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Additions to the nuclear club?


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#21 Silent_Killa

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 02:46 AM

Iraq was doing fine? Right... there's video footage of how they were doing.
http://www.worldnetd...RTICLE_ID=39045

But you can choose to renounce one. Remember a certain Austrian who took power in Germany and broke a certain restrictive and UNFAIR treaty? rolleyes.gif

You see, that particular event is what happens when people try to shove their noses and/or dicks in other countries' affairs. You get resentment. You get hatred. You get more war.

Bad example. You're saying that Hitler shouldn't have been removed then?

You still have more than everybody else put together.

As a result of saving Europes ass during the cold war.

Ok. So what do you suggest? The USA is ALLOWED to nuke whoever the fuck it wants without fear of reprisal. I'm guessing the USA hasn't signed this treaty you keep referring to. Now I wonder why that might be. rolleyes.gif What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

The US hasn't used a nuke since WW II.

If they USE their bombs in anger, the USA could turn the entire nation to glass without a second thought.
What if the USA ends up ruled by a psychopath whose favourite phrase is "Death to the Arabs!" Oh. Wait. It is. Sorry.

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1) The USA isn't a cop. 2) How can one classify an entire nation as a 'murderer'? Who did Brazil declare war on last? rolleyes.gif

An entire nation? No. A countries government? Yes.
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#22 Mastermind

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 03:53 AM

TREATIES
http://dictionary.re...search?q=treaty

It's a legal document, you can't just ignore it because you get your panties in a bunch.

But you can choose to renounce one. Remember a certain Austrian who took power in Germany and broke a certain restrictive and UNFAIR treaty? :dry:

You see, that particular event is what happens when people try to shove their noses and/or dicks in other countries' affairs. You get resentment. You get hatred. You get more war.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I must have missed this before. It wasn't the US that wanted the Treaty of Versaille to include huge reparations and such. Wilson had his points, and Europe didn't like them. Don't blame us for you fucking up your affairs. And my political science professors here say that the whole "Versaille was horrible and unfair" is just a revisionist history pushed by Germans to justify their breaking it. It wasn't nearly as horrible as everyone thinks it to be. And are you really trying to use Hitler as a GOOD example of something?
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Well, when it comes to writing an expository essay about counter-insurgent tactics, I'm of the old school. First you tell them how you're going to kill them. Then you kill them. Then you tell them how you just killed them.

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#23 ComradeJ

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 08:48 AM

But thank you for a nice biased version of history.  I always love those.  And we didn't just bomb Afghanistan flat for the terror camps.  We also helped rebel groups oust the ruling regime and replaced it with a democracy.  But that doesn't sound as good as "Bombed flat for some terror camps" now does it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


800 Afghan deaths this year, they must love that. Everyone in the middle east has an AK-47 at home, they could've done something if they hated the government.

As a result of saving Europes ass during the cold war.


You created the Cold War...

The US hasn't used a nuke since WW II.


And the other countries haven't ever used nukes. So it's still more.

An entire nation? No. A countries government? Yes.


Yes, this is confusing. You see, we in Europe have something called democracy, but don't make a mistake! It's not the same as your version of democracy. Here, we actually choose the government, as a nation. Interesting concept, isn't it?
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#24 Ash

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 02:33 PM

But thank you for a nice biased version of history.  I always love those.  And we didn't just bomb Afghanistan flat for the terror camps.  We also helped rebel groups oust the ruling regime and replaced it with a democracy.  But that doesn't sound as good as "Bombed flat for some terror camps" now does it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Nevertheless, you still interfered in somebody else's business. Let them sort out their own damn problems.

@Silent Killa: I never said that we shouldn't have removed Hitler. For a kickoff, he was invading every other country under the sun. England was next on the list and was already the victim of a bombing campaign, so we had every right to fight. America was on the other side of the Atlantic. By all means take down Japan because they attacked you...but I do wonder why the European war should've concerned you. Then again, Hitler did declare war on the US, (despite the fact the US were miles overseas out of reach) so it was justified. Essentially your attacks on Germany were counterstrikes for attacks on the US which never took place, therefore lol.


Saving our ass during the cold war...what a laugh. As ComJ said, USA and Russia CREATED that cold war.


Dropping the nukes on Japan, despite what all the documentaries say, cannot be clear-cut said to be justified. Some say Japan was already surrendering, others say they weren't. Nevertheless, 100,000 civilians (this isn't military target bombing, the same as almost none of the pacific bombing campaigns were military targets...they were major cities made of paper, bombed with incendiaries) were wiped out in an instant in Hiroshima alone. This is, as I say, before you get to the soldiers. For them, it's an occupational hazard. General rules of warfare are that you don't shoot civilians...

And I've never dissed Bush's lineage, or where he's from. Frankly, I can barely tell a Texan from an Iowan, or from any other bloody state, or from a Canadian. However what I DO diss is his unjustifiable wars. Guess who'll benefit from them? US contractors! Iraqi and Afghani civilians might get their illusion of 'freedom' and 'democracy', but as far as I've been able to make out they're going to now be run by US puppets. Reminds me of South Vietnam...the guy who destroyed Buddhist temples, but was allowed to stay in power purely because he was anti-Communist. I forget his name, but that's what it reminds me of.

#25 ComradeJ

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 02:53 PM

Dropping the nukes on Japan, despite what all the documentaries say, cannot be clear-cut said to be justified. Some say Japan was already surrendering, others say they weren't. Nevertheless, 100,000 civilians (this isn't military target bombing, the same as almost none of the pacific bombing campaigns were military targets...they were major cities made of paper, bombed with incendiaries) were wiped out in an instant in Hiroshima alone. This is, as I say, before you get to the soldiers. For them, it's an occupational hazard. General rules of warfare are that you don't shoot civilians...


Nobody tells you, but it was another commie-halting idea. The Soviets would fight on the Eastern front once Germany was down. However, the US realised that the Soviets had already brought a lot of Europe under their influence, and they didn't want it happening all over Asia. So they stopped the war as quick as they could, by dropping the bombs.

Iraqi and Afghani civilians might get their illusion of 'freedom' and 'democracy', but as far as I've been able to make out they're going to now be run by US puppets. Reminds me of South Vietnam...the guy who destroyed Buddhist temples, but was allowed to stay in power purely because he was anti-Communist. I forget his name, but that's what it reminds me of.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


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#26 Comrade Kal

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 04:15 PM

Exactly... the US are apparently extremely trustworthy when it comes to nuclear weapons, yet they're the only country in the world to have used one against an enemy.
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#27 Mastermind

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 08:00 PM

But thank you for a nice biased version of history.  I always love those.  And we didn't just bomb Afghanistan flat for the terror camps.  We also helped rebel groups oust the ruling regime and replaced it with a democracy.  But that doesn't sound as good as "Bombed flat for some terror camps" now does it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


800 Afghan deaths this year, they must love that. Everyone in the middle east has an AK-47 at home, they could've done something if they hated the government.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They were. It was called the Northern Alliance, and we helped them FINISH what they had started. But since America bashing is all the rage, people can just convieniently forget all the good stuff.
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#28 ComradeJ

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 09:37 PM

But thank you for a nice biased version of history.  I always love those.  And we didn't just bomb Afghanistan flat for the terror camps.  We also helped rebel groups oust the ruling regime and replaced it with a democracy.  But that doesn't sound as good as "Bombed flat for some terror camps" now does it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


800 Afghan deaths this year, they must love that. Everyone in the middle east has an AK-47 at home, they could've done something if they hated the government.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They were. It was called the Northern Alliance, and we helped them FINISH what they had started.


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Posted 12 August 2005 - 10:07 PM

Totalitarian regime, supported terrorists, human rights, blah, blah, blah...
(at work so I'm not logging in).

#30 ComradeJ

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 10:09 PM

Totalitarian regime, supported terrorists, human rights, blah, blah, blah...
(at work so I'm not logging in).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


And who exactly trained and supported the Taliban? Oh yeah, the same nation that supplied Saddam Hussein with WOMDs...
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#31 Silent_Killa

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Posted 13 August 2005 - 06:42 AM

You created the Cold War...

Saving our ass during the cold war...what a laugh. As ComJ said, USA and Russia CREATED that cold war.

Don't be stupid, read your history books. If the US hadn't been pointing those nukes at Russia, wherever you live, would currently be under Soviet control. You can also find how fun that was in your history books.

Dropping the nukes on Japan, despite what all the documentaries say, cannot be clear-cut said to be justified. Some say Japan was already surrendering, others say they weren't. Nevertheless, 100,000 civilians (this isn't military target bombing, the same as almost none of the pacific bombing campaigns were military targets...they were major cities made of paper, bombed with incendiaries) were wiped out in an instant in Hiroshima alone. This is, as I say, before you get to the soldiers. For them, it's an occupational hazard. General rules of warfare are that you don't shoot civilians...

I NEVER justified the use of nuclear weapons. I personally don't agree with intentionally targeting civilians under any circumstances, however, you must consider that the Japanese were willing to drive a plane into an aircraft carrier, do you think they'd really surrender that easy? Also consider that this wasn't a day of precision guided ammunition, around 50,000,000 civilians died during that war.

And the other countries haven't ever used nukes. So it's still more.

The US just developed the technology first. Whoever built it first, would have used it first, that can be said about any country involved in WW II.

Yes, this is confusing. You see, we in Europe have something called democracy, but don't make a mistake! It's not the same as your version of democracy. Here, we actually choose the government, as a nation. Interesting concept, isn't it?

You see, the problem in this topic is that I'm using facts, you are not.

And I've never dissed Bush's lineage, or where he's from. Frankly, I can barely tell a Texan from an Iowan, or from any other bloody state, or from a Canadian. However what I DO diss is his unjustifiable wars. Guess who'll benefit from them? US contractors! Iraqi and Afghani civilians might get their illusion of 'freedom' and 'democracy', but as far as I've been able to make out they're going to now be run by US puppets. Reminds me of South Vietnam...the guy who destroyed Buddhist temples, but was allowed to stay in power purely because he was anti-Communist. I forget his name, but that's what it reminds me of.

There was a doctorine that stated that the US would provide aid to ANY country resisting communism. Puppet governments? Would a puppet government be getting warm and cozy with Iran? Again, the lack of actual facts disturbs me.

Nobody tells you, but it was another commie-halting idea. The Soviets would fight on the Eastern front once Germany was down. However, the US realised that the Soviets had already brought a lot of Europe under their influence, and they didn't want it happening all over Asia. So they stopped the war as quick as they could, by dropping the bombs.

Once again, that's an opinion.

And who exactly trained and supported the Taliban? Oh yeah, the same nation that supplied Saddam Hussein with WOMDs...

The Taliban was to fight the old USSR. Trust me, the Taliban ain't shit in comparison.
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#32 ComradeJ

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Posted 13 August 2005 - 11:14 AM

You created the Cold War...

Saving our ass during the cold war...what a laugh. As ComJ said, USA and Russia CREATED that cold war.

Don't be stupid, read your history books. If the US hadn't been pointing those nukes at Russia, wherever you live, would currently be under Soviet control. You can also find how fun that was in your history books.


My history books say that it was all nicely divided after World War II, and that nukes didn't come into that. The Soviets still didn't get much for defeating 7/8 of the German men and equipment, but I don't care too much about that.

I NEVER justified the use of nuclear weapons.  I personally don't agree with intentionally targeting civilians under any circumstances, however, you must consider that the Japanese were willing to drive a plane into an aircraft carrier, do you think they'd really surrender that easy?  Also consider that this wasn't a day of precision guided ammunition, around 50,000,000 civilians died during that war.


Yeah, you need laserguided bombs to know a city is full of innocent men, women and children...

And the other countries haven't ever used nukes. So it's still more.

The US just developed the technology first. Whoever built it first, would have used it first, that can be said about any country involved in WW II.


So you're bringing evil stuff into this world, and that gives you the right to use them once? I'm confused.

Yes, this is confusing. You see, we in Europe have something called democracy, but don't make a mistake! It's not the same as your version of democracy. Here, we actually choose the government, as a nation. Interesting concept, isn't it?

You see, the problem in this topic is that I'm using facts, you are not.


You can't find an argument against my point ^_____^

There was a doctorine that stated that the US would provide aid to ANY country resisting communism.


The problem was that they saw anti-communist minorities as a whole nation...

Nobody tells you, but it was another commie-halting idea. The Soviets would fight on the Eastern front once Germany was down. However, the US realised that the Soviets had already brought a lot of Europe under their influence, and they didn't want it happening all over Asia. So they stopped the war as quick as they could, by dropping the bombs.

Once again, that's an opinion.


An unbiased one from my history book though, so it probably has a higher truth-value than American propaganda.

And who exactly trained and supported the Taliban? Oh yeah, the same nation that supplied Saddam Hussein with WOMDs...

The Taliban was to fight the old USSR. Trust me, the Taliban ain't shit in comparison.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Always support the anti-commie, even if they're just as bad themselves. You seem to have the idea that the Soviet Union was the prime evil, the devil reincarnated in a a nation...
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#33 Blodo

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Posted 13 August 2005 - 11:22 AM

Don't be stupid, read your history books.  If the US hadn't been pointing those nukes at Russia, wherever you live, would currently be under Soviet control.  You  can also find how fun that was in your history books.

Well were all basically under american watch right now so big deal it didnt change a thing >_>

I NEVER justified the use of nuclear weapons.  I personally don't agree with intentionally targeting civilians under any circumstances, however, you must consider that the Japanese were willing to drive a plane into an aircraft carrier, do you think they'd really surrender that easy?  Also consider that this wasn't a day of precision guided ammunition, around 50,000,000 civilians died during that war.

Might i just say Truman being full of shit in that moment said that Hiroshima and Nagasaki were military bases, when in fact they were cities. With civilians. And the argument was there cause Japan wanted to surrender under some conditions (them being: the emperors throne stays intact, america doesnt occupy japan)

Now THAT is a reason to use a nuke, it sure is.

The US just developed the technology first.  Whoever built it first, would have used it first, that can be said about any country involved in WW II.

Yes but the reason for dropping the nuke was just a pretext. Id bash germany or russia in the same way if they launched a nuke with just a pretext, no real reason.

The Taliban was to fight the old USSR.  Trust me, the Taliban ain't shit in comparison.

It proves a point about being an american ally and living in the middle-east at the same time. Besides back when the Soviet Union was still around you actually wanted the talibans to ascend government. SO you were willing to trade off a complete lack of a democracy just for the fact that the Soviets wont get that country? Sounds great, id hit it.

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#34 Mastermind

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Posted 13 August 2005 - 06:19 PM

Real Politik they call it. Sometimes you have to deal with people who aren't exactly the best to keep people who you feel are worse from doing things. At least we eventually went in a fixed our mistake.
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Well, when it comes to writing an expository essay about counter-insurgent tactics, I'm of the old school. First you tell them how you're going to kill them. Then you kill them. Then you tell them how you just killed them.

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#35 Ash

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Posted 13 August 2005 - 09:17 PM

Two wrongs don't make a right, MM. No wonder most of the Arab world feels resentment towards the western powers. Just look at how many times we have all collectively shit on them. And the USA has, no arguments please, got to be the biggest culprit of that.

I still don't believe that just because a nation isn't as "free" as yours, you have the right to go and impose your own jackboot on it in the name of freedom. If you really DO believe you have this right, why don't you Americans put your money where your mouth is and fuck North Korea over? They're probably the least free people on Earth. Even Death Row inmates are freer.

And also, I'd like to ask Silent Killa to read my last post again. I did say the USA AND RUSSIA created the Cold war. Remember wars have TWO sides. Even civil wars.


I wonder how the USA and UK "knew" Saddam had WMD's by the way? Oh yeah. They kept the invoice. :lol: And now guess what? He didn't have any! Oops, it's all been a big cockup, so let's say it was about freedom! Yes, that'll keep the critics quiet! *Prez goes to sign big oil contract in his new sovreign nation*

Meanwhile, two other middle-eastern nations, namely Israel and Pakistan, have been pointing nukes at one another for ages now, and nobody's stepped in! Why's that? They're at eachother's throat over a little shit of land. I wonder where our glorious global referee is? Cor blimey ref, are you blind! :wacko:


Oh, remind me again why the USA hated communism so. If I remember rightly, it didn't really do any harm to the USA. In fact, I'd like to have seen how America and the UK coped with destroying Nazi Germany without the Eastern Front. I dare say it would have been a whole lot harder. But again, this is a biased version of history. And the USA are:
a) Always right.
b) The world police force.
c) the sole victors in every situation.

#36 MSpencer

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Posted 14 August 2005 - 05:54 AM

Two wrongs don't make a right, MM. No wonder most of the Arab world feels resentment towards the western powers. Just look at how many times we have all collectively shit on them. And the USA has, no arguments please, got to be the biggest culprit of that.

Have you forgotten the invasion of Persia and the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company scandals? What of Britain creating new nations in the Middle East and then telling one nation that they would now be ruled by a totally different ethnic group? Oh and that whole Anthony Eden and the Suez Crisis thing, terrible indeed.
You can't bitch about America without getting your own hands dirty.

Oh, remind me again why the USA hated communism so. If I remember rightly, it didn't really do any harm to the USA. In fact, I'd like to have seen how America and the UK coped with destroying Nazi Germany without the Eastern Front.

Bear in mind, Overlord was not planned until WELL after Operation Barbarossa, and it was only undertaken at the absolute behest of many members of the general staff of the Allies, and the absolute dire urging of Stalin, as well as a very real realization that communism could have a foothold all over Western Europe as well as Eastern after the fall of Germany. By 1944, Hitler's meddling in the affairs of the Wehrmact had officially caused the obliteration of any chance the German military had of turning the war in the east around. If it were not for Operation Barbarossa, the Allies would have taken a better planned and safer route to taking down the Third Reich, most likely involving aerial supremacy, which by June of 1941 was practically achieved, and a gradually intensifying strategic bombing campaign, including the eventual use of nuclear weapons. Now if it were not for Hitler's ambition, an eastern front would never have been opened, but history happened the way it did, and it is impossible to say that Hitler would not have eventually attacked the Soviet Union, because anyone who knows even the basics of Nazi Germany would know that Hitler's book, Mein Kampf, clearly lays out the "untermensch" status of Slavs as only being worthy to be conquered. Regardless of the fact that neither Britain nor the United States, nor a good portion of the world liked Stalinism, Leninism, or other various branches of Soviet Communism, it was Hitler's personal beliefs that drove him to attack the USSR, which caused the ultimate downfall of Germany. Remember, Operation Barbarossa came well before US intervention, and Overlord was simply the opening of another front which would not have occurred if the war had been seen as clear cut back in 1941, when plans to breach the Atlantic Wall had begun.

And the USA are:
a) Always right.
b) The world police force.
c) the sole victors in every situation.

a) No, but we're not always wrong as everyone sees any superpower that has ever existed.
b) Only when the UN does nothing
c) We did not win the Vietnamese conflict, however I defy you to find one instance in which the United States has lost a war.

And also, I'd like to ask Silent Killa to read my last post again. I did say the USA AND RUSSIA created the Cold war. Remember wars have TWO sides. Even civil wars.

If anything created the Cold War, it was the lackluster negotiations on each side, and the shuffling of presidents at the end of World War II. What FDR and Churchill had promised Stalin at Yalta had quickly changed in the post-war environment, and Truman and the new British government had no intentions of letting communism spread. Nonetheless, these tensions had been rising for years, and the Cold War cannot be blamed on the actions of two countries alone, but only on the followers of the two beliefs (Communism and capitalism) and the vast differences between the ideologies.

Meanwhile, two other middle-eastern nations, namely Israel and Pakistan, have been pointing nukes at one another for ages now, and nobody's stepped in! Why's that? They're at eachother's throat over a little shit of land. I wonder where our glorious global referee is? Cor blimey ref, are you blind! ^_^

Israel and Pakistan are fighting over something? Did I miss something?

I wonder how the USA and UK "knew" Saddam had WMD's by the way? Oh yeah. They kept the invoice. :grin: And now guess what? He didn't have any! Oops, it's all been a big cockup, so let's say it was about freedom! Yes, that'll keep the critics quiet! *Prez goes to sign big oil contract in his new sovreign nation*

Obviously you only watch CNN, because they cut out the reports that state that trace amounts of various chemical agents were found in artillery shells, indicating that at one point they had contained chemical weapons. You missed it right? Not blind ignorance or anything.

I still don't believe that just because a nation isn't as "free" as yours, you have the right to go and impose your own jackboot on it in the name of freedom. If you really DO believe you have this right, why don't you Americans put your money where your mouth is and fuck North Korea over? They're probably the least free people on Earth. Even Death Row inmates are freer.

I'm not quite sure about this one, oh wait, THEY HAVE NUCLEAR WEAPONS! Also, they have a dictator insane enough to use them. You want to go there and get nuked? Go ahead.
You want proof they have nuclear weapons? Read this press release.
http://www.globalsec...0211-kcna01.htm

Now please, do tell me that this post was not actually written by you, because if it was I will have to lower my expectations from you and include it in the "total crap" category, because frankly, this is nothing but paranoid, ignorant ranting with no end. You cannot argue with a deaf person, so please, appeal to reason and think when you post.
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#37 Silent_Killa

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Posted 14 August 2005 - 08:29 AM

And also, I'd like to ask Silent Killa to read my last post again. I did say the USA AND RUSSIA created the Cold war. Remember wars have TWO sides. Even civil wars.

With that logic, Poland was at fault for being invaded during WW II. Every war has to sides, yes, but when you have one side looking to forcibly take over everything around it, and one country trying to prevent it, who is really at fault there?

Always support the anti-commie, even if they're just as bad themselves. You seem to have the idea that the Soviet Union was the prime evil, the devil reincarnated in a a nation...

# Millions were sent to the Gulags, Soviet concentration camps, where perhaps 20% of all prisoners died. Countless others suffered the drug-torture of the so-called "psychiatric hospitals," where resistance was legal proof of the need for more "treatment."

# In 1919, hundreds of thousands of Don Cossacks were slaughtered in wholesale murder.

# In the 1930s, the Soviet secret police issued death quotas to its regional departments. The quotas were filled with indiscriminate killing. Mothers who came to police headquarters to inquire about their arrested sons could be taken outside and shot to help fill the quotas. Children were murdered for the crimes of their parents.

# From 1932-1933, five million Ukrainian peasants died in forced starvation. The Soviet government stationed troops to actively prevent anyone from escaping the famine. Doctors and relief supplies were kept out by force. The famine was a long, deliberate plan to make people dead by creating and maintaining conditions in which they could not obtain food.

# From 1930-1937, Soviets carried out the systematic murder of 6,500,000 "kulaks," lower middle class peasants.

# From 1937-1938, perhaps a million Communists were murdered by Stalin in the Great Terror.

# In 1949, deportation and genocide of some 50,000-60,000 Estonians.

Might not be the anti-christ, but they were pretty damn close.

Obviously you only watch CNN, because they cut out the reports that state that trace amounts of various chemical agents were found in artillery shells, indicating that at one point they had contained chemical weapons. You missed it right? Not blind ignorance or anything.

Whatever happened to that underground facility with drums filled with somethin' deadly? I saw a report on it once, and then nothing much else. There were also the crates full of munitions designed specifically to carry chemical warheads burried by it.

Edited by Silent_Killa, 14 August 2005 - 08:34 AM.

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#38 Mastermind

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Posted 14 August 2005 - 08:41 AM

Meanwhile, two other middle-eastern nations, namely Israel and Pakistan, have been pointing nukes at one another for ages now, and nobody's stepped in! Why's that? They're at eachother's throat over a little shit of land. I wonder where our glorious global referee is? Cor blimey ref, are you blind! :grin:

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That'd maybe be India and Pakistan, and last I checked, they aren't fighting nearly as much anymore. Two wrongs might not make a right, but in this case, is the second wrong really a wrong if we're fixing the first wrong to make right?
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#39 Ash

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Posted 14 August 2005 - 11:55 AM

Oh, sorry...I said pakistan when I meant Palestine. :oops: But yeah. I wouldn't trust the Indians or the Pakistanis any more with nukes than I would the Argies or Brazil. Infact I'd trust them WAY less. Yet nobody's even said boo to them.


Spence, I honestly don't see what all that crap about Overlord and Barbarossa has to do with that debate. The point is, the USA and USSR were, for a time, allies against a common enemy. Then, a coupla weeks later they both saw one another as evil. Granted, the USSR weren't a great bunch to put it lightly, but what's that got to do with the USA? Similarly, why is it right for the USA to step in when the UN does not? To be honest, the UN might as well not exist. It's a paper tiger anyway.
Better yet, why doesn't the US just invade the entire Arab world? None of those people are free. Look what they force their women to wear! None of them are democratic! They all have sultans or sheikhs or whatnot. And none of them treat their people right! <_<

Granted, Saddam's regime wasn't wonderful, but as I said, put your money where your mouth is and go hit North Korea. They have nuclear weapons? Well last I heard the official pretext for the war in Iraq was that they had weapons of mass destruction, and a dictator who could (and did during the Iran/Iraq war) use them... :grin:

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#40 ComradeJ

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Posted 14 August 2005 - 01:14 PM

@Silent Killa:
Yes, and the factions that the US supported/brought to power were ever so nice. You kept the Vietnam war going, thereby killing of 14% of the nation's population, supplied the Taliban and Saddam Hussein with all the weapons and training they needed... Yes, very nice. Much better then the commies.
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