427 replies to this topic

[PACER]

 

Right now especially SOVIETS struggle too much against early foehn rushes.

As everyone knows, conscripts merely tickle foehn their units early on and even sentry guns are hardly able to do anything. Just 4 lancers will be able to kill a barracks, power and a miner with ease while knightframes deal with soviets their only option, conscripts. Conscripts are limited to their buildspeed and their limited brain capacity to get a better a gun. If you don't want to nerf knightframes and lancers more, soviets will still struggle too much with foehn their early rushes. That's why, yes. I actually suggest a conscript buff. Just make them cost 80 and atleast give their peashooter an upgrade. Or even just their attack speed. Right now, they actually have to spend more than the opponent foehn to actually hold the attack, since a thing as "defender advantage" doesn't exist when playing as soviets against foehn.

Also, make the lancer do less damage against buildings. It's too insane that 4 just lancers are pretty much guarenteed to kill both a miner and first power plant/barracks during a rush or even just with a SCOUT of 4 lancers. This will also solve the problem of sentry guns being completely useless against foehn during rushes.

 

How about making battle suits less resilient against anti armor weapons? Just like their cyborg brothers in TS...

[pikachu11]

Do I have to download 3.3.1 before 3.3.2, or does 3.3.2 include both patches?

Edited by pikachu11, 22 May 2017 - 08:16 PM.

[Speeder]

I'd also like to ask for an increase buildtime on the MADMAN. It's suppose to be a last resort kind of unit, but every Hailhead player uses the thing like a core unit, often bringing the unit out the moment they get tier 3.

 

M.A.D.M.A.N. is not supposed to be a last resort unit.

 

3.3.2 manual update patch will contain all updates.

[pikachu11]

Cool.

[NorthFireZ]

So..... you mean to tell me it was intended to have the MADMAN as a mainstay of the Hailhead army just like how the Centuion is core to the Chinese army, even though for China and HQ their epic unit comes at a cost in some aspect of gameplay such as a spamable Artiliery unit for China and of course the slow movement speed.
Hail head has no such handicaps..... they have spammable arty units, instant infantry kill, a T3 monster that can't be mind controlled, two hero units that heal each other at an insane rate, bounty, and on top of that, they can just cheese 1v1s by building what is essentially a better super weapon on wheels, keep it alive indefinitely using minermites, and end the game at a point where most people would just be getting three or four monster tanks out?

The Mutually of the Mutally Assured Destruction part doesn't seem right here.

[Tyhednus]

It all makes sense now. The madman is meant to be built as the core of your army. Haihead excels at fighting hard at close range and with their close range and high damage output, Haihead can escort the madman to where it is supposed to go. Basically, Haihead is the escort the payload faction with their high dps and short range.

[DarkEmblem]

 two hero units that heal each other at an insane rate

Thanks for reminding me of something I had yet to adress.

 

REMOVE THEIR HEALING. Give them like a 10-30% armor buff instead. 

 

Fin DECIMATES infantry while Alize does the same to tanks. I've had alize kill three tyrants in a SINGLE shot!

This is of course completely ridiculous. While alize does a load of damage and pretty much instakills a few 2000+ tanks in aoe, Fin actually instakills pretty much all infantry that dares to come even near them.

 

Not just that, but they regen insanely fast when they are near eachother. This actually counts as a super unit. Destroys infantry, destroys vehicles, stealth detection & super regen.

What is epsilon going to do? The best they can do is actually wait for viruses, which are even a higher tech than finalize.

Why wait for viruses? Dunes just get destroyed by fin, gatling tanks get completely decimated by alize and even if a few of them get there, they'll just regen insanely quickly. You can't use Dyabukk attackers either, since they don't do burst damage, finalize will basically regen every single shot.

Suggested tweaks:

 

1: -Remove regeneration, replace with 10-40% armor buff (depending how close they are or when that is not possible, keeping it at 25% would be best)

    -Slightly reduce Fin ammo & reduce Alize AoE.

 

2: - Keep regeneration but reduce it by 25-50%

    - Reduce Fin his ammo count & reload speed, reduce Alize AoE.

 

3. - Keep regeneration

    - Lower health of both Fin & Alize, Reduce Fin's ammo & reload speed, reduce Alize AoE.

Edited by DarkEmblem, 22 May 2017 - 11:42 PM.

[TeslaCruiser]

100% agree with DarkEmblem.
I just want to add an anecdotal; while Last Bastion is hard to use and Coronia can be tricky (if you don't use immortal floaters/flying memes anyways) Haihead is a skill simulator for bad players.  I can tell you, I've faced many times weak players (bellow average) that suddenly become much harder to play against because of this sub-faction.

[Hmshark]

* fixed: Tech SAM Site, SAM Bunker, Oxidizer, Flak Cannon can no longer be forced to fire into the water

 

Did you fix them from force firing trees?

 

Also, why doesnt Alanqa Skystation fire at lifted units from zorbfloaters?

 

I also agree with DarkEmblem's suggestions. The units he mentioned definitely need nerfs/buffs.

Edited by Hmshark, 23 May 2017 - 01:26 AM.

[codyfun123]

Also, why doesnt Alanqa Skystation fire at lifted units from zorbfloaters?

Here's the only instance of realism in MO that will ever be confirmed: The Alanqa's lore is that it shoves aircraft down into the ground, rather than damaging their armor. Thus, there is no reason it would do anything to actual vehicles.

 

Hitting them into the ground for limited damage won't be a thing because the engine is limited.

[TeslaCruiser]

Ok, conscripts and 3.3.2
First, we are getting uniform ranges for the T1 infantry killers: Jackal, Tigr/FlakTrack, Gattling and IFV... (GI IFV still 6.5 for some reason)
Second, both Tigr/Flack  Buff (+0.5 range +3 ROF) and Knightframe range reduction (-0.5) are good news.
Third, as others have pointed out, conscripts have no chance against Knightframes, the reasons for this have been told many times (training times, range -still 1.5 dif in 3.3.2, Knightframe AoE and dog immunity, same speed)
So the result is, in 3.3.2 you should use your usual conscript spam + some Tigrs +terror drones + sentry guns to fight an infantry rush... hope it works.
Also, foxtrots will be a bit stronger against foehn infantry by having more chances to direct hit them (and cheaper).
Dustdevil can help the damn conscripts but they enter the game a bit later.

Buff to conscripts still needed? I need the patch to see :V

[CLAlstar]

Tesla, remember the pyro price drop. I consider it a recompensation for lack of concruipt buffs, since Pyros can clean houses way more efficiently than conscripts. And with good cover (Borillos, T1 MBT') to soak initial damage thery can be damn overwhelming.

[pikachu11]

- nerf: Irritator confusion ray range decreased from 10 to 9, price decreased to $1350

Shouldn't this be separated into this?

- nerf: Irritator confusion ray range decreased from 10 to 9
- buff: Irritator price decreased to $1350

Edited by pikachu11, 23 May 2017 - 11:51 AM.

[NorthFireZ]

G.I IFV gets .5 range more to out range GGIs

Allies are their own counters

[TeslaCruiser]

Tesla, remember the pyro price drop. I consider it a recompensation for lack of concruipt buffs, since Pyros can clean houses way more efficiently than conscripts. And with good cover (Borillos, T1 MBT') to soak initial damage thery can be damn overwhelming.

Yes, of course. But having to rely on Tier 2 to fight a Tier 1 army still bad. We obviously have diverse strengths across Tiers and Factions and I'm perfectly fine with that but this could be much better by doing some minor changes in the conscripts stats (a bit more firepower and a bit more price).

 

Actually, I have another suggestion: Spotlight for Tigrs/Flacktrack, Spotlight is a nice feature and while being soviet technology we have no units using it.
This way conscripts could be a bit more useful + a reward for good unit control. For this ability, the unit price should be increased a bit (+50?)

If someone doesn't know spotlight works like this:
 Units marked by the Sensor Tower's spotlight will take 10% more damage.

[TeslaCruiser]

G.I IFV gets .5 range more to out range GGIs

Allies are their own counters

Then all factions need +0.5 to kill GGI >:v

GGI is slow and need deploy to fight properly, he is fine

GI IFV is just a bit 2 good but is a minor issue

[Tathmesh]

So..... you mean to tell me it was intended to have the MADMAN as a mainstay of the Hailhead army just like how the Centuion is core to the Chinese army, even though for China and HQ their epic unit comes at a cost in some aspect of gameplay such as a spamable Artiliery unit for China and of course the slow movement speed.
Hail head has no such handicaps..... they have spammable arty units, instant infantry kill, a T3 monster that can't be mind controlled, two hero units that heal each other at an insane rate, bounty, and on top of that, they can just cheese 1v1s by building what is essentially a better super weapon on wheels, keep it alive indefinitely using minermites, and end the game at a point where most people would just be getting three or four monster tanks out?

The Mutually of the Mutally Assured Destruction part doesn't seem right here.

I think Speeder means that you're not suppose to build it when you're falling behind severely and the enemy is right at your base.

MADMAN is probably the worst possible unit to be building if you're looking for a comeback.

"Oh man, my opponent's army is at my base, I better build a MADMAN and deploy it. Hurr durrhead"

[Nicholas Chau]

about the stolen tech requirements, since you need to infiltrate BOTH battle lab/cloud piercer and construction yard to get stolen tech units what else would infiltrating the battle lab/cloud piercer do now beside that?

[Speeder]

Nothing.

[Nicholas Chau]

Nothing.

ok just to know because i rather the 4 armies don't get stolen tech infantry -_-