1143 replies to this topic

[Scryer]

i never found a problem with the rohan economy but perhaps that is just the way i used them. for me, they kinda start off slow, but you can pick up a lot of momentum and do a ton of damage real fast. perhaps i will take a closer look at them next time i play.

and punctuation is our friend...

Punctuation is our friend.

For me, MOTE and Rohan's economy is very similar from what I've experienced. I almost find the slow economic starts for these factions a major weakness.
Anyone else feel that Rohan and MOTE are kind of slow economic factions? I'm going to see if Arnor is like that too, in a matter of moments just to see if it's all of the 'new' factions are slow economic producers.

From what I get, the slow economy in the beginning for Rohan and MOTE (if all factions are like this, then it would be a different story) is a real setback for them...

If you created this slow economic production rate for MOTE only, as a 'weakness'. Okay, let's face it! Obviously some factions can really specialize in a particular strategy or set of units - which creates their 'weakness'. I put the word "weakness" in quotations because you can try to fix that weakness. Anyways, if slow economic production was intended as a 'weakness' for MOTE, then I would be fine with it because, as of now, I can see MOTE being one of the factions that has the most potential to becomming overpowered. MOTE is pretty well-rounded in almost everything (from soldiers to heroes). So I can see how slow economy could try to balance it out with the other factions.

But intended slow economy for Rohan, should not be considered because the horses would cost way too much (which would be their specialization) and they aren't the best turtling-faction in the game - if you know what I mean. With Rohan, I'd like to play them as a little bit of a faster faction than I'd play the Dwarves.

I think at this point, I would like to know what you (RJ) are planning, in terms of having each faction make the player use a different strategy than they'd use for another faction. I am not demanding information, by the way! I would just like to see if you'd like to share with us, what you intend each faction to 'feel' like when we play them. As of the latest public release of the mod: I can sort of get a feel for what each faction is striving for.

And I'm sorry for changing this topic for the 6th time.

[SoraStrife]

lol, it was probably me that changed it to Rohan Eco, might I suggest each faction get their own forum? anyways...

If you look at arnor, their biggest flaw is they utterly lack early pikeman, their only pikeman come from a level 3 elven barracks, which is only obtainable through buying the second most expensive alliance upgrade, but I can easily see how that can be taken care of with the heroes, as they seem to rape cavalry.

Rohan's biggest downfall is the shear amount of money it takes to get diversified units on infantry to keep up pressure on a fast moving faction like goblins, that it becomes almost impossible.

[robnkarla]

Rohan was not meant to have such a slow economy and early game as described. A couple of things that will help change their early game and should be mentioned to help their economy:

1) Rallying Call - I'm working on the coding so that when you use rallying call on peasants, they become drafted. Part of what hurts their early economy is the cost to upgrade peasants to a drafted status. This will help them become a more viable unit at the start.

2) Eomer - Pillage. One thing to remember, Eomer should get pillage at level 2, and with this low level he is a strong early-game unit and near vital for early resources.

I think the combination of these two items should help Rohan have an early game can protect itself from spammers of Mordor/Wild.

Overall, MotE should have a weaker start, but remember their power tree has not been done, and they currently have one that is geared for Mordor and not customized for them. As for early game, Harad is meant to be the choice for stronger offensive early game, while Rhun is meant to have a stronger defensive start. Once the powers for heroes are complete and the faction rounds out they will be more complete. Harad should have the stronger economy (especially with the fortress ugprades), while again Rhun is the stronger defense and in the end should be able to be an evil faction turtle.

One thing to remember is that with both choice you can purchase the Tavern with the Brigands and Corsairs which at least for the Brigands should overall be a cheaper alternative for Rhun. (At least that is the goal).

I hope that give a little view on how they work and what I imagine as the goal. It will take one or two more releases and the factions will be fleshed out closer to their final state.

As for Arnor and Pikemen, there are some changes around this area. Don't forget the really basic hobbit pitchforks for Arnor that are available at the beginning. Also, The Swordmasters are moving to the elven faction and are being replaced by a toggle sword/pike mithlond sentry unit. The combination of these two items will help the variety of units for Arnor, among other changes.

As for the forums, yes I'm planning on re-arranging the forums to be much more user-friendly and posting easier to follow. I'd like to add a development forum for general items, and a sub-forum for each faction so I can track each thing better than long topics.

Robert J.

Edited by robnkarla, 08 February 2008 - 05:38 AM.

[Scryer]

Thanks a lot RJ for the insight! It's greatly appreciated.

My questions have been answered, for now.

[dojob]

Rohan suggestions:

-could you make it so that you need the barracks to produce yeoman soldiers and the archery range to produce yeoman archers? It would make lots of sense, since I don't want to pay a 500-resource upgrade just to use the archery range to buy normal archers.

-If you're going to make Eomer an early(-ish?) game pillage hero, then a price decrease to 1200 or at least 1500 would help.

-Please decrease the price of stables to 450, it doesn't make sense that a cavalry faction has to pay lots for their stables and it would improve yeoman scouts since they would then come in early, which is the only time I'd really use them since by the mid-game (when I get the stables), scouts aren't enough and I need dedicated fighting cavalry.

-Also for yeoman scouts:

• decrease their price to 350
• Make them a bit faster
• lower their trample a bit

Edited by dojob, 09 February 2008 - 03:32 PM.

[Darkhinilus]

I had A small suggestion that was making battle for middle earth I so Fun.

First One: that the units dont hug up and move trough other groups anymore. (like if they breached A castle gate they where moving group by group).


Second one that was making it so fun to defend: Mordor and Isengard uses the same siege tactics like in Bfme I (That they first builded A army and used siege ladders and towers to enter your base and mostly battering rams instead of trolls).


this would make the battlefields and sieges like helms' deep and minas tirith mutch more funner.
then mordor uses siege towers and battering rams that smash your gates and isengard the siege ladders to poor over your walls.


also it was cool to watch how your groups where moving into the city one by one and noth al at once inside.
And maybe as A bonus if you guys like this suggestion that isengard uses the bombs more.

(this comment probly was made before but was hard to read just ignore it )

[radical]

heres a idea inspired by another mod i was looking at, give lorien or the elves battles towers that are trees but stealth when near other trees, would add to the whole stealth tatics of the wood dwelling elves. loving the mod i just play rotwk with the mod i dont bother with the orginal well played

[Scryer]

I had A small suggestion that was making battle for middle earth I so Fun.

First One: that the units dont hug up and move trough other groups anymore. (like if they breached A castle gate they where moving group by group).


Second one that was making it so fun to defend: Mordor and Isengard uses the same siege tactics like in Bfme I (That they first builded A army and used siege ladders and towers to enter your base and mostly battering rams instead of trolls).


this would make the battlefields and sieges like helms' deep and minas tirith mutch more funner.
then mordor uses siege towers and battering rams that smash your gates and isengard the siege ladders to poor over your walls.


also it was cool to watch how your groups where moving into the city one by one and noth al at once inside.
And maybe as A bonus if you guys like this suggestion that isengard uses the bombs more.

(this comment probly was made before but was hard to read just ignore it )

You could just delete that post the next time you're on or something

-The Group thing.... I think that it's just a glitch that we're all going to have to deal with and I say that because (when playing MOTE) the Mumakil are hell to maneuver around because of this (I think? Correct me if I'm wrong, someone...).

-The Siege thing.... As much as I want to say that ladders are useful, they truly aren't. Just aim a couple of catapults/ballistas on the walls, and you basically have slaughtered all of your enemy's archers. There is no true use for ladders and siege towers. Not only that but you could easily (and unfairly?) over-run your enemy with units and wall-mounting siege. From what I've experienced so far, siege consists of collecting a bunch of catapults/ballistas/mines and bombarding your enemy. There is no reason for the defending player to mount archers on the walls (except to shoot off rams and maybe hit some catapults). A skilled defensive player would almost just wait until the other player breached the walls/gates and make a stand there; Unless they had some way to get rid of catapults.

I would almost like to see archers gain better damage against catapults and rams because this would give more of a reason for a defensive player, to mount archers on the walls.

Not only that but MOTE doesn't have any ladders or anything. Are there any plans to change this?

dojob:

I pretty much agree with everything that you suggested except about increasing their speed. I haven't really mounted any reasons as to why I disagree with you. I guess it would be just a personal opinion.

I like the idea of Eomer being Rohan's early-game hero. He has the right powers for it, plus he's 'allright' in the mid - late game. It gives him purpose, which is what I feel that some of the Rohirrim heroes lack....... Especially Eowyn and possibly Theoden. I still think that Theoden needs an armour/damage increase power - once again, this is only a personal preference. I think that Gamling, and Erkenbrand(Is Hama in the game? I forget...) were done wonderfully. But I definitely feel that Eowyn has no purpose as a hero. She seems like a filler to me which is not what her character was like in the books. I really just don't like her as a hero....... Maybe she could have new powers if it's not too late to add in:

Mount/Dismount
Smite
Disguise
Shieldmaiden
A Cripple Strike power - Can be used when mounted/dismounted. Basically it's a cripple strike and it would be super-effective against heroes and nazguls.

*I don't know about you guys but I could see Eowyn turning into a "Sniper-like" hero.*

I really don't know whether RJ is creating something for Theoden. I also think that Theoden should get one more power instead of a regular defence and attack boost. Anyways I think that the new power should raise Theoden's defence (against pikemen and arrows), maybe increase his crush damage, and it should increase his speed like %15 or something.

One last thing I would like to mention before I end my post, is that the Hobbit heroes are so useless as of now. I really hope I haven't offended you, RJ because this mod is awesome. But I would honestly rather buy/save up for another hero (or for another unit battalion) than use any of the hobbit heroes as of now. I hate to suggest that we should load these guys up with powers, but I really don't see any alternative right now.

By the way, I have noticed that the forums have changed (for the better, I hope). RJ, would you like us to shift our discussions to their proper forums? I believe that it would make things a hell of a lot easier on you.

Edited by Scryer, 11 February 2008 - 11:41 PM.

[Darkhinilus]

I know you got a little point there Scryer. But I bet that there are many players that would like it that way probly.

And also that same thing I suggested was the same gameplay as in battle for middle earth I it dusnt matter if you are able of breaking the enemy siege fast its about having more fun with game and that the Com is using more tactics then just make A troll and some orks and charge in.

It was so cool to watch how you orks where moving group by group inside the city while archers where trying to kill them.
And if I was playing the defensive side the enemy came everytime with ladders or siege towers catapults battering rams and was trying to breach you with A tactic noth with A mindless move of only sending A troll and attack.

[Devon]

Scryer, don;t worry about offending us You can never have too many suggestions. I agree about rohan and hobbit heroes, and I think something will be done.

[Dalf32]

no please dont stop with the suggestions! its what helps the mod grow more unique. just look at blackdragon; he was posting suggestions almost nonstop for a long time and he has a beta spot now

[Devon]

One thing I would like to see is the return of variable RBs with bonuses, at least for pure bfme2 and 1 maps. For anyone who has not played bfme1, basically some factions could pick what type of RB they could build, and the more they had of that type, they better the discount they got for certain things. For instance, Gondor could build farms, which discounted cavalry; or blacksmiths, which discounted upgrades and siege and had upgrades purchasable at lvl 2. This would also make Gondor unique with upgrades again. An example of RBs would be:

Gondor: farms, blacksmiths
Rohan: farms
Elves: Mallorn trees, Rivendell farm (currently in wb), and something mirkwoodish
Dwarves: mines
Arnor: farms

Mordor: slaughter houses
Isengard: slaughter houses, furnaces
Goblins: Caves, treasure trove?
MotE: Windmills, farms
Angmar: mills

[Scryer]

Haha, I'm not going to stop suggesting ideas. I was just thinking that we should move some of our discussions that were purely about a specific faction, to its proper spot so that RJ doesn't have to searcher through 3 pages of spontaneous-topic discussion. I guess this would turn this thread into something along the lines of a thread that discussed things that affected every faction (like maps, campaign, WOTR, etc..). Now I'm getting off topic....

I agree with Yoda. This economy system would definitely emphasize pecific unit specializations. The only hard part (or so, I would think) would be programming MOTE's economy bonus. Like for Harad; They could get a bonus on Mumakil. And for Rhun; They could get a bonus on wainriders.


Now I want to bring this back to focus on Rohan's heroes and the hobbit heroes.... Sorry but a lot of this stuff is a repeat.

-If Eomer will be intended for our early-game hero, I suggest that his Pillage and leadership powers should switch slots. Like he'd gain a leadership bonus at level 6 and he'd gain his pillage power at level 2 (I think those statistics are right..). Even though he would be Rohan's early-game hero, I still think that he might be missing something. At this point, I would rather just save up for Erkenbrand. I can see Eomer becomming a hero that you want because he helps out resource production. I hate to load every hero up with powers but maybe he could get a resource bonus as a level 10 power? I don't know.... I just Eomer being the hero that (economically) can rise an army really fast and lead them into battle. Which has spontaneously inspired another idea for a level 10 power for him: Maybe he could have a power that reduces build time for stables, significantly? I see this more as a Theoden power, but it could be an idea to play with?

-Erkenbrand.... For a rider who commanded the Westfold during the War of the Ring, he kicks Eomer's ass. As much as I like him as a more offensive hero, I don't think his leadership power is right for him. It's much better than Eomer's (IMO) which is why I think that Eomer and Erkenbrand should switch leadership powers. Other than that, I personally don't mind him.....

-I love Gamling as he is. He appears to have a full-fledged purpose as a hero. I haven't played as Rohan in a long while, so tell me: Is he equipped with a bow/arrow? If not, then whatever. I just thought that it would be nice to have a ranged hero for Rohan.

-Is Hama in the mod? And if he is, could someone please give me a list of his powers (as I have other things to do today)?

-Theoden - If you have Eomer leading your Rohirrim army in the early-game, I think that it's only fair that you should have Theoden leading them in the end-game. Sure, Eomer can last 'tilll the end game and still cause a significant amount of damage. But Theoden should be one of Rohan's heroes that other opponents will dispise and fear. Which is the way I see him (if you couldn't tell already...). I always saw Theoden as being the badass who can call upon every force of Rohan's to create hell for the enemy and I've always seen Theoden (in game) as the hero that makes a huge difference when your Rohirrim charge into enemy battalions. I like his powers (and I like that Glorious Charge is level 4) but, once again, his leadership isn't so 'badass'. Only 50% damage? I would expect that for Erkenbrand, but not for Theoden. Not only that, but Theoden really can't survive a massive battle either. Everytime I've charged Rohirrim into a massive infantry force, I've always had to keep my eye on Theoden's lifebar. Also, his attack sucks.

I mentioned before that I think that Theoden should either get:
A permanent boost in armour and attack (like a 50% armour and 55% attack increase).
A level 10 power that gives him a huge boost in attack and armour.

I also noted that I wanted Theoden to be the hero that truly made a difference if you charged your Rohirrim into pikes (or other enemies). Maybe he could get a healing power instead of a Huge-stat boosting power? I'd even be much happier if Theoden could summon other Rohirrim. Another idea that you guys could play around with, is having Theoden increase the rate of collecting evenstar power points - but that might overpower Rohan . Here's my ideal powers for Theoden:

-Mount/Dismount
-Leadership (All units around Theoden gain 100% more experience in battle, 50% armour, and 25% attack)
-Glorious Charge (Same as before)
-King's Favour (Same as before)
-Horn of Rohan (Heals targeted area and gives the units a 50% boosts in armour, attack, and speed) or Riders of Rohan (Summon 4 battalions of Rohirrim Riders) or Final Charge (Theoden gains 250% boost in Armour (espcially against pikes and arrows), 100% Attack, 15% speed for a short duration (like 30 second or something))

-Now Eowyn. In my last post I mentioned that I wanted her to become a "Sniper-like" hero. I honestly don't know what you guys could do with her, so I'm going to go with my latest idea of her being a hero-huntress..... Anyways, you guys could make her like a hero-bane. Eowyn could be one of those heroes that your opponents fear because she can do loads of damage against their monster-units and their own heroes. The only problem with this is that I can easily see her turning into a "Grima Wormtongue-cookie-cutter" only more offensive. She needs a level 10 power more than any of the other Rohan heroes. Here's my suggestion (similar to my previous suggestion for her, but modified):

-Mount/Dismount
-Smite (Can use in disguise)
-Disguise
-Shieldmaiden (can use in disguise)
-Rule-Breaker
-Basically it's a powerful assassin's strike. Only it hurts all of your opponent's heroes (like it would drain 20% of their health. It would drain more health from Nazguls) no matter where they are, if Eowyn hits a hero. If not, she just instantly kills a unit (could be from an orc-mumakil for the instant kill) with no other effects. Anyways, 85% of Eowyn's health is drained. This would be very powerful against heroes and pretty deadly to Nazguls. It would only paralyze Nazguls for 10 seconds. All other heroes would not be paralyzed. It would also be pretty deadly to the WK if you've lowered his health about 30%. This is not a ranged attack and it can only be used when she's dismounted. She can also use it in her disguise but after she uses it, her disguise is automatically deactivated.

*This might overpower Rohan. But it gives purpose to all of the heroes. Which is the one thing that Rohan's heroes lack, or atleast for me it's what they lack*

Now onto hobbits. First thing's first: I honestly don't think that Bilbo needs to be in the mod. If you guys were making a "The Hobbit" mod, then it would be different. During the War of the Ring, I think that Bilbo's adventures are over. He is only responsible for the lead-up to Frodo's quest and he's only part of the lead-up to the War of the Ring.

That being said, I also think that Frodo and Sam should be level 1 (for any good alliance purchased) Inn heroes. Sure Sam loved the elves, but I don't think that it's fitting to place him in with them. If anything I'd say that you should give these guys to Arnor :S but even I don't fully agree with that. Merry (on the other-hand) should go with Rohan. And Pippin' should go with Gondor. Here are my ideas for their powers:

Frodo:
-Sting/Rock
-Elven Cloak
-Putting on the One Ring
-Light of Galadriel
-Shireling Wish (Moderate healing ability + small bonuses to attack, speed, vision, and defence)

Sam:
-Sword/Rock
-Elven Cloak
-Frying Pan/Light of Galadriel (For Campaign missions...)
-Elven Bread (Small Healing ability)
-One Last Hope (Majorly boosts Sam's attack, defence, vision, and speed.)

Pippin:
-Sword/Rock
-Elven Cloak
-Palantir (basic palantir vision)
-Ent Water (Heals targeted area and gives them a boost in vision)
-Inspiration (Increases all hero health regeneration by 5-10% - passive)

Merry:
-Sword/Rock
-Elven Cloak
-Elven Dagger (forgot the name) (Basically, an attack that always does 15% damage of a hero's health to a hero)
-Horseman's Speed (Because I know that Merry probably couldn't be programmed to mount with Eowyn, I think that he should get a speed increase to keep up with them. It would look awfully hilarious, I would think.)
-Esquire of Rohan (Gives Merry 60% armour and a 30% attack boost for 30 seconds)

Here are my ideas, what do you all think?

Edited by Scryer, 13 February 2008 - 12:19 AM.

[Devon]

One thing I miss about bfme1 was that Rohan had Theoden and Eomer for 1200 and 1400, and then the three hunters later on for super late game. Starting with Rohan though, those are pretty good ideas!

Eomer either has or is planned to go back to his bfme1 skillset, when he had pillage at lvl 2 and horse lord at 4(or 3?). With a price drop to 1200 or 1400, that would definatly give him a purpose.

Erkenbrand imo should be more of an infantry buffing hero than a cav one, for both gameplay and lore purposes. The soldiers he led to helms deep were all on foot, and rohan has enough cav heros He could buff infantry speed and stuff

Gamling is the only archer hero, but he only has a bow when mounted. I like this it makes him interesting.

Not sure about Hama either, I always go for the classic heroes

Theoden...he's 3k, but I'd take Aragorn over him any day. He needs 1 more power and a buff to make him really a king. King's favor isnt really good atm, either buff it or replace it. His leadership could also be better. Could have a muster the rohirrim power, not sure what it would do

Eowyn: I like you idea's mostly. Her disguise is really pointless atm, seeing as she had the only white horse out of all the rohirrim if she looked exactly like a rohirrim, and had a couple hero killing powers, it would make her actually useful.

Now for hobbits. Bilbo is cool, that's why he's in I'm not sure, but either Bilbo or Frodo or all of the hobbits + gollum are going to be ringfinders. You can only find the ring with those units, as it doesn't spawn until they pass over where it is. So, all evil factions will have gollum, and all good factions with have one of the hobbits, I'm not sure which though. Now for powers.

Frodo: I like those ideas, maybe disguise too later on.
Sam: Again, maybe disguise, and something like "his will was set" that gives him a speed and armor boost. Could just be your thing renamed.

Pippin: If merry gets esquire, pippin should get guard of citadel I like entwater, I don't really see the point of inspiration If anything, faramir/gandalf should get that

Merry: I think that actually could be coded, I like the powers.

Keep it up!

[Dalf32]

i know it can be coded in bfme1 because i played a mod that allowed any hobbit to ride with any mounted hero or treebeard and throw rocks while riding! it was sooo awesome! i would assume that it could then be coded into bfme2 (and i assume into rotwk).

the sam power could be called "for frodo," only thing is im not sure if im stealing it from another mod or not (cant remember).

rohan heros: for me, ditto what yoda said. although, theoden's 'muster the rohirrim' power could just summon some guards (or whatever their hero-horde is) or perhaps just a group of assorted rohirrim.

and i would love to see the rb bonuses come back, especially since more than 2 factions could have multiple building options. perhaps we should only bring this back for maps where build-space is regulated though, because otherwise, late-game, units could become almost free or build almost immediately or whatever.

[Scryer]

One thing I miss about bfme1 was that Rohan had Theoden and Eomer for 1200 and 1400, and then the three hunters later on for super late game. Starting with Rohan though, those are pretty good ideas!

Eomer either has or is planned to go back to his bfme1 skillset, when he had pillage at lvl 2 and horse lord at 4(or 3?). With a price drop to 1200 or 1400, that would definatly give him a purpose.

Erkenbrand imo should be more of an infantry buffing hero than a cav one, for both gameplay and lore purposes. The soldiers he led to helms deep were all on foot, and rohan has enough cav heros He could buff infantry speed and stuff

Gamling is the only archer hero, but he only has a bow when mounted. I like this it makes him interesting.

Not sure about Hama either, I always go for the classic heroes

Theoden...he's 3k, but I'd take Aragorn over him any day. He needs 1 more power and a buff to make him really a king. King's favor isnt really good atm, either buff it or replace it. His leadership could also be better. Could have a muster the rohirrim power, not sure what it would do

Eowyn: I like you idea's mostly. Her disguise is really pointless atm, seeing as she had the only white horse out of all the rohirrim if she looked exactly like a rohirrim, and had a couple hero killing powers, it would make her actually useful.

Now for hobbits. Bilbo is cool, that's why he's in I'm not sure, but either Bilbo or Frodo or all of the hobbits + gollum are going to be ringfinders. You can only find the ring with those units, as it doesn't spawn until they pass over where it is. So, all evil factions will have gollum, and all good factions with have one of the hobbits, I'm not sure which though. Now for powers.

Frodo: I like those ideas, maybe disguise too later on.
Sam: Again, maybe disguise, and something like "his will was set" that gives him a speed and armor boost. Could just be your thing renamed.

Pippin: If merry gets esquire, pippin should get guard of citadel I like entwater, I don't really see the point of inspiration If anything, faramir/gandalf should get that

Merry: I think that actually could be coded, I like the powers.

Keep it up!

Thanks for the replies, Dalf and Yoda. I'm going to be picking on some small details with this post, though starting with Rohan's heroes. So please bear with me.

-Eomer- I don't think that he has a lack of purpose. I just think that there's something missing with him for the late game. I can't exactly place my finger on it, but I'm pretty sure that Eomer needs a late-game power that boosts economy or something. Once again, I really don't know.

-Theoden- I pretty much, would be happy with a "Muster the Rohirrim" power (assuming that you mean't that the power would summon 4 battalions of Rohan Riders or something along those lines). I would prefer that he summoned permanent units though, if it would be possible? I think that there's something missing in him as well. His price needs to be justified or lowered. Plus he needs (at the very least!!) a defence buff, like most of us have mentioned. I think that a buff to his "King's Favour" would be more appropriate than removing it altogether, unless you guys have an idea for a 'replacement' power? Sorry but a lot of that was a repeat from my last post.

-Erkenbrand- I hate to say this but he's too overpowered for me to believe that Eomer is leading the riders of rohan. Now that you've made me realize that you guys were making him more of a soldier-hero (as opposed to a calvary-hero), I'm starting to think that maybe he doesn't need a horse? You might have mentioned this, but I guess I didn't perceive it like that (<Grammar!). I might be thinking in the wrong direction though... I also realize the my knowledge of LOTR lore is soo rusty .

Now onto Hobbits. For this stuff, I'm not going to lie, it would based on the interpretation of the character of the hobbits. Which is how I based all my power-ideas from. Because there wasn't much opposition to Frodo (I believe?), I'm just gonna talk about my Sam, Merry, and Pippin's power-ideas (<Grammar.).

-Sam and Frodo-
I really don't like a disguise power for them unless it was a part of a campaign mission. I have no argument to back this up, other than I don't think that it truly suits them. Rip me to shreds (argument-wise) here but I just don't like a disguise power for either of them.

-Sam-
The reason that I called the power "One Last Hope" was because Sam was the one who almost gave up (on the stairs of Cirith Ungol) and he was the one that lead Frodo inside Mt. Doom. Plus he went berzerk in Cirith Ungol. The reason that I didn't name that power "For Frodo" (or something like that) is because I think that although Sam always focused his energy on Frodo, his intentions were much larger than that. This is going to be hard to explain....

I always interpreted that Sam focused his motivation on Frodo because he knew that they were the last hope of Middle-Earth. And he shows this after he heads back for Frodo in Shelob's lair and I interpreted that he continues to show this gallant behaviour right until the end of the book. And in the Crater of Mount Doom (forgot the chamber's name....), in the version that I read (which had gollum knocking him out); I'm pretty positive that Sam would've pushed Frodo off the edge, if he wasn't knocked out by Gollum, to save Middle-Earth.

This is such a minor detail, but I think that it shows my interpretation of Sam's character. I always viewed that Sam's courage/character came from more than "just saving a friend" in the end of the trilogy.

-Pippin-
I like entwater too. I felt like such a genius when I came up with that ! This is also going to be an argument on my interpretation of the books.

Anyways, I didn't give him a "Guard of the Citadel" power because he didn't really do much fierce fighting without Gandalf (or so I remember). Instead he saved Faramir. I didn't know what kind of a level 10 (or so) power that I wanted to give Pippin because he wasn't anxious (or mentally prepared) to do anykind of fighting, unlike Merry. Sure he had his 'fighting moments' but I don't think that that was his character to be honest. Out of all of the hobbit, I felt that Pippin was the hobbit who was the most attached to The Shire. He never wanted to be in Minas Tirith, Fangorn, etc. If anything, it was Merry who dragged him around to places like Isengard.

Maybe Pippin could get a passive defence/health regeneration boost but I never interpreted Pippin's character as much of a fighter. The reason that I gave him his "Inspiration" power was that I always thought that Pippin inspired the other characters to show their true qualities. So did Merry, to an extent. But Pippin was the character who led me to believe that Gandalf had a true compassion (I kinda knew this already, but Pippin emphasized it for me) for Middle-earth, that Denethor refused to see the "bad" in the things that he did because he knew that his doings were "bad", and Pippin just brought out and emphasized equalities for many other characters. That's the way I see him. Therefore, I think that Pippin should get a hero-boosting power. Maybe something similar to Gamling's, only weaker? I'm almost thinking a tiny leadership power for him, if that wasn't possible....

-Merry-
Unlike Pippin, Merry is pretty much a foil-character to him, for me. Out of all of the hobbits, I think that Merry should be the only one who should mount with another hero (if it's possible) rather than a speed-boosting power. As much as I think that Pippin should mount, his attitudes towards war were far more different from Merry's. Pippin basically only mounted with Gandalf to escape enemies. Anyways, I have nothing else to say for Merry.

Sorry about the lengthy post and I'm sorry that all of my arguments are just my opinions. In the end, I think that RJ will make the right decision (haha, no pressure) for this mod with what he wants to do with the Hobbit heroes. I have always wanted to have the hobbits be heroes where you would want them on the field after you've purchased 3 battalions of soldiers (or something).

Edited by Scryer, 14 February 2008 - 04:44 AM.

[dojob]

In general, I think that ranged 1-target-damaging powers are rather weak atm such as Eomer's spear throw and Carthaen's thing (forgot what its called :S ). Since Carthaen's thing is at level 4, I think it could be more powerful and should definitely do more damage.

[Gothmog14]

Here's an idea. Since buildings can now level up by themselves, how about you remove one of the two "buyable" building upgrades, and just make it so you can go straight to Rank 3 with a single purchase? It would cost more of course, but right there there is barely any advantage to going with the upgrades instead of letting it level (except for very, very late game where you've already won).

[Devon]

What if you're at max cp and want a lvl 2 barracks? Idk, I think it's good as is, though the price to lvl two should be dropped to 500 all around.

[Uruk King]

I've downloaded the mod (exllent work btw Rob!), in the fledgling campaign there aren't any character narration yet, howabout uploading audio voices from the moives for authenticity, and is something being done about heavy armour skins?