sam,tom bombadil, beorn, radagast, and bilbo or frodo should be the ring hero.
soldiers - hobbit sheriffs, bywater pikemen, hobbit archers, men of bree, bree cavalry, etc.....
and the hobbits could build inns or something..

I have had some performance issues, but for the most part, they are quite minor.


the mod name is Wars of the EAST And Ithron has way to much on his mind to add a whole nother faction in. or are you willing to help?
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#46 Elendil the High

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:19 AM

i don't think that hobbit faction would suit Wars of the East, because of three reasons:

one: This mod is about the wars between Rhun and Dorwinion

two: There isn't enough units to that faction so it match the other factions

three: I don't think ithron has the time, unless you can offer some major help with coding and skinning.
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#47 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 12:06 PM

Elendil said it all. No Hobbit faction will be done, at least not by me...

#48 MorrisB

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 02:04 PM

I'll state everything clearly:

Original Voices - easy to say, but very hard to do considering the low amount of audio guys around here.
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More in-depth palantir portraits - this depends on our artists. Begging will not hasten up our work.
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Mordor could have some sort of "exchange" system through some evil men emmisary buildings or something - Mordor might will get some mannish allies during the future releases, but there won't be a complete mixing of Mordor and Evil Men like there was in the original game. Most likely, Mordor will have Evil Men as summonable allies and/or Inn units.
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Creep heroes (shelob, drogoth, smaug) - Interesting ideas, but on a second though, useless. These would require great work to work properly, and would be useful only in 3-4 maps (like Shelob's Lair and Withered Heath). Thus, they seem quite pointless to me.
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For Isengard, have orcs of lugburz replace ruffians at the hall of orthanc, and put ruffians in the clan steading. - while this suggestion might has a voice of reason, sorry but no. The Hall of Orthanc is meant to be a late-game producing building in the first place.
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More distinct models - once again, this depends on our artist. Begging will not help.
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For evil men, have the soldiers of rhun replace easterlings, and have the soldiers of rhun trained in the same building as Rhun archers and the dark easterlings. Also, have corsairs trained in a tavern (touch up the tavern physically), and have haradrim archers trained w/ haradrim spear throwers at the king palace thing - Soldiers of Rhun will NOT replace Easterling Spearmen, because this would mean a lack of early-game spearmen. Corsairs at the Tavern ? This sounds pretty reasonable, BUT there's a little problem: the Tavern is an expensive building meant for mid-game units and major upgrades, while the Corsairs are basic swordsmen. Hope you understand. As for the archers, most likely, they will remain at their places.
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Other things like that! - like WHAT ?

PS: about Hobbit (Shire) faction: while this is possible, it will not happen (at least not in the near future, that's for sure). While I could easily make up about 20-25 units, 8-10 buildings and 7-9 heroes for them even right now, the amount of work for implementing an entire new faction is enermous (just think about it: basic concept, tech tree, basic artwork, modelling, animating, skinning, etc. etc. etc.). PLUS, as Elendil stated, the Shire has basically nothing to do with this mod.

PPS: BUT if Ithron EVER considers adding Moria as a faction, then we might be able to persuade him about making the Shire also :crazed:

PPPS: but don't count on it.

Edited by MorrisB, 18 December 2007 - 02:05 PM.

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#49 lacrossman930

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 09:30 PM

lol ETH you basically restated what i said lol. it would be cool though. but thats like a entire other mod being added in.
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#50 Rudager Jones

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 02:52 AM

Yeah, a hobbit faction wouldn't fit in with the WARS OF THE EAST, but it's an interesting idea... I know you were being sarcastic and all, but if I could, I would defiantly help ithron and everyone with this mod because it is so kick @$$ :p

#51 MorrisB

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 07:19 AM

Look, I myself would like to see once a fully-done Shire faction in BfME 2, but I don't intend to earn it by begging like some other do people around here.

Sarcasm ? No, my friend. this is just telling the truth. And the truth sometimes hurts, ya' know. No offense meant :p ; your ideas mostly weren't bad, but they were either useless at long range, or would cause disturbances in the game balance.

And what do you mean that you CAN'T help the mod ? EVERYONE could help the mod if he/she wanted so badly ! I myself was a loosy posting member with less than 50 posts when I came here. You know what ? I actually WANTED to help, and I did my best. And so, I became a Project Member without ANY coding, skinning, modelling, mapping skills in LESS than a month !

I hope this tells you something :)
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"Well, I can't argue with that - modding IS hard. But what would have become of games like Starcraft, Warcraft 3, Dungeon Siege, Half-Life 1-2, Neverwinter Nights and BfME 1-2 if we, modders, weren't there ? They would have long been forgotten. Modding is hard, but it's an honorable thing." - MorrisB

#52 Elendil the High

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 10:16 AM

I agree with MB, good and unique ideas are always welcome, even they are not used.

Edited by Elendil the High, 22 December 2007 - 10:16 AM.

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#53 MorrisB

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 08:26 PM

Dammit... I'm still unable to update this topic ! I guess I'll save the data into WinWord format, delete this topic and open a new one if I have the time.

Anyway, here's my newest Complaint:

- Remove Mini-hordes -

As you might know this yourselves: mini-hordes are all but USELESS. Why would someone buy a small battalion which can die within a minute when he/she can buy a whole battalion of warriors of the same caliber, only for a little more resources ? This fact makes the entire idea of mini-hordes useless. I suggest to either make them full-sized battalions for a cheaper training cost than the original units, OR replace them with some other units (those are also "full" battalions).


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"Well, I can't argue with that - modding IS hard. But what would have become of games like Starcraft, Warcraft 3, Dungeon Siege, Half-Life 1-2, Neverwinter Nights and BfME 1-2 if we, modders, weren't there ? They would have long been forgotten. Modding is hard, but it's an honorable thing." - MorrisB

#54 IthronAiwendil

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 09:17 PM

Mini Hordes are more or less removed from the beta, at least any Inn units I've added for the beta are not Mini Hordes. I think only Gundabad Royal Guard are the only Mini-horde that can also be trained from a normal building...

#55 Caluadan

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 10:50 PM

Look, I myself would like to see once a fully-done Shire faction in BfME 2, but I don't intend to earn it by begging like some other do people around here.

Sarcasm ? No, my friend. this is just telling the truth. And the truth sometimes hurts, ya' know. No offense meant ;) ; your ideas mostly weren't bad, but they were either useless at long range, or would cause disturbances in the game balance.

And what do you mean that you CAN'T help the mod ? EVERYONE could help the mod if he/she wanted so badly ! I myself was a loosy posting member with less than 50 posts when I came here. You know what ? I actually WANTED to help, and I did my best. And so, I became a Project Member without ANY coding, skinning, modelling, mapping skills in LESS than a month !

I hope this tells you something ;)



I agree with MB, good and unique ideas are always welcome, even they are not used.


Continuing... [to the so called noobs]

What would actually earn you respect is if you sat down doing something. We modding people are quite good at the thinking ourselves. :p
This something could be art, the most glorious of all the modding lores. :)

Really, try to become good at whatever you feel like doing. It's like an intrument - if you can't handle it, you won't play in any bands.

Edited by Caluadan, 11 January 2008 - 10:51 PM.

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