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New Network Bar Implementation: Some sites are being edited!


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#41 ambershee

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 03:36 PM

I've just noticed that SL's normally white background is now black due to the network bar implementation. I'll have to fix that in a couple of weeks when I get the chance - do we know what's causing it? I assume/hope it's something silly like a colour tag in the new network bar code.

Edited by ambershee, 10 November 2007 - 04:54 PM.


#42 Phil

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 03:50 PM

Before blaming the bar of "silly" things like colour tags you should maybe check your own stuff first. For example you could use a real stylesheet instead of a CSS file containing the html source code after that hacker attack.
Opera and IE seem to just ignore the stylesheet while FF reads that <td> elements should have a black background colour. I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion it was the bar that caused it, but I seriously doubt that it is to blame in this case...

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#43 Banshee

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:12 PM

The use of XHTML standard makes the browser more strict when rendering sites. So, wrongly coded sites will suffer. So, I don't blame the bar, although the demand to use XHTML has screwed up your site.
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#44 ambershee

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:53 PM

Before blaming the bar of "silly" things like colour tags you should maybe check your own stuff first. For example you could use a real stylesheet instead of a CSS file containing the html source code after that hacker attack.
Opera and IE seem to just ignore the stylesheet while FF reads that <td> elements should have a black background colour. I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion it was the bar that caused it, but I seriously doubt that it is to blame in this case...


I don't do anything other than minor maintenance on the website, as I'm no webmaster, so browser specific things are often enough fairly alien to me. I'm not saying that the problem is in the bar, but the changes in the bar has caused the issue to arise. Seeing as the bar was the only thing that changed, that's the obvious first place to look to see why.

The use of XHTML standard makes the browser more strict when rendering sites. So, wrongly coded sites will suffer. So, I don't blame the bar, although the demand to use XHTML has screwed up your site.


Thanks for that, that'll likely be the issue. I get the feeling this could require a bit of an overhaul, which means it's going to have to stay that way until Christmas and I get time to deal with it, either that or I find someone else to do it >.<

#45 Phil

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:08 PM

Looks like a pretty quick thing if you don't plan to have any changes in the design or layout. Give me a nudge if you want me to take a look.

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#46 Banshee

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:32 PM

I'm resuming my site fixing activities and I've fixed Battles of Gondor. That site was heavly modified, specially the .CSS files, because the change to XHTML totally ruined the original code.
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#47 Banshee

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Posted 13 November 2007 - 02:51 AM

I cleared cache, but it still appears vertical for me.


Hostile, there was a code at the CnC3.net index that added some debugging information before the XHTML header, for staff only. For this reason, everyone who were staff or better at CNC3.Net got the network bar broken, while normals users didn't had this problem. I was lucky to be an admin there to detect this issue. I've already fixed this problem. Your IE7 will now load the bar correctly there.
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#48 Hostile

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Posted 13 November 2007 - 04:37 AM

Seems to have done the job Banshee. Nice work.

#49 Kilkakon

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Posted 18 November 2007 - 12:44 PM

Banshee, I think this is more of my problem than yours, but anyway:

I've put the network bar at the bottom of my code, and made a space at the top for it to go into. For IE6, this works fine: (see attachment)

Unfortunately, on Dad's machine (with IE7) the bar nudged down the site anyway, despite the gap made. This is universal?

By the way, the reason for the gap is that the bar lacks the pages a little and degrades the effect I was after when I created the navigation.

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#50 Phil

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Posted 18 November 2007 - 01:08 PM

First I need to say that the new bar is not compatible with IE6, so what you see is the old bar.
Now, I'm not sure I have really understood what you wanted to do, but I guess you wanted the script to load at the end (which works) and then prevent the bar from pushing down all the content by reserving some space at the top?
If that is the case, you'd probably need to use a div with absolute positioning (0,0). I'm not quite sure what the final height of the bar is though, you'd need to test that...

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#51 Banshee

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Posted 18 November 2007 - 07:20 PM

Banshee, I think this is more of my problem than yours, but anyway:

I've put the network bar at the bottom of my code


If you do that, it will screw up on IE7. The bar must be placed in the beggining, right after the <body>, outside any other HTML structure.

By the way, the reason for the gap is that the bar lacks the pages a little and degrades the effect I was after when I created the navigation.

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The network bar can be skinned. I was still implementing the unskinned version of the bar on the network sites. I was going to do the skinned part later. Jeeves would also release a tutorial on the skinned bar, but I forgot the reason of why it wasn't released.
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#52 Kilkakon

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Posted 19 November 2007 - 11:56 AM

First I need to say that the new bar is not compatible with IE6, so what you see is the old bar.

Yes, I knew that one. That's why I'm here to ask about any possible solutions.

Now, I'm not sure I have really understood what you wanted to do, but I guess you wanted the script to load at the end (which works) and then prevent the bar from pushing down all the content by reserving some space at the top?

Yes. The old bar will add space where it is placed in the code, not at the top, whereas the current one doesn't. Is there a way to fix this?

If you do that, it will screw up on IE7. The bar must be placed in the beggining, right after the <body>, outside any other HTML structure.

That's the problem. It loads fine as far as I can remember, but ignores the space I have already put in. It isn't in any DIV tags or anything; I was relying on the JavaScript.

The network bar can be skinned. I was still implementing the unskinned version of the bar on the network sites. I was going to do the skinned part later. Jeeves would also release a tutorial on the skinned bar, but I forgot the reason of why it wasn't released.

Thanks for the tip, as for many sites this is good as the bar sticks out too much. For me, I think that your default one is really good. It's the lag factor that I'm trying to counter.

This is a snippet of the code:

...
<body>
<div style="width:100%;height:26px;color:#FFFFFF;background:#000000;">
Loading <i>Revora</i> Bar...
</div>
...
<!--If I put it here, it doesn't lag the page loading-->
<script type="text/javascript" language="javascript" src="http://www.revora.net/bar.js"></script>
</body>
</html>

Thanks for your help, Banshee and Dark Lord.
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#53 Phil

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Posted 19 November 2007 - 05:24 PM

I've looked into your idea, it does actually work. In fact, you can place the script include file at the bottom, not even IE complains as long as it's not contained by some other element (e.g. a div).
Now, to make your placeholder div you will only need to assign it:
height: 52px;  /* 22px bar + 30px extra space */
width: 100%;
position: absolute;
top: 0;
left: 0;
I've slightly edited the default stylesheet, so you don't need to use a z-index on the placeholder div anymore. Note that when loading the bar it looks a bit ugly because it loads the text faster than the background, so you'll look at a mess for a second if you use text in the div (like "Loading Revora Network Bar..."). It's your choice though.

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Und da war dann noch der achte.
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Und der achte war's, der sie bewachte.


#54 Kilkakon

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Posted 21 November 2007 - 11:05 AM

I've looked into your idea, it does actually work. In fact, you can place the script include file at the bottom, not even IE complains as long as it's not contained by some other element (e.g. a div).
Now, to make your placeholder div you will only need to assign it:

height: 52px;  /* 22px bar + 30px extra space */
width: 100%;
position: absolute;
top: 0;
left: 0;
I've slightly edited the default stylesheet, so you don't need to use a z-index on the placeholder div anymore. Note that when loading the bar it looks a bit ugly because it loads the text faster than the background, so you'll look at a mess for a second if you use text in the div (like "Loading Revora Network Bar..."). It's your choice though.

Done. Thanks for your help!
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#55 Phil

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Posted 21 November 2007 - 12:40 PM

It still pushes down the content a bit though. You'd need to remove the second div before the table:
<div style="...">
&nbsp;
</div>

<!-- REMOVE -->
<div style="height:52px;z-index:-1;">
&nbsp;
</div>
<!-- /REMOVE -->

<table width="100%" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">


Then, for example, add
position: relative;
top: 30px;
to the style of the table in order to avoid operlapping by the placeholder.

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My Political Compass

Sieben Elefanten hatte Herr Dschin
Und da war dann noch der achte.
Sieben waren wild und der achte war zahm
Und der achte war's, der sie bewachte.


#56 Radspakr Wolfbane

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 04:07 AM

Lone Wolf has been updated.
What will happen with IE6 when the old bar is removed.
Will there just not be a
userbar?

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#57 Kilkakon

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 11:20 AM

It still pushes down the content a bit though. You'd need to remove the second div before the table:

<div style="...">
&nbsp;
</div>

<!-- REMOVE -->
<div style="height:52px;z-index:-1;">
&nbsp;
</div>
<!-- /REMOVE -->

<table width="100%" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">


Then, for example, add
position: relative;
top: 30px;
to the style of the table in order to avoid operlapping by the placeholder.

The second div was to work around the IE6 space needed. I've fixed the problem that caused its necessity and added your solution.

It's probably a good idea to check the site again, just in case. Thanks again for your help!
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#58 Phil

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 11:35 AM

Damnit, it still pushes down the content somehow. Try using
position: absolute;
top: 52px;
for the table instead. 52px leaves no space between the black and the actual site start. 60px would probably look good if you want a little space.

Although now that I think of it, overriding the bar styles would probably look better because you can avoid that extra black space... I'll dig out the codes and then post them here.

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My Political Compass

Sieben Elefanten hatte Herr Dschin
Und da war dann noch der achte.
Sieben waren wild und der achte war zahm
Und der achte war's, der sie bewachte.


#59 Banshee

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 11:50 AM

Lone Wolf has been updated.
What will happen with IE6 when the old bar is removed.
Will there just not be a
userbar?


At the moment, we have no answers for this question. We'll keep the old bar for some years, until IE6 gets more unpopular.
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