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#41 ComradeJ

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 01:30 PM

Revora is ran in a different way and different purposes than PPM.


Banshee, why do you think that PPM's methods will work here? Then again...if you're such a proponent of guests, why the hell do you have boards that aren't even guest-viewable? I've never had a problem with guests viewing threads. Nobody has. But I don't want to see "hwo od I ad utins?!!!!!!! HLEP EM!!".


I don't use PPM's methods here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Oh, well, that kinda solves it, I'm happy with guest posting here :blush:

Seriously, explain stuff. You admins are always bullshitting (is that a word?) about try before you buy, accessability... But face it. There are no downsides to registering, and clearly there's a lot of downsides on guest posting.
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#42 Hostile

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 01:57 PM

There are no down sides to registrering, but there down sides to not allowing guest posting. Sure you get some spammers, but in no greater proportion than registered spammers.

What we'd lose is all those people who want to reply as a guest and than find out they can't and close the window and go somewhere else. Because they aren't going to explore any further in a place where they can't even post.

Now I totally agree with specific mods and forums requesting no guest posting for thier own reasons. That seems reasonable, but not all of Revora. That's not reasonable.

So we're back to the same place. Revora will allow guest posting, individual projects can request it to be turned off. Do you all find this fair?

#43 Blodo

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 04:30 PM

If they'll close the window cause they're too lazy to register then Revora will probably be a better place without them. Seriously this kind of guys will typically post like 5 times even if they actually do register, and then leave (of course there may be exceptions but not too much most probably). Whats the use of such people on Revora?

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#44 Athena

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 04:32 PM

If you register to make 5 posts, won't that sort of accounts clutter up the database?
I don't like the fact of submitting my email just to make five posts. I'm still getting portugese spam even though I deregistered on that forum a couple of months ago.

#45 Ash

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 04:42 PM

Blaat, guest posts that are utterly meaningless clutter up the database MORE than a few members who registered and decided never to come here again.

Just because they only registered to make one post doesn't mean that they are disgruntled because they couldn't post as a guest. There is a REASON more or less everywhere follows the 'register to post' thing. It's something called 'sanity'. Anyway, I digress.

Many members register with the intent to post. But hell, they may lose interest in the forum.

So what if they can't post as guests, and are made to register? They should think themselves bloody lucky they can VIEW the forum! Enough places you can't even do that without registering (C-GEN, anyone?). If they're too lazy to click 3 hyperlinks and fill in 6 boxes, then in my book they're too lazy to POST.



Banshee, I duly note that you've ignored more or less ALL of my post (I assume you only quoted and responded to the only bit you had an 'appropriate' counterargument for), and the other posts gone before. Seriously. Do you just choose not to counter every point of discussion, or do you think that by sweeping it under the table I'll forget I even posted it?


I can see the people who get narky because they can't post on a forum not using forums very much, because more or less every forum follows that trend.
Me? I honestly couldn't give a fuck if I have to register to post. Usually, if I'm looking for something in particular, and I stumble across a site in Google, if it doesn't answer my question I click the X anyway. If I like somewhere on looks, I register and post. Just about everyone I know feels the same.

I guess Hostile doesn't frequent many forums, if the fact he can't post as a guest freaks him out enough to make him want to bugger off and never return.

I mean, jeez. And you think I'M narky? :blush:

#46 Mastermind

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 05:02 PM

Blaat, guest posts that are utterly meaningless clutter up the database MORE than a few members who registered and decided never to come here again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The database doesn't much care about a few spare guest posts or a few spare members. We aren't even approaching the realm where we have to worry about that. Revora is a SMALL forum in all reality. When we start getting up into the millions of posts we might have a problem, but we're a long ways from there.
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#47 Torn

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 05:42 PM

I hate to agree with Jerkov, but he talks sense.

#48 Ash

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 05:49 PM

Lol, I love you too, Tornado. :p

We may not agree, but at least you don't beat around the bush with what you say. I'd rather argue with you than Detail or Banshee, any day. At least I get sense back out of you :blush:

#49 Mastermind

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 05:51 PM

I can see the people who get narky because they can't post on a forum not using forums very much, because more or less every forum follows that trend.
Me? I honestly couldn't give a fuck if I have to register to post. Usually, if I'm looking for something in particular, and I stumble across a site in Google, if it doesn't answer my question I click the X anyway. If I like somewhere on looks, I register and post. Just about everyone I know feels the same.

I guess Hostile doesn't frequent many forums, if the fact he can't post as a guest freaks him out enough to make him want to bugger off and never return.

I mean, jeez. And you think I'M narky? :blush:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Revora is different. Just because nearly everyone else does something doesn't mean it is better or right. Revora is an experiment at the same time it is a network. We try new things, we find some that work, some that don't. Guest posting to my view has been a successful experiment. And I've said it before, if a project has a problem with guest posting they just have to ASK ME and I will probably turn it off for them.
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Well, when it comes to writing an expository essay about counter-insurgent tactics, I'm of the old school. First you tell them how you're going to kill them. Then you kill them. Then you tell them how you just killed them.

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#50 Blodo

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 06:13 PM

More and more projects have been asking to turn it off, isnt that a good indicator of the fact that guest posting causes more problems than it fixes?

ARGUMENT FROM CREATION, a.k.a. ARGUMENT FROM PERSONAL INCREDULITY (I)
(1) If evolution is false, then creationism is true, and therefore God exists.
(2) Evolution can't be true, since I lack the mental capacity to understand it; moreover, to accept its truth would cause me to be uncomfortable.
(3) Therefore, God exists.


#51 Torn

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 06:25 PM

Lol, I love you too, Tornado. :p

We may not agree, but at least you don't beat around the bush with what you say. I'd rather argue with you than Detail or Banshee, any day. At least I get sense back out of you :blush:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Lol.

#52 chemical ali

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 06:30 PM

And so it was said that Detail in his great tower of giberish and as the Banshees flew overhead back to their PPM base that every single member with sense said that guest posting was the evil.

Listen Banshee why don't you listen to CJs case, a selctive arguement is not realistic, Im for guests being able to read stuff but not post.
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#53 ComradeJ

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 06:38 PM

You're all a bunch of lazy bitches, I visit forums for about half a year before I register!

If you're too lazy to fill in those boxes, we don't want you. Those people are exactly the kind of people that don't check their spelling because they think it's a waste of time.

Roughly everybody but the admins has the same opinion. Either you're very biased, or you don't visit the forums too much.
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#54 Banshee

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 07:14 PM

Blaat, guest posts that are utterly meaningless clutter up the database MORE than a few members who registered and decided never to come here again.

Just because they only registered to make one post doesn't mean that they are disgruntled because they couldn't post as a guest. There is a REASON more or less everywhere follows the 'register to post' thing. It's something called 'sanity'. Anyway, I digress.

Many members register with the intent to post. But hell, they may lose interest in the forum.

So what if they can't post as guests, and are made to register? They should think themselves bloody lucky they can VIEW the forum! Enough places you can't even do that without registering (C-GEN, anyone?). If they're too lazy to click 3 hyperlinks and fill in 6 boxes, then in my book they're too lazy to POST.



Banshee, I duly note that you've ignored more or less ALL of my post (I assume you only quoted and responded to the only bit you had an 'appropriate' counterargument for), and the other posts gone before. Seriously. Do you just choose not to counter every point of discussion, or do you think that by sweeping it under the table I'll forget I even posted it?


I can see the people who get narky because they can't post on a forum not using forums very much, because more or less every forum follows that trend.
Me? I honestly couldn't give a fuck if I have to register to post. Usually, if I'm looking for something in particular, and I stumble across a site in Google, if it doesn't answer my question I click the X anyway. If I like somewhere on looks, I register and post. Just about everyone I know feels the same.

I guess Hostile doesn't frequent many forums, if the fact he can't post as a guest freaks him out enough to make him want to bugger off and never return.

I mean, jeez. And you think I'M narky? :dry:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I only paid attention for the last paragraph, because it was a paragraph directed to me.

And Jerkov, guests may have a random behaviour, since there is no known user behind it, but it's a nice risk. Usually positive, although there are some annoying guests as well. Some may not pay attention to the stickies, but the same happens with some registered users. You have to remember that there are humans posting as guests (if it's a bot, the visual confirmation mod will wipe them), but the human ones have neurons and are able to learn. If they like our community, the chance of them registering is higher with guest posting allowed.

I'd like to remind you that n00b behaviour also happens often with registered people.

Do you just choose not to counter every point of discussion, or do you think that by sweeping it under the table I'll forget I even posted it?


I think that point countered your whole paragraph.
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#55 Ash

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 07:50 PM

Yeah. That makes a change, Banshee. You don't usually do that, and that's what always used to get my back up. :dry:

But with a registered user, you can actually direct a comment telling them not to do it again. You can PM them. You can BAN them, for christ's sake.

With a Guest...what've you got? Nothing. Because chances are the Guest won't read it. The Guest doesn't care. Because basically he's untouchable. The Guest also makes banning a regular user pointless. Take a banned user...any one you want. ACK'll do. If ACK wanted to, he could ever so easily come on as a guest and troll.


Let's say Ali started spamming. Well, I know he does anyway, but I mean SERIOUS spam shit. We could tell him to quit it, or we could just ban him if needs be.
All Ali has to do to continue is log out and continue as guest. Alternately, if Ali was a guest anyway, he could go on without even having anything done to him.

Moderating is all well and good, but we miss some, and it's not hard to out-post a moderator's delete key. Also, it'd save a LOT of Banshee's, MM's and Tom's valuable time to kick guestposting and thus consequently HALVE this problem. At least if we force the miscreants to register we know who to point a finger (and a ban button) at.

#56 chemical ali

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 07:54 PM

Oh I love being an example, but I agree and so does a large proportion of members. :dry:
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#57 ComradeJ

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 08:06 PM

And Jerkov, guests may have a random behaviour, since there is no known user behind it, but it's a nice risk. Usually positive, although there are some annoying guests as well. Some may not pay attention to the stickies, but the same happens with some registered users. You have to remember that there are humans posting as guests (if it's a bot, the visual confirmation mod will wipe them), but the human ones have neurons and are able to learn. If they like our community, the chance of them registering is higher with guest posting allowed.

I'd like to remind you that n00b behaviour also happens often with registered people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I would've suggest banning registered idiots as well, but I don't think you could be persuaded into doing that if you even don't do this, so I didn't even bother.
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#58 Athena

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 09:14 PM

Roughly everybody but the admins has the same opinion. Either you're very biased, or you don't visit the forums too much.

I wouldn't say roughly everybody.

Yeah. That makes a change, Banshee. You don't usually do that, and that's what always used to get my back up. wink.gif

But with a registered user, you can actually direct a comment telling them not to do it again. You can PM them. You can BAN them, for christ's sake.

With a Guest...what've you got? Nothing. Because chances are the Guest won't read it. The Guest doesn't care. Because basically he's untouchable. The Guest also makes banning a regular user pointless. Take a banned user...any one you want. ACK'll do. If ACK wanted to, he could ever so easily come on as a guest and troll.

Let's say Ali started spamming. Well, I know he does anyway, but I mean SERIOUS spam shit. We could tell him to quit it, or we could just ban him if needs be.
All Ali has to do to continue is log out and continue as guest. Alternately, if Ali was a guest anyway, he could go on without even having anything done to him.

Ali could just register as ANOTHER user.
If it really gets out of hand, there's always an ip-ban. Also guests leave their ip just as much as registered users.

#59 Mastermind

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 10:59 PM

More and more projects have been asking to turn it off, isnt that a good indicator of the fact that guest posting causes more problems than it fixes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I count 3 that have asked me in about 6 months. Compared to our total hosting, that isn't even significant.
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Well, when it comes to writing an expository essay about counter-insurgent tactics, I'm of the old school. First you tell them how you're going to kill them. Then you kill them. Then you tell them how you just killed them.

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#60 Detail

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Posted 30 September 2005 - 11:58 PM

My public opinion polling shows that there are just doom sayers asking for guest posting off. Most think it's ok.




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