1121 replies to this topic

[Creator]

Well Creator that makes you blind to the facts that russia may also have it's setbacks

Come on, it was just a joke. Of course, Russia has many flaws. I understand it very well.

Another way to look at is the documentary may not have been trying to sell the Challenger at all... they just want to sell thier film about tanks. Because they are an american company if they make the american tank look good people won't take them seriously, so they can make another country's tank look good and it preserves thier good reputation, thus selling the documentary better.

Yes. And there is one more thought. Films about all-good Challenger can be sold better in England. Films about all-good Leopard-2 can be sold better in Germany and so on. Its just a way of capturing market.

with the impact the shell hits the ground with, and the flying shrapnal, it burst the ball. also, imagine if a HE round was used. 3-6 meters means nothing if it is a high explosive shell.

Ah, this is another thing. I believe that a football could be hit by fragments. You just had to point the type of shell in the very begining of discussion. I thought about direct hit.

also, creator...did you know that a new tpye of shell is being made that will not deviate froem the target? it is called "the excalibur" it uses a GPS navagation system and corrects itself in flight

Yes, I know. It is 155mm artillery shell. Very precisious. Excalibur is all-good, but one thing. GPS can be jammed. Ground jammer station can emit the same signal as GPS satellite. But GPS coordinates will be substituted by the enemy. So, a GPS-guided weapon (such as Excalibur, JDAM, Tomahawk or another one) will catch substituted signal and hit the target ENEMY WANTS! A pair of such jammers had been successfully tested in Iraq. This is why americans had over-expenditure of high precision weapons in the very begining of war.

Apache have guided missiles. It is another thing.

i was talking about how its radar on the top prioritizes the threats on the batlefeild and automatically locks onto the highst threat target.

Manually. Second pilot (which is weapon operator) recieves data from that radar and launches missiles.

yes, im talking about an autonomus GPS guidance system. that is what i meant by the first of its kind

No, it is not the first. JDAMs and Tomahawks use GPS guidance too.

i've always wanted to know what'd happen to the black eagle and 2S19-MSTA-SB.(2 barrelled 2S19)

Black eagle project had been canceled.
Artillery is still under development.

Edited by Creator, 07 September 2007 - 04:49 PM.

[Pendaelose]

there is always a risk of jamming for GPS, but its not an absolute show stopper. Though I doubt any are made yet, you can still rely on GPS data fed from a local source (such as the artillery vehicle) using an encrypted frequency hopping radio, and some weapons use photo-recognition for long range travel, such as the Tommahawk. The GPS is suplemental to the systems other guidance systems.

satalite GPS is great, but its not the only way to get to your mark.

advanced Electronics are dropping in price all the time. Conder this, iPhone only costs 600$ where as many of these missiles and shells cost anywhere from 50,000$ each to a couple million each. I think eventualy we will get to the point where if our shells get a situation where the AI sees the photo recognition and the GPS don't agree it will email back to the ground crew and ask for directions. And with a half decent AI it could detect unexpected changes in GPS data and dissable its own GPS to fly on what it knows about its fire trajectory, speed, etc... with a good physics model it could get a very acurate update just off those. Smart shells are comming....

also, just an idea, shells designed to keep in contact with the ground base to recieve live updates from the artillery-radar?? It can know where the target is, where it is, and where incomming shells are at. again, it could use a an encrypted frequency hopping radio to keep in contact. Purely suplamental to the GPS and any other systems. If it gets cut off one, it can switch to the other, and if it sees an abrupt


(ofcourse Freq Hopping radio CAN be jammed, but that also means jamming ALL radio frequencies.... thats fine if you don't need radio yourself, but for most modern armies that is a problem. And if your enemy is using both Radio and Satilite you can get in a world of hurt trying to jam it all)

[olli]

Manually. Second pilot (which is weapon operator) recieves data from that radar and launches missiles.

yes, im talking about an autonomus GPS guidance system. that is what i meant by the first of its kind

No, it is not the first. JDAMs and Tomahawks use GPS guidance too.

i knew you would interpret that wrong.

first off...about the apache longbow. that radar will detect pretty much all battlefeild tanks/threats. it priorities them. it automatically LOCKS ON to the highest threat priority. then, it its up to the gunner if he wants to launch missiles. but it does automatically lock on.


with regards to the GPS artillery... i know tomahawks use GPS....i was going to put that in my first post and make it crystal clear that i was talking about artillery shells, (as in shells that are fired from mobile artillery. you know...the ones with treads, they look like tanks...but the turret can raise up about 50 degrees higher?) and not missiles. but i decided against it because i thought it was clear! when i said the first of its kind...i meant it is the first artillery shell to use GPS.


and going back to the tank/football thing....getting a tank shell to land meter away from a football at over 2 miles, in the first shot in my mind, can be considered a direct hit. something that small hit from over 2 miles away.... that is accurate. the crater a tank shell leaves when it hits would easily cover a meter...so technically it did hit it with an amlmost perfect direct hit.
but just to clarify...the metal SABOT round didnt go striaght through the football and into the ground or carry on, it landed just about meter away from it. considering a SABOT round is basically a very high velocity corssbow dart....that is fucking impressivly accurate...especially when fired from 2 miles away

Edited by olli, 07 September 2007 - 06:38 PM.

[Creator]

there is always a risk of jamming for GPS, but its not an absolute show stopper. Though I doubt any are made yet, you can still rely on GPS data fed from a local source (such as the artillery vehicle) using an encrypted frequency hopping radio

Such projects are not even in development now.

and some weapons use photo-recognition for long range travel, such as the Tommahawk. The GPS is suplemental to the systems other guidance systems.

Photo-recognition is used in the end of flight only. Tommahawk can recieve substituted GPS signal in the middle of its trajectory, before using photo-recognition.

Smart shells are comming....

Smart jammers are coming too.

[for russia!]

y is it cancelled? it is so nice...

[Pendaelose]

y is it cancelled? it is so nice...

almost certainly because of cost... thats what kills most military projects. Even if the military likes it, if it makes some politicians budget look bad he'll cancel the project to make himself look better on paper.

[Creator]

y is it cancelled? it is so nice...

Because it is worse than Object 195. Russian Ministry of Defense had chosen Object 195 as the most priority one. So, Object 640 (Black Eagle) project had been canceled in order to redirect money to Object 195 project.

Edited by Creator, 08 September 2007 - 04:01 PM.

[Death_Pheonix]

whats the object 195 project?

[for russia!]

i think it's the T-95, a tank with an unmanned turret.

[partyzanPaulZy]

The 1st tank, where AA/AG rockets can be mounted on turret like on CnC mammoths. Probably 152mm cannon,
carbon fibres on surface, ceramic composite, etc. Maybe the most dangerous tank in the world (many countries says that about their own tank ).

Edited by partyzanPaulZy, 09 September 2007 - 01:13 PM.

[Creator]

i think it's the T-95, a tank with an unmanned turret.

Yes, you're right.


partyzanPaulZy, Your picture is not a T-95. It is unnamed experimental prototype of 1980s.

[olli]

The 1st tank, where AA/AG rockets can be mounted on turret like on CnC mammoths.

other tanks have had TOW Missiles and other anti tank missiles qand AA missiles mounted on the turret, or part of the chassis.

[partyzanPaulZy]

Ok, small mistake.
"Small" Gallery:

T-95?


Object 775, I found it under t95


Old project Object 279


Ukrainian Oplot MBT (T-84-120 Oplot)

Isn't this right reason of bad status of Ukrainian roads?

Czech modernized soviet tank T-72M3/4 CZ


French AMX-30 Stealth Demonstrator


German Leopard 2A6 EX


Sweden Strv-122


Sweden project Udes -XX-20


U.S.A. - United Defence FCS-T (Future Combat System - Tracked)


Inspiration for GLA ? Scorpion AB4 (British tank in Lebanon version)


German-British Vickers Mk7 - body Leopard 2, turret Challenger 2


Challenger 2E


British MODIFIER
(Mobile Direct Fire Equipment Requirement)


Most of these pictures, info, allmost all info of these tanks in czech only

Edited by partyzanPaulZy, 10 September 2007 - 01:59 PM.

[Creator]

this is for_russia. too lazy to log in. it's hard to find info of the T-95

Of course its hard to find. The project is secret.

by the way creator, u seem 2 know a lot about military hardware, are u in the military?

No. I'm engineer of space research center.

[olli]

No. I'm engineer of space research center.

Seriously?

[Creator]

Seriously?

Yes.