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#41 Shine On

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 09:07 AM

Yeah but I dont use state heathcare or education so thats why I want to pay lower taxes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



**Cough cough** What about people like me who depend on the "state" healthcare systems to treat their cancer?!?

But i suppose you don't care as long as you get lower taxes :blink:



And what Hybrid said about Howard is Sooo true!
You can't expect Blair to be able to fix the mess the Conservatives left the country in instantly. Thats impossible.

It's like if you buy an old clapped out, rusty car. You can't bring it up to "Good as New" quality instantly. You have to do it bit by bit and so it takes time.

With the amount of mess the Thatcher and Crew left behind, it'll take at least another two sessions in power in order to get the country back to something of how it used to be ;)

Edited by Xeno, 10 March 2005 - 09:13 AM.

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#42 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 04:25 PM

Yes but when your family earns over a certain limit and 40% is taken away you would be not that pleased. And I didnt mean to offend Xeno, the NHS could be one of the best heathcare systems in the world if properly managed, people should pay for something like the meals so they are not always crap. The thing that gets me angry is people who just stay at home and watch Trisha on their widescreen tv in their council house and they are just living off benifits and can't be bothered to work.

Edited by chemical ali, 10 March 2005 - 04:49 PM.

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#43 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 05:19 PM

Yes but when your family earns over a certain limit and 40% is taken away you would be not that pleased. And I didnt mean to offend Xeno, the NHS could be one of the best heathcare systems in the world if properly managed, people should pay for something like the meals so they are not always crap. The thing that gets me angry is people who just stay at home and watch Trisha on their widescreen tv in their council house and they are just living off benifits and can't be bothered to work.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


People who earn more than 100,000grand/year income (thats 1 person, not the combined) would get taxed more under the Liberals. I feel thats fair. A decent wage that is easy to live on in the UK i would say is 50grand/year.

The ones that are in council houses pay council tax, and i think i've just realised why Blair imposed that tax. To get them into work. I still think its unfair. I feel people should be given 3 months to find a job, if its apparent they haven't even tried then their benefits should be cut slightly so it makes them think about getting a job. I do agree with you there ali, people who live off benefit just becuase they are lazy should be forced to get a job imo, but the WHOLE working class should not suffer for that minority. You have to remember the middle classes and upper classes are minority groups compared to the working classes, just because one working class guy is lazy you can't say they all are. Many of them work amazingly hard.

Ali go get a job somewhere in a warehouse on £4.75/hour and see if you can work to move out of your house. You cannot.

The British NHS is one of the best healthcare systems in the world, you'd be amazed. America, which is the richest country in the world, has very poor health care. The NHS just needs more cleaners, needs to be expanded (bigger hospitals) and more doctors. This is where the conservative GCSE system fails us. It stops hundreds of potential students becoming doctors because they were unable to cope with the pressure of 15+ exams and get stuck down the pits for the rest of their lives because of the patheticly poor system.

#44 Mastermind

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 05:57 PM

I don't know. The US may have a poor health care system overall, but for those with the ability to pay, it's still top rate. We just don't offer the same level of care to everyone. I think our system needs reform, but it still does offer excellent medical care. I pay about $600 per term here at MIT, and a I have complete medical coverage.
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#45 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:01 PM

Yeah, but many companies in the US don't include health care. Doctors are ridiculously costly. Over the counter stuff is pretty cheap though, and i found most of the US drugs better than the UK ones. I had the flu when i was over their christmas. I tried some powder that dissolves in hot water and you wouldn't have even known i had the flu. I was impressed. lol. The ones in the UK over the counter are terrible. Lemsip. Usually have to take 2 or 3 to feel the effects and that is said to be dangerous lol.

#46 Mastermind

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:04 PM

Half the problem with the cost of healthcare is the outrageous costs for doctors. They have to pay a huge amount for malpractice insurance against claims. It is unbelievable, both the amount that they pay, and the amount awarded in damages. To pay for that, they have to charge huge rates. It's a nasty spiral, and something will have to be done about that sooner or later.
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Well, when it comes to writing an expository essay about counter-insurgent tactics, I'm of the old school. First you tell them how you're going to kill them. Then you kill them. Then you tell them how you just killed them.

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#47 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:12 PM

America should try install its own NHS. It will cost billions as it did in the UK when we installed it in 1945 - 1948. Free heatlh service for anyone, accident and emergance, paid by all tax payers. This means George W has to stop pushing though tax cuts and start taxing the rich again. I think it would be good for America. It has the money, it just needs to use it correctly.

#48 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:15 PM

America is one of the few western countries which dosnt have a public health service, and MIT fees look very cheap then for a term, cheaper than my school.
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#49 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:18 PM

It is cheap. To go to uni here it would end up about 10grand + after just 2 years.

#50 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:25 PM

And the rest due to the ridiculous house prices, if I go to Med school I will have less than others due to funding, you cant cut back if you want to go out and get pissed or stoned.
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“Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.”

"In a man-to-man fight, the winner is he who has one more round in his magazine." -Erwin Rommel

Economic Left/Right: 10.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.56

#51 Comrade Kal

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:26 PM

Exactly, Xeno. Ali would let everybody else suffer just to get a bit less money taken from the already vast amounts of wealth he gets. The rich should be taxed more, and the poor a bit less.
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#52 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:28 PM

Your rich proberly richer than me, and you have the mind of a communist.
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“Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.”

"In a man-to-man fight, the winner is he who has one more round in his magazine." -Erwin Rommel

Economic Left/Right: 10.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.56

#53 Comrade Kal

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:33 PM

Because I care about people other than myself. Where politics are concerned, I look further than my own doorstep when I consider who it will affect.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the system in which people go to university. Newspapers and people who have absolutely no connection with or knowledge of the system say that students will be in serious debt in later life, but it's more than enough money to live respectably and put you through university. It is NOT enough money to get blind drunk every night. You can't expect the government to fund you if you drink the money they gave you in the first place.

Edited by Lord Kal, 10 March 2005 - 06:35 PM.

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"To be governed is tragic, to govern is pathetic."

#54 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:57 PM

Because I care about people other than myself. Where politics are concerned, I look further than my own doorstep when I consider who it will affect.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the system in which people go to university. Newspapers and people who have absolutely no connection with or knowledge of the system say that students will be in serious debt in later life, but it's more than enough money to live respectably and put you through university. It is NOT enough money to get blind drunk every night. You can't expect the government to fund you if you drink the money they gave you in the first place.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I never said there was anything wrong with the univerisity system, i just think the tution fees are a joke. The schools and colleges need a major revamp and fast. Unverisities need to be bigger, accept more students, this should allow more people to get in from whatever back ground they are from, and those ones who bitch because a person with less money got in rather than them should just be kicked out altogether. I hate those types of people, they really piss me off.

#55 Comrade Kal

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 06:59 PM

But if you speak to any responsible student they'll tell you they've had no problems with money. It's only the people that squander all of their money who get in trouble.
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#56 Tom

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 07:02 PM

Yeah i guess, i have seen the bunch of idiots who spend every night drunk when they could be working to help pay the debts it will leave them.

#57 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 07:15 PM

Well those who put themselves into comars shouldnt get funding, your ment to have a good time what else are you meant to do?

Edited by chemical ali, 10 March 2005 - 07:27 PM.

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"In a man-to-man fight, the winner is he who has one more round in his magazine." -Erwin Rommel

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#58 Comrade Kal

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 07:24 PM

Into commas? We're talking about university, not grammar school.

Utterly dreadful jokes aside, the money is there to pay for your education. It's just like real life - spenidng all of your money on alcohol does you no good.
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#59 chemical ali

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 07:28 PM

So you are saying you will not have a drink at Uni, well wont you be the social one, and you may be an admin on your own forum!
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“Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.”

"In a man-to-man fight, the winner is he who has one more round in his magazine." -Erwin Rommel

Economic Left/Right: 10.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.56

#60 Comrade Kal

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Posted 10 March 2005 - 07:32 PM

I said i'm not getting pissed every night and squandering my loan on drugs. Anyway, surely you can just get your father to send you extra cash, Ali. What self-respecting father could do more than pay for his son to drink his way through university and fail everything?
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