Jump to content


Photo

Communists!


  • Please log in to reply
385 replies to this topic

#381 Blodo

Blodo

    The one who disagrees

  • Project Team
  • 3,002 posts
  • Location:Eastern Europe
  • Projects:siteMeister, Mental Omega
  •  The wise guy

Posted 14 July 2006 - 06:35 PM

Once again though, the problem is we allow the government and the corporations to mix. By giving the government control over production, you're only making the government into a corporation with a complete monopoly.

And please, tell me, what's so terrible about the quality of goods in capitalist countries? I mean sure, "they don't make things like they used to" but for the amount produced the quality of our goods is pretty damn good if you ask me.

The mad cow disease wouldn't have happened if it not for the constant trying to lower food price. As far as I know things like that didn't happen in countries that the government controlled and planned the economy (say Poland during the Soviet Union). Why is that, I wonder? Maybe because your theory is blatantly wrong and the government can't behave like a business? Boycotts and strikes don't happen anymore because everyone is too scared to lose their job. The big corporations don't care. Meanwhile you can't lose your country. You stay with it for the better or worse unless you emigrate. The government can't just throw you out. That fact alone makes your theory flawed and unreal.

You can't deny that most of the media is fairly well controlled by the government. This is with minimal control as well. The only thing that keeps government controlled media honest is the free press.

But even the free press is bound by laws. They are not operating outside the law now do they?

Sounds like another law that would be abused beyond belief. Besides, how would we know anything about the candidates without the media?

Ask yourself the question - how did politics exactly work some 100 years ago. There weren't any TVs back then, the radio wasn't that popular. So guess what politicians did: they travelled across the country to get support. The people that authentically supported them did so because of their presence and because of their ideas.

Today any moron from the street can wear a suit and be on TV trying to tell us he understands politics, he won't even have to move his lazy dumbass across the country because all he has to do is throw enough money to be covered by every TV station. Those TV stations will then indoctrinate everyone subconsciously with him, no matter what kind of blubbering idiot he is. In the end we get morons in power, one of them being president Bush. I hope you get my point.

ARGUMENT FROM CREATION, a.k.a. ARGUMENT FROM PERSONAL INCREDULITY (I)
(1) If evolution is false, then creationism is true, and therefore God exists.
(2) Evolution can't be true, since I lack the mental capacity to understand it; moreover, to accept its truth would cause me to be uncomfortable.
(3) Therefore, God exists.


#382 Silent_Killa

Silent_Killa

    Village Idiot

  • Project Team
  • 790 posts

Posted 15 July 2006 - 07:00 AM

The mad cow disease wouldn't have happened if it not for the constant trying to lower food price. As far as I know things like that didn't happen in countries that the government controlled and planned the economy (say Poland during the Soviet Union). Why is that, I wonder? Maybe because your theory is blatantly wrong and the government can't behave like a business? Boycotts and strikes don't happen anymore because everyone is too scared to lose their job. The big corporations don't care. Meanwhile you can't lose your country. You stay with it for the better or worse unless you emigrate. The government can't just throw you out. That fact alone makes your theory flawed and unreal.

Things like this did happen in countries with controlled economies such as Poland during the Soviet Union era. Only it was either planned as a way to squash political dissenters or covered up. The government needs to be efficient just as much as the corporation does. The flaw with a controlled economy is that your "putting all your eggs in one basket" in many different senses. Producing enough goods to fill demand isn't nearly as easy as you think.

Boycotts and strikes don't happen? Where the hell have you been living? Most unions hold more power than the companies they work for.

But even the free press is bound by laws. They are not operating outside the law now do they?

The press shouldn't be bound by any laws that you and me are not.

Ask yourself the question - how did politics exactly work some 100 years ago. There weren't any TVs back then, the radio wasn't that popular. So guess what politicians did: they travelled across the country to get support. The people that authentically supported them did so because of their presence and because of their ideas.

Today any moron from the street can wear a suit and be on TV trying to tell us he understands politics, he won't even have to move his lazy dumbass across the country because all he has to do is throw enough money to be covered by every TV station. Those TV stations will then indoctrinate everyone subconsciously with him, no matter what kind of blubbering idiot he is. In the end we get morons in power, one of them being president Bush. I hope you get my point.

The population was 1/10th the size it is now, and only white landowners could vote before we had the media to inform us about our politicians. Also, any moron on the street with enough money can tour the world and lie to your face just as much as they can lie into a tv camera. It's not technology that's your enemy, it is, once again the fact that we allow the corporations and politicians to mix.
My political compass
Economic Left/Right: 6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.64


"Most people do not really want freedom, because freedom involves responsibility, and most people are frightened of responsibility." -Sigmund Freud
"Laws: We know what they are, and what they are worth! They are spider webs for the rich and mighty, steel chains for the poor and weak, fishing nets in the hands of the government." -Pierre Joseph Proudhon
"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm." -George Orwell

#383 Blodo

Blodo

    The one who disagrees

  • Project Team
  • 3,002 posts
  • Location:Eastern Europe
  • Projects:siteMeister, Mental Omega
  •  The wise guy

Posted 15 July 2006 - 07:25 PM

Things like this did happen in countries with controlled economies such as Poland during the Soviet Union era. Only it was either planned as a way to squash political dissenters or covered up. The government needs to be efficient just as much as the corporation does. The flaw with a controlled economy is that your "putting all your eggs in one basket" in many different senses. Producing enough goods to fill demand isn't nearly as easy as you think.

Dude. If that did happen everyone here would be slapped with it right in the face everyday with the whole "communism = evil" campaign that is in progress by the current government.

The flaw with a completely free economy is that given enough time corporations will take over everything. They will be more dangerous than standing armies and militarist dictators, and will definatly not hesitate to use their power to destroy the lives of hundreds of people in the name of their profit.

The press shouldn't be bound by any laws that you and me are not.

If that did happen, anyone could form a nazi gazette and nobody could do anything. I seriously believe that exceeds the bounds of allowance.

The population was 1/10th the size it is now, and only white landowners could vote before we had the media to inform us about our politicians. Also, any moron on the street with enough money can tour the world and lie to your face just as much as they can lie into a tv camera. It's not technology that's your enemy, it is, once again the fact that we allow the corporations and politicians to mix.

Technology isn't the enemy, it's the way it's used. There should be a clearly defined law as to the bounds of what is allowed in the media and what is not. Maybe I have defined what I think it should be like wrong previously, but the main idea is that there should be absolutely no political advertising whatsoever in the media. None. What could be allowed however are political debates.

ARGUMENT FROM CREATION, a.k.a. ARGUMENT FROM PERSONAL INCREDULITY (I)
(1) If evolution is false, then creationism is true, and therefore God exists.
(2) Evolution can't be true, since I lack the mental capacity to understand it; moreover, to accept its truth would cause me to be uncomfortable.
(3) Therefore, God exists.


#384 Comrade Kal

Comrade Kal

    Blur are better than Oasis

  • Members
  • 2,491 posts
  • Location:A small town in an archipelago in northwest Europe
  • Projects:The revolution
  •  Terrorist

Posted 16 July 2006 - 02:11 PM

So long as we live in a democracy, you can't afford to give the government any power, especially control over the media. No matter how benevolent the party in power is, they could easily be replaced with a much worse alternative who excercises the power for the wrong reasons.
Posted Image

"To be governed is tragic, to govern is pathetic."

#385 Blodo

Blodo

    The one who disagrees

  • Project Team
  • 3,002 posts
  • Location:Eastern Europe
  • Projects:siteMeister, Mental Omega
  •  The wise guy

Posted 16 July 2006 - 06:13 PM

In direct democracy it's the people that are in power mostly. They have more power than we have today. It's a point of transition not a permanent solution, Kal. You can't just shift to communism straight away, nobody is ready for that. Besides, there is no perfect governmental system. I can't account for everything, but it's better than todays "free" media who are making our minds boil with all the bullshit they are transmitting.

ARGUMENT FROM CREATION, a.k.a. ARGUMENT FROM PERSONAL INCREDULITY (I)
(1) If evolution is false, then creationism is true, and therefore God exists.
(2) Evolution can't be true, since I lack the mental capacity to understand it; moreover, to accept its truth would cause me to be uncomfortable.
(3) Therefore, God exists.


#386 Silent_Killa

Silent_Killa

    Village Idiot

  • Project Team
  • 790 posts

Posted 17 July 2006 - 06:28 AM

Dude. If that did happen everyone here would be slapped with it right in the face everyday with the whole "communism = evil" campaign that is in progress by the current government.

Uh, it is, 7 million ukrainians would be one of the best examples.

The flaw with a completely free economy is that given enough time corporations will take over everything. They will be more dangerous than standing armies and militarist dictators, and will definatly not hesitate to use their power to destroy the lives of hundreds of people in the name of their profit.

That's the thing though, the reason why corporations are so powerful is because of their power over the government. In the US they have the democrats to restrict their competition and the republicans to destroy worker's rights. This could be done away with by outlawing corporate contributions to political parties.

If that did happen, anyone could form a nazi gazette and nobody could do anything. I seriously believe that exceeds the bounds of allowance.

Who gives a fuck? FREE SPEECH. People have the right to their own opinions. If NAZI's want a newspaper, they can have a newspaper, I'm not going to buy it, and nobody's going to force you to either.

Technology isn't the enemy, it's the way it's used. There should be a clearly defined law as to the bounds of what is allowed in the media and what is not. Maybe I have defined what I think it should be like wrong previously, but the main idea is that there should be absolutely no political advertising whatsoever in the media. None. What could be allowed however are political debates.

In that case, I agree.
My political compass
Economic Left/Right: 6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.64


"Most people do not really want freedom, because freedom involves responsibility, and most people are frightened of responsibility." -Sigmund Freud
"Laws: We know what they are, and what they are worth! They are spider webs for the rich and mighty, steel chains for the poor and weak, fishing nets in the hands of the government." -Pierre Joseph Proudhon
"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm." -George Orwell




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users