3 replies to this topic

[Reshy]

Is there any way to restore the base game's damage scaling?  Most units had an increase in hit points which is fine, but in addition to that most units now also do far less damage to 80% of other units, making each individual unit far less versatile.  Basic infantry are basically unusable as they don't even get full damage against other infantry, before even accounting for them having more HP.  It also makes the no-build campaigns a bit of a slog trying to guess which unit is effective against what structure, since I can't exactly view that information easily without having to reference the big menu of stats.

Edited by Reshy, 12 August 2021 - 08:08 AM.

[mevitar]

This mod is not RA2/YR, and the point of making units less effective against certain targets was to prevent One-Unit-To-Win-Them-All scenarios (although i guess one could argue that certain units for certain factions still fall into that role). I also disagree on basic infantry being bad, they are used thorough the entire game in multiplayer, unlike RA2/YR. Especially anti-tank/air infantry. Only Soviets tend to have "bad infantry" problems.

 

If you want to know what is good against what kind of target, unit profiles on MO web page roughly (although not perfectly) provides that information.

Edited by mevitar, 27 August 2021 - 09:54 PM.

[Reshy]

This mod is not RA2/YR, and the point of making units less effective against certain targets was to prevent One-Unit-To-Win-Them-All scenarios (although i guess one could argue that certain units for certain factions still fall into that role). I also disagree on basic infantry being bad, they are used thorough the entire game in multiplayer, unlike RA2/YR. Especially anti-tank/air infantry. Only Soviets tend to have "bad infantry" problems.

 

If you want to know what is good against what kind of target, unit profiles on MO web page roughly (although not perfectly) provides that information.

Are you talking the advanced infantry or the basic infantry?  Because the basic infantry (esp soviets) are nigh unusable.  Regarding the one unit to win them all scenario, pretty much any unit could be used to win a mission in red alert 2/YR, that is not the case in this game.  Units in general feel far weaker and less effective on the whole.  They go from trading poorly to trading at a massive negative exponent.  It's bad enough that it can even bug the AI with how little units do, causing them to spaz out trying to attack too many units at once.  It's just a bit much.  Most units tend to only be effective against one other type of unit, and then they load foam darts versus everything else.  It's on the whole not a very satisifying experience watching a tank and an infantry impotently fire foam at each other for a solid minute till one of them dies.

 

Red Alert 2/Yuri's Revenge at least had a dynamic where most units were fairly effective against most other types of units, with a handful of bad matchups which they performed below par, but not harshly so.  It was a game of soft counters, versus the current game of hard counters.  I've seen the game compared to Starcraft, of all things, despite how in starcraft even the basic units you produce are still able to kill any other unit they attack, they don't impotently smack them for fractional damage.

Edited by Reshy, 02 September 2021 - 05:52 AM.

[Handepsilon]

This mod is not RA2/YR

I'm pretty sure that's already enough to not compare it to RA2/YR. I'm not sure who'd compare it to Starcraft, and I'm pretty sure when they said so, they didn't mean the balance as whole. I'd say in terms of balance it's a little bit closer to RA3 instead, but doubling down more on the hard countering.

 

 

Regarding the one unit to win them all scenario, pretty much any unit could be used to win a mission in red alert 2/YR, that is not the case in this game.

Which is pretty much the goal I guess? The mod was designed so that you do NOT rely on just one type of unit. If you want to play a game where you can just pump one/two kinds of unit of your liking to win the scenario, then this mod ain't for you.

 

Also, I'm guessing that Mevitar was implying about how GIs in vanilla RA2 just demolishes everything, how Prism Tanks just blows every kind of units up or how most competitive Soviet play in YR always picks Iraq and always opts for Rhino spam... among other shenanigans.

Edited by Handepsilon, 03 September 2021 - 07:15 AM.