5127 replies to this topic

[Tathmesh]

INB4 genderbent heroes.

[Daffa the Mage]

After some tests, I think she could use a damage buff instead, at least her modifier against tank is raised even slightly will do wonder.

[teztez]

After some tests, I think she could use a damage buff instead, at least her modifier against tank is raised even slightly will do wonder.

That will work too

[Mr_DevilSmile]

I did not know whether to post this in #Campaign, Cooperative & Challenge Discussion or or if I should do it here.

 

I have a complaint with the origin story...

 

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way he is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following him, what makes them follow his leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, his soldiers follow his general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of she, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

 

Another point that I would like to comment, I do not know what plans they have for Rashidi, but if they do not have big plans for him, I would like to see his participation in the revolt. he is a very important character, Yuri owes his arsenal to Rashidi's ingenuity, if not, it just would simply use technology stolen from Soviet and Allied. One idea I came up with is that both Yunru and Rashidi are on their way to the meeting point in the sea of ​​Bering, so the origin missions can focus on both trips, from two different points on the map, while Yunru travels to Japan To recover Kanegawa's technology, Rashidi may try to recover his investigations of a secret technology in his old workshop.

 

I know that the campaign is not over and there are still many questions to answer, but I can not help feeling that Yunru is transforming into a Mary Sue just to justify why there is a fourth side...

 

Edit. 

I believe that a revolution should not have a single leader. Yunru is intelligent, but he can not master all the skills that come with directing a revolution (she is a scientist, not a politician or a military strategist), she should be the brain but Rashidi is the one who gives the face for the revolt, is say the diplomat (Malver and his blade to negotiate) and Xiu Rong Wu brings experience military experience.

 

*Also you can replace the the Huntress with a Hijacker in "kill the messenger" and have justification with the participation of Rashidi.

Edited by Mr_DevilSmile, 02 May 2018 - 03:22 AM.

[Solais]

I actually like those ideas. Yunru having a respected general on her side makes a lot more sense than some barely a woman commanding such a respect with seemingly enormous army. (I mean, I know that the Foehn was supposed to be low in numbers, but all those paratroopers at the end of Nobody Home suggests otherwise.)

[Handepsilon]

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way she is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following her, what makes them follow her leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, her soldiers follow her general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of her, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

FTFY

[Hardric62]

 

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way he is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following him, what makes them follow his leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, his soldiers follow his general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of she, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

 

 

While I'm not disagreeing with you, I'd want to raise a point you could be forgetting: Just because they use Chinese weaponry doesn't mean they're Chinese regular forces. There is no shortage of rebels inside China, and probably  in other SSRs, and they may be a source of recruits as well, completing your proposition.

[Directive255]

I think the Quickshifters can be made to not auto-acquire or chase air units... especially fixed-wing aircrafts like Foxtrots, Smoke Bombers, Dybbuks, etc.?

 

Because sometimes these Quickshifters will teleport around when chasing air units, and sometimes get stuck, leaving them exposed to enemy attacks and making it difficult to give orders. (I don't know how to word it properly though, but anyone should get the idea easily)

[Mr_DevilSmile]

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way he is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following him, what makes them follow his leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, his soldiers follow his general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of she, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

 
While I'm not disagreeing with you, I'd want to raise a point you could be forgetting: Just because they use Chinese weaponry doesn't mean they're Chinese regular forces. There is no shortage of rebels inside China, and probably  in other SSRs, and they may be a source of recruits as well, completing your proposition.

 
But that is not explained at any report or the conversation, some simple changes that can be made would be: 
 
*In "Thread of Dread" the general Xiu Ron Wu could say something like: "We meet again on the battlefield, commander"
*In "Nobody Home" it can be said in the description of the mission that the general chinese has arranged his troops at the service of experimental AI. you can also make a mention of Rashidi about the importance of him reaching the meeting point according to the planned plans.
*In "Kill the messenger" replaces the Huntress for a Hijacker.
*You can also make another mention to the current condition of Rashidi in Tanted Empire.
 
Another change that I propose is to do a mini campaign on Rashidi and to be interspersed between the missions of Yunru. the escape of Rashidi will be narrated, besides filling some gaps in the story, Rashidi can go directly to the meeting point, recover an incomplete investigation or infiltrate to obtain some information, I just made an example of how it should be, do not pay much attention.

FOEHN ORIGINS:

1- Nobody Home
2- Rashidi 1
3- Kill the Messeger
4- Rashidi 2
5- Tainted Empire
6- Rashidi 3
7- Vision... - Final
 

Spoiler

[Tathmesh]

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way he is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following him, what makes them follow his leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, his soldiers follow his general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of she, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

While I'm not disagreeing with you, I'd want to raise a point you could be forgetting: Just because they use Chinese weaponry doesn't mean they're Chinese regular forces. There is no shortage of rebels inside China, and probably in other SSRs, and they may be a source of recruits as well, completing your proposition.

But that is not explained at any report or the conversation, some simple changes that can be made would be:

*In "Thread of Dread" the general Xiu Ron Wu could say something like: "We meet again on the battlefield, commander"
*In "Nobody Home" it can be said in the description of the mission that the general chinese has arranged his troops at the service of experimental AI. you can also make a mention of Rashidi about the importance of him reaching the meeting point according to the planned plans.
*In "Kill the messenger" replaces the Huntress for a Hijacker.
*You can also make another mention to the current condition of Rashidi in Tanted Empire.

Another change that I propose is to do a mini campaign on Rashidi and to be interspersed between the missions of Yunru. the escape of Rashidi will be narrated, besides filling some gaps in the story, Rashidi can go directly to the meeting point, recover an incomplete investigation or infiltrate to obtain some information, I just made an example of how it should be, do not pay much attention.

FOEHN ORIGINS:

1- Nobody Home
2- Rashidi 1
3- Kill the Messeger
4- Rashidi 2
5- Tainted Empire
6- Rashidi 3
7- Vision... - Final

Spoiler

These aren't bad points. We haven't been given any indication that Yunru is a strong leader.

Having Rashidi be the "face" of Foehn makes sense given his resume: years of experience as a terrorist/freedom fighter commander, years of experience commanding Scorpion Cell under Yuri. There's plenty of ways to justify Rashidi being a strong politician, an expert in fighting greater enemies with limited forces, and a skilled inventor.

Plus, the suggested new missions would depict Rashidi's storyline path as entirely separate from Yunru's path. So it might be easy to implement without revising too much of the current Foehn origins.

One thing though, I don't think Foehn needs a military commander. VOLKNET/the player kind of fits that role already. But I can see why a Chinese general would be needed to explain why a sixteen-year old girl is somehow amazing at leadership.

Edited by Tathmesh, 02 May 2018 - 10:49 PM.

[flack]

Take out the lines 

 

"Why am I not in the centurion yet?"

and

"Where is the centurion?!"

 

from Yunru's voice in foehn origin missions. It makes no sense she would say this because she saw first hand that the centurion was already destroyed.

Edited by flack, 03 May 2018 - 01:00 AM.

[TeslaCruiser]

 

I did not know whether to post this in #Campaign, Cooperative & Challenge Discussion or or if I should do it here.

 

I have a complaint with the origin story...

 

It's interesting that Yunru is taking center stage in the story, but I do not like the way he is doing it. There is no real justification for why part of the chinese forces are following him, what makes them follow his leadership? Only because she is right? If the one who really leads the forces that follow Yunru is the chinese general who appears in "Dragonstorm", it would make more sense, his soldiers follow his general, but the general trusts Yunru's plan and that is why he mobilizes his forces in favor of she, betraying her country in favor of a good for all. Not only does it justify why they follow her, but also enriches Yunru's character, lately it seems that she is a Mary Sue.

 

Another point that I would like to comment, I do not know what plans they have for Rashidi, but if they do not have big plans for him, I would like to see his participation in the revolt. he is a very important character, Yuri owes his arsenal to Rashidi's ingenuity, if not, it just would simply use technology stolen from Soviet and Allied. One idea I came up with is that both Yunru and Rashidi are on their way to the meeting point in the sea of ​​Bering, so the origin missions can focus on both trips, from two different points on the map, while Yunru travels to Japan To recover Kanegawa's technology, Rashidi may try to recover his investigations of a secret technology in his old workshop.

 

I know that the campaign is not over and there are still many questions to answer, but I can not help feeling that Yunru is transforming into a Mary Sue just to justify why there is a fourth side...

 

Edit. 

I believe that a revolution should not have a single leader. Yunru is intelligent, but he can not master all the skills that come with directing a revolution (she is a scientist, not a politician or a military strategist), she should be the brain but Rashidi is the one who gives the face for the revolt, is say the diplomat (Malver and his blade to negotiate) and Xiu Rong Wu brings experience military experience.

 

*Also you can replace the the Huntress with a Hijacker in "kill the messenger" and have justification with the participation of Rashidi.

finally some constructive criticism about this nonesense
my aproach tho this issue is to ignore lore all together since it does not make any sense, i´m not a big fan of singlepayer missions so it is easy for me

 

finally some constructive criticism about this nonesense
my aproach tho this issue is to ignore lore all together since it does not make any sense, hope developers try some more mature ideas since ra2 does not belongs to them to degenerate it like this, at least ra2 was funny

[Derxwna Kapsyla]

Take out the lines 

 

"Why am I not in the centurion yet?"

and

"Where is the centurion?!"

 

from Yunru's voice in foehn origin missions. It makes no sense she would say this because she saw first hand that the centurion was already destroyed.

 

I'd also suggest the lines about her being 17 be removed, since at that point she's 19

[Handepsilon]

Seems like so nitpicky. They'd have to edit soundmo.ini just to make a new list for those voices

[Mr_DevilSmile]

finally some constructive criticism about this nonesense
my aproach tho this issue is to ignore lore all together since it does not make any sense, hope developers try some more mature ideas since ra2 does not belongs to them to degenerate it like this, at least ra2 was funny

The story seemed to go well until the introduction of foehn, I do not know if foehn was planned or not before 3.0 but I guess it was not. It feels forced its history. 

 

I am interested in the mod exactly for the campaign, because it is a good challenge and also interesting. I've never been attracted to the multiplayer, although one of its great attractions is that, although there's is no accounting for taste.

 

Seems like so nitpicky. They'd have to edit soundmo.ini just to make a new list for those voices

 Can it be eliminated as it was done with Libra in Blood Dance? It does not contribute anything and has discrepancies with the story.

[Solais]

I have no problems with the existence of Foehn and Yunru being one its leaders, but it does feel a little bit "out of the blue". This is why I wish that their Origins campaign to be extended to 12 missions. Epsilon needed 12 missions for their backstory to be well fleshed out as well, and I'd like to see that with Foehn too, instead of "welp here's Celestial Being led by a barely old enough girl out of the blue without much explanation". I mean sure, at this point a third of the Soviet campaign is technically part of the Foehn origin story, but it still feels "off".

 

Though I guess that the "main" Foehn origin story would be not where it -came- from, but what it -becomes- during the possible timeskip between Act 2 and 3.

Edited by Solais, 03 May 2018 - 08:33 AM.

[Handepsilon]

Oh right. There was Dance of Blood and at one point, the deploy voiceover is still there. I haven't tested if Soundmo values are editable in the map yet.

 

There will be more campaign before Vision of the Distant Future. I think Speeder mentioned that somewhere

Edited by Handepsilon, 03 May 2018 - 11:01 AM.

[NorthFireZ]

I have no problems with the existence of Foehn and Yunru being one its leaders, but it does feel a little bit "out of the blue". This is why I wish that their Origins campaign to be extended to 12 missions. Epsilon needed 12 missions for their backstory to be well fleshed out as well, and I'd like to see that with Foehn too, instead of "welp here's Celestial Being led by a barely old enough girl out of the blue without much explanation". I mean sure, at this point a third of the Soviet campaign is technically part of the Foehn origin story, but it still feels "off".
 
Though I guess that the "main" Foehn origin story would be not where it -came- from, but what it -becomes- during the possible timeskip between Act 2 and 3.

I too would like to see more missions for Foehn origins or a full on Foehn campaign. Considering there was 0 technological advancements or anything that made the revolt feel like an actual revolt in the 3 released origin story. Just.... teal China for now. I’m not even asking for much, maybe a Knightframe here and there. Maybe a mission to rescue the first Foehn MCV, idk...

[DoctorEvil]

In this case I have to say how well the character of Libra and how poorly the character of Yunru are written. Please keep in mind that this is just my opinion.

 

Besides some other flaws I've noticed does Yunru fulfill a lot of the "Mary Sue"-cliché. Just to describe it: A Mary Sue is an overpowered (not gameplay-wise) and perfectly good character, with no explanation given for that power level. A Mary Sue is instantly liked by all the established characters, yet at the same time he/she doesn't have much of a personality. Mary Sue's feel often like some sort of wish-fulfilling and are often an attempt to implement a perfect version of the character's author (like it is in many FanFictions). Besides are typical Mary Sues never embarrased or show any form of weakness, causing them to never fail even the hardest challenges. 

 

In case of Yunru: She is an extremely intelligent young woman, who is able to create powerful weaponry within a short time. Besides that does Yunru have the Chinese army behind her up to a point, where she gets some kind of private army (the Foehn Revolt). 

Personally I do not have a problem with these traits and the idea where this is going - I simply don't like the way it was approached. There were so many puzzle pieces that got omited. Why do all of those man follow a 19-years of teenage-girl? Does she show so much charisma? Etc.

Mr_DevilSmile and Solais already pointed that out very well, so I don't need to write it again. 

 

Another thing I don't really like about Yunru is the way she lacks of weaknesses. I think she might be a bit comparable to Tony Stark / Iron Man. Tony always was intelligent and a great creator of warmachines, yet from the peak of his arrogance he fell to a point, where his point of view changed drastically over time. 

In case of Yunru there is a huge potential for weaknesses. While just being a teenager, I highly doubt that everybody will follow her - many man in the military will follow others, who have experience. There should be man, who ridiculate her. Also even if the people trust her (for whatever reason), onto her shoulders rest the hopes of her close allies to be the only ones, who can repel the plans of Yuri - the level of stress this must create is for sure way above the level she can manage to handle. 

 

The last thing I have to criticize about Yunru is her "pacifism". Isn't it a bit weird to declare yourself as a pacifist when you invent and build weapons? I know that there is no way to defeat Yuri peacefully, but as far as I can remember did Yunru already create weapons for the Chinese army, when they fought the Allies.  

 

 

In contrast to Yunru, I have to admit that the character of Libra is really well written. In fact Libra is so believable, that I really don't want to be near her. The voice actress of Libra did a great job here as well.

Even though Libra is insanely powerful, there is an explanation for her power (the CAS) and still she isn't invulnerable like shown in Blood Rage. I also like the small hints over the story, where people report of experiments on a strong female psychic. What were these experiments? What did they do to her?

Libra seems to be a sad human being that got tortured and withstood inhuman experiments with the goal to seize her down to an emotionless weapon. A sad background story. 

I really hope to see more of her in the future.

[flack]

Just wondering any chance there will be single player challenge maps?