94 replies to this topic

[Hostile]

I'm not an advanced scripter or anything but is it impossible to add the kindof TRANSPORT to the bunker itself and not the overlord or can you change the kindof using the bunker upgrade?

[Mithril]

Yeah I guess you should try that - it can do wonders at times! Look at the bomb truck.. although it is uncertain whether that was the actual cause of the solution.

[Mithril]

Sounds like it would work. Yeah well the same thing occured to me with the bomb truck - all the PLAYER has to do is click a commandbutton on an enemy vehicle and thats it, while the AI needs the command to be applied back on the team again..

[Creator]

I agree with garrison teams.


Chinook. It run script on create. What will happen when AI already have enough Chinooks? Maximum number of resource collectors is 4. Right?
What is "Team <This Team> begins hunting"? Is Chinook ordered to hunt too?
...get confused near its Supply Center... Order troops to go to Supply Center.


Overlord bunker. How does AI switch between building of bunkers, gattlings and propaganda? Overlord strike team must have all 3 addons on 3 overlords.
-Bunker with hunters is main firepower + Anti-Jarmen Kell defense (tank hunter gets in disabled overlord)
-Gattling is AA defense + Stealth detector + Anti-infantry defense.
-Propaganda is auto healing + Firepower bonus


What is "Team <This Team> merges onto Team 'China Overlord Bunker" ?


...after 10sec the bunker on the Overlord would appear... Try to add this condition: Player <This Player> have at least one unit or structure 'OverlordBattleBunker'. Only when it is succeeded build garrison team.


Bomb Truck.
There are 2 tactics of using Bomb Trucks.
1. Send it in team with Scorpions disguised as Scorpion.
2. Send it alone disguised as enemy.


Allowing the GLA to replenish its Sneak Attack Tunnels. Good idea. And moreover you must prevent GLA of using Sneak Attack special power when it have no units to attack with.


And there is one more AI bug. When enemy is near the GLA AI begins to unload units from its tunnels. All is OK but when the heap of units appears near tunnel you must shoot in the middle and the everybody will be destroyed or heavily damaged. I successfully used this feature for annihilating GLA defenses with my Overlords.

[Mithril]

Good job there thudo! After the origin server move I'll try to get some beta testers and code testers - the latter will test out ideas from the staff and the first will actually play the AI and "break its back" or attempt to.


I've got an idea for the scraps thing - make a new object list called DEBRIS or something (which includes all GLA hulks, in Civilian>Debris

Then use the "Move team towards the nearest object of a specific type", plugging in your object list, though you're right this script should not be evaluated every frame..


What I still don't get is this bomb truck thing.. why will it not work? I mean, all the player has to do is click the commandbutton and select an enemy object with a VEHICLE kindof. But apparently the AI needs special treatment here. Would the commandbutton hunt work? Ah but then you'll need a CommandbuttonHuntUpdate in its ini file.

Well.. we'll solve that I'm sure. The "Initiative" does not stand there for nothing..

About the chinook thing.. why don't you give it a generic script that uses the STOP commandbutton ability every few seconds, and then resume its initial "drop off at the warfactory" orders? Just a thought..

[Mithril]

Sounds like it would work. Yeah well the same thing occured to me with the bomb truck - all the PLAYER has to do is click a commandbutton on an enemy vehicle and thats it, while the AI needs the command to be applied back on the team again..

I noticed some bombtruck disguise attributes in the INIs related to the GLA - not too sure if playing in there would cause the script to run more efficiently. I guess it something to test - figure the BombTruck out and almost everything else is simple.

There may be a way to bypass this whole thing with the help of INIs.. but for that we'll need to exactly understand what the AI needs to use the bombtruck disguise ability on a VEHICLE object...

[thudo]

I agree with garrison teams.


Chinook. It run script on create. What will happen when AI already have enough Chinooks? Maximum number of resource collectors is 4. Right?
What is "Team <This Team> begins hunting"? Is Chinook ordered to hunt too?
...get confused near its Supply Center... Order troops to go to Supply Center.


Overlord bunker. How does AI switch between building of bunkers, gattlings and propaganda? Overlord strike team must have all 3 addons on 3 overlords.
-Bunker with hunters is main firepower + Anti-Jarmen Kell defense (tank hunter gets in disabled overlord)
-Gattling is AA defense + Stealth detector + Anti-infantry defense.
-Propaganda is auto healing + Firepower bonus


What is "Team <This Team> merges onto Team 'China Overlord Bunker" ?


...after 10sec the bunker on the Overlord would appear... Try to add this condition: Player <This Player> have at least one unit or structure 'OverlordBattleBunker'. Only when it is succeeded build garrison team.


Bomb Truck.
There are 2 tactics of using Bomb Trucks.
1. Send it in team with Scorpions disguised as Scorpion.
2. Send it alone disguised as enemy.


Allowing the GLA to replenish its Sneak Attack Tunnels. Good idea. And moreover you must prevent GLA of using Sneak Attack special power when it have no units to attack with.


And there is one more AI bug. When enemy is near the GLA AI begins to unload units from its tunnels. All is OK but when the heap of units appears near tunnel you must shoot in the middle and the everybody will be destroyed or heavily damaged. I successfully used this feature for annihilating GLA defenses with my Overlords.

o Chinook can be created regardless of how many Chinooks are defaulted for each Supply Line but you bring up an interesting point: maybe I can delay the team creation by a few seconds but my purpose for this is to provide a quick-rush into the enemy base. Its quite effective especially against human players! Muhah!
Chinook is ordered to hunt as well but it won't hunt until it unloads the troops at its drop point/destination. When it does, the Chinook just stays in the air and will likely fall to enemy fire. No biggie really.

o Overlord can only upgrade to one type of feature and the one I chose for the team is Bunker. AI, nor a player, cannot switch upgrades on Overlords. Once you choose one of the three then thats that. Plus.. As a team, its just One Overlord and 3-5 Rocket Soldiers. If this bunker is sniped, then troops will leave and still hunt.

o "Team <This Team> merges onto Team 'China Overlord Bunker" is basically merging two teams into one thus allowing for troops to garrison into a vehicles that is not given the label as "transport". Well.. at least in theory. I tried the TEAM WAIT until OverLord Bunker is created - no good. Doesn't work.

o Bomb Truck.. bomb truck.. bah! Pain Truck! heheh.. I've sent it alone and it still doesn't do the compare and self-activate the script to itself. It can run the script on another vehicle but IT NEEDS TO APPLY IT TO ITSELF.. How? heheh

o GLA Sneak Attack tunnel - by the time the next sneak attack tunnel is spawned the next team should easily be ready to be sent through. No biggie.

o As for the AI deploys units out from a tunnel when under attack - thats not a bug! I'd do that too especially from an expansion! AI doesn't do too badly here. Its working as designed. Sure if I had my 5-7 Overlords inbound I'd aim for its center but thats the tunnel feature of the GLA and its also a weakness.

[thudo]

Good job there thudo! After the origin server move I'll try to get some beta testers and code testers - the latter will test out ideas from the staff and the first will actually play the AI and "break its back" or attempt to.


I've got an idea for the scraps thing - make a new object list called DEBRIS or something  (which includes all GLA hulks, in Civilian>Debris

Then use the "Move team towards the nearest object of a specific type", plugging in your object list, though you're right this script should not be evaluated every frame..


What I still don't get is this bomb truck thing.. why will it not work? I mean, all the player has to do is click the commandbutton and select an enemy object with a VEHICLE kindof. But apparently the AI needs special treatment here. Would the commandbutton hunt work? Ah but then you'll need a CommandbuttonHuntUpdate in its ini file.

Well.. we'll solve that I'm sure. The "Initiative" does not stand there for nothing..

About the chinook thing.. why don't you give it a generic script that uses the STOP commandbutton ability every few seconds, and then resume its initial "drop off at the warfactory" orders? Just a thought..

o GLA Scrap acquistion - seems doeable although no priority for me yet! There is a Debri list and I may "tinker" with it.

o Bomb Truck BS - it works to the point that it PREFORMS THE COMMAND FUNCTION ON THE ENEMY UNIT but then not to the BombTruck itself! Look at the command button logic when you use the BombTruck yourself and note the human interface that allows you to click it over to make the bomb truck disguise. There must be some sequence of attached scripts that would work together that would work over the heavy defficiency of the original.

The whole objective is to: make the command of selecting an enemy unit APPLY TO THE BOMBTRUCK. Right now it applies the command to the enemy unit ONLY! It must look at a list and make itself out as one of those on the list but remain neutral so enemy units won't auto-target it on attack-move. The advantage of disguising it huge - it looks like an enemy unit + colour is the same as the enemy! This is huge as it requires the human/AI player to constantly monitor its forces to ensure nothing is amiss.

o Chinook rush - stop commandbutton ability run every few seconds before picking up troops. I really don't see how this will help when if I try it with the USAF and garrison their Combat Chinooks it works 90% of the time: a much much higher success rate! So what is different about the Combat Chinook? Well the Combat Chinook is both a resource collector and Gunport platform like the Infantry General's Assault Helix except its up to 3x faster than the Helix. Something is funky with the regular Chinook and garrisoning it..

[Mithril]

We'll find something for the bomb truck, it will be most useful as it was one of my favorite tactics back in my generals PLAYING days..


Do you know why the EA peeps didn't make the chinook a transport helicopter? I guess they would have had to make a new module for it as the current one doesn't allow you to make a transport heli that ONLY picks up troops and not supplies..


But well if it works 90% of the time it gets less precedence, doesnt it?

I s'pose the bomb truck is the most important thing yet. Hehe, would be fun to actually see that - you said somewhere that both DZ and RV tried to do this but couldn't for some reason?

[RVMECH]

There is no script action calling for the disguise to be applied to the AI needing the disguise.

[Creator]

Maybe to modify INI code?

To make 3 more bomb trucks but with different graphics.
-with humvee model
-with scorpion model
-with gattling tank model

Another idea: To make special upgrade that grants disguise to bomb truck. Upgrade is available for AI only of course.

[Mithril]

Nah, the ThudAI is supposed to work on ALL maps without editing INI - thudo could just as well give the battle bus the TRANSPORT kindof if he does it.. but I doubt it.

[thudo]

Sounds like it would work. Yeah well the same thing occured to me with the bomb truck - all the PLAYER has to do is click a commandbutton on an enemy vehicle and thats it, while the AI needs the command to be applied back on the team again..

I noticed some bombtruck disguise attributes in the INIs related to the GLA - not too sure if playing in there would cause the script to run more efficiently. I guess it something to test - figure the BombTruck out and almost everything else is simple.

[Msakdillz]

3) Garrisoning either China Overlord Tank or GLA BattleBus with troops - this has always been an issue because unlike the USA Humvee, both the Bunkered Overlord and the BattleBus are not given the flag "KindOf = Transport" so thus they seem to not be able to garrison troops in.


Cant you add the kindof = transport to them??

[Mithril]

Well yeah I guess he could but then he would have to ship the INI file with his scripts which may be less user friendly.. I think

[thudo]

Well yeah I guess he could but then he would have to ship the INI file with his scripts which may be less user friendly.. I think

No it wouldn't really.. I'd rather ship the AI scripts with 1-2 extra INIs (currently, the whole project is the .scb and the AIDATA.INI) so adding another one wouldn't be a deal breaker.

I mean, yes it does add that extra level of formality and these days you have to simplify installation packages as much as possible. If I start introducing new folders with files in them (currently, the only one right now that needs creation is the /data/ini/default folder where the AIDATA.INI is located) then that adds the possibility of users contacting me why the AI doesn't work or Generals+Zero Hour doesn't load.

Anyway.. lets test it first... I do want the Bunker Overlord and BattleBus to be EASY TO GARRISON! I'm willing to test that without merging teams. So..

What INI contains this? Can we edit it with the KIND OF = TRANSPORT insertion and test it to see if it works. I'll be very happy. Otherwise, if its too much a pain then they'll be no Bunkered Overlord or BattleBus on the battlefield. I don't like throwing useless units into the fodder. EVERYTHING MUST BE POTENTIALLY LEATHAL! heheeh

Btw.. think I got the some USA MDs using LockOn bug nicked! It had something to do with the CT (Complementary Team) scripts.. Its not 100% nicked as I saw the USA Laser General use those bastard MDs with LockOn last night but its restricted now. Seems it has something to do with MDs being in Teams where CTs are involved so I replaced any MDs in CTs with, say, Humvees, and its better now.

Also tested the scripts WITHOUT all those damn "Garrison P1 B1" teams and scripts.. WoW! Things work better now! heheh. Gawd what was EA thinking!?!?! Complete and utter waste of space and scripting time/logic!

[Mithril]

You've never INI coded? Well if you can do scripting you won't have problems with it.. Anyway the ChinaVehicle, NukeGeneral and TankGeneral.ini contain Overlord units, I suggest you add the TRANSPORT to the overlords themselves instead on the bunker. Note that the TankGeneral.ini possibly has the EmperorOverlord instead of Overlord..

The battle bus is in the GLAVehicle, StealthGeneral, DemoGeneral and GLAVehicle.inis, using the Same Procedure as Every Year, James..

[thudo]

You've never INI coded? Well if you can do scripting you won't have problems with it.. Anyway the ChinaVehicle, NukeGeneral and TankGeneral.ini contain Overlord units, I suggest you add the TRANSPORT to the overlords themselves instead on the bunker. Note that the TankGeneral.ini possibly has the EmperorOverlord instead of Overlord..

The battle bus is in the GLAVehicle, StealthGeneral, DemoGeneral and GLAVehicle.inis, using the Same Procedure as Every Year, James..

I think this may be our only way as to the AI the Bunkered Overlord and BattleBus are just ungarrisonable units. I NEED THEM TO BE GARRISONED. I'll love to be rushed with 3-4 BattleBuses - that would be an accomplishment!

So yer saying find these inis, plug in a "KIND OF = TRANSPORT" line (I might have to locate the USA Humvee for help on its syntax) keep the dir structure like the AIDATA.INI, have the Battlebus or Overlord + 3-5 troops as ONE TEAM (like I have it with Humvees at present) and see what happens!

Seems decent..

Btw.. If I go over two files to use in the AI project then yes I'll need a package app to deploy it. I'm sure it ain't too laborious to create.

Thanks!

[Mithril]

There is already a KindOf line, just add the TRANSPORT to it and the game should think it is a transport..

[thudo]

There is already a KindOf line, just add the TRANSPORT to it and the game should think it is a transport..

I'll give that a shot although it would look bloody weird to see troops enter an Overlord just as it begins researching the Bunker. Hope that wouldn't cause Synch errors. :uh: