Ah, fantastic. I'm going to have me some fun with this one. Despite Fen's cynicism. I really hope this vegan returns.Ash's post is the most bigotted, opinionated stuff I've seen for a long time.
Uh, no it's not, and that's complete drivel, quite frankly. I would LOVE you to find a source.Milk causes cancer. You don't think so, huh. One of the most common forms of breast cancer is estrogen related.
FACT #1: The most common breast cancer sufferers are women.
FACT #2: Oestrogen is a female hormone related to the menstrual cycle, primarily found in women.
BASELESS ASSUMPTION #1: Therefore, breast cancer is linked to oestrogen.
It's fucking Pearson's Correlation 101 that the two would correlate - they both happen to the same fucking gender! There is no evidence WHATSOEVER to support the argument that oestrogen caused any broken genes, nor is there any evidence that milk is the causal factor (the woman might naturally produce more oestrogen). Also, you, good sir/madam/gerbil, have failed to take into account any of the other factors that are known correlates/predisposers to breast cancer. Here's an easy one for you.
Let's list some of the primary risk factors, of which I should draw your attention to the fact that milk is not among them:
By disregarding all the other possible factors, predisposers, etc, you really are making what we of the scientific and rational community would call a shit argument. There are plenty of other things that could cause it, same as there are plenty of other things that could be going on that could stop it. If we're going to play the numbers game, let's look at the amount of people who DO drink milk and get breast cancer, the amount of people who DON'T drink milk and get cancer, and the amount of people who DON'T drink milk and DON'T get cancer, before we start bandying around silly alarmist argument that make no sense.The primary risk factors that have been identified are sex, [ed: OBVIOUS] age [the older you are, the more susceptible you are anyway], childbearing [if you have kids, you're at greater risk since your breast cells activate], hormones [not necessarily oestrogen, but thre are more reasons that it could be abnormally high than because you drink milk], a high-fat diet [linked with a million other illnesses, and easily can occur if you eat peanuts, legumes, etc], alcohol intake [not just milk, see?], obesity [see high-fat diet], and environmental factors such as tobacco use [known carcinogen], radiation [known carcinogen] and shiftwork.
Go away and bring me a source for this repugnant load of bullshit. There is no more oestrogen in cow's milk than there is in the cow. Also note: OESTROGEN IS NOT A GROWTH HORMONE. Also, cow oestrogen will have precisely no effect on humans, because we aren't cows. We lack the receptors to receive their oestrogen. Why do you think you can't just give any old insulin from any old animal to humans? Only primates and pigs have 'compatible' insulin. And if you were a diabetic, I doubt you'd be mouthing off about that exploitation of animals, or that particular application of genetic modification. Go do some research before YOU mouth off, you putrid welt.Guess what contains enormous amounts of estrogen? Cow milk. Why? Because they pump the cows full of growth hormones and the cow lactates when its pregnant. Go ask an oncologist before you mouth off.
If you eat too much of any food, it's going to make you fucking fat. FAT is what gives you man boobs, not oestrogen. Notice any fat guys whose voices are a bit higher than normal, and who can't grow a beard, or even stubble? Trust me, grease-stain, that's obesity, not oestrogen. A completely different pathogen, I think you should note. But of course, it has to be meat that's causing the problem! Because vegetarians and vegans don't ever eat chips, one of the fattiest common foods I can think of!The other place you find high concentrations of estrogen is in cow meat. By the way, if you're a guy, its probably giving you man boobs too.
Oh, yes, because we're eating meat we're obviously eating rotting flesh, like some sort of pallid necromancer. Yes, of course. That sort of pathetic witticism is about what I'd expect from a mindless bigot. To refer you to your very first sentence - note that I'm not averse to the practice of not eating meat (I did date a vegetarian for some considerable time, and she was fine with me eating meat). I'm averse to cunts like you trying to pollute the rest of the world with your nonsensical holier-than-thou attitude. Thank you so very much for proving my point absolutely splendidly! And neither of those things are even in milk. That's total bullshit anyway. Blood vessels run near milk ducts, not in them. Otherwise the cow would be bleeding or infected, and would probably have been treated.Pus and blood in your milk doesn't bother you? Well I'd expect so as eating the rotting dead carcase of dead animal doesn't either.
Even if, by some improbability of nature along the lines of Nostradamus' prophecies, you're right, and pus and blood are in the milk, we have invented pasteurisation. Perhaps you'd like to look it up. The process has been used for decades and, as yet, only lactose intolerant people have ever had any adverse effects to drinking pasteurised milk that's not gone off.
Ah, so do you walk around naked in the street, then? Got something against cotton too now, have we?Finally we have all that usual bilge about it being natural to eat meat. If you think its so natural, I suggest you strip naked (nothing natural about clothes you know) wander into the nearest forest and see how well equiped you are to catch an animal, rip its flesh off and then digest the uncooked meat. Natural, hah!
Humans are omnivorous, capable of consuming both plant and animal products. Varying with available food sources in regions of habitation, and also varying with cultural and religious norms, human groups have adopted a range of diets, from purely vegetarian to primarily carnivorous. In some cases, dietary restrictions in humans can lead to deficiency diseases;
Also, note that humans are not the only animals who use tools to obtain food. Chimpanzees use sticks to fish for termites, and even some birds, including crows, will do the same. Humans are perfectly capable of digesting uncooked meat, so long as it's fresh, right off the bone. It takes a day or two to be contaminated such that we can't eat it without cooking. Have you never heard of a 'blue' steak? Or, more usually seen, a 'rare' steak? I've eaten insects, raw and alive. Not very tasty, but it didn't kill me. There is a reason we have acid in our stomachs; to kill pathogens that might harm us.
Actually, there we go, perfect way to dick your argument totally:
You're so up in arms about humans eating meat. Why don't you go complain to the fucking tigers, lions, hyenas, etc? They're killing and eating animals too! If you're going to complain about humans eating meat, the least you could do is dispense your bigotry fairly and berate tigers and sharks for their obstinate refusal to stick to a diet of beans and leaves.
Total, complete and utter bullshit. Not only has the transformation not been in the least bit rapid (or else tigers would go down with gazelle flu, and you don't hear that very often, do you?), but swine and avian flu aren't even actually the viruses that infect those animals. We have given them that name because their chemical makeup looks similar to those two animals' flu variants. Additionally, humans have been eating meat since before we were actually H. sapiens sapiens. Pretty much every species in the family hominidae is an omnivore. That's not even mentioning early ancetral human species. Without meat-eaters, you would not exist, because plant matter is energy inefficient, by and large. By far the most successful congregations of large quantities of people are when livestock have been kept.Apart from all the harm it does to those who consume it, meat production also has facilitated the rapid transformation of animal to human viruses like swine flu an avian flu.
Where they are promptly metabolised by fish, plankton, insects, or simply denature and disappear. Unless you dump a full cow carcass into a river, it's really not going to hurt you. Perhaps you'd like to spare a thought for all the hundreds of thousands of bacteria your body's natural immunity wipes out every day? Maybe you refuse to take antibiotics because you can't bear the thought of the massacre of all those poor, defenceless little pathogens? Shed a tear for every insect that loses out because you ate a plant it could have, or for the many insects, some microscopic, that you inhale and that drown in your lung fluid and mucus. Watch where you step, too, because there might be ants underfoot, and think of all the detritivorous microorganisms that die every time you flush your turd down the loo. And, as I mentioned earlier, all those poor, exploited Escherichia coli who produce insulin at our behest, saving the lives of tens of thousands of diabetics daily. Think of those poor, exploited yeast, who slave daily to ferment our fruit and vegetable juices into alcohol, only to be poisoned by their own natural creation, or to aid in the creation of the bread vegans practically live on.Its waste products run off into our water supplies. It takes 10 times as much vegetable protien to produce one oz of animal protien. And an incredible amount of energy is wasted in producing just a single cow. Many of the unhealty evils are caused by factory farming - as is the cruelty involved.
Think of the plants whose energy is wasted to produce the leaves, fruits, beans, seeds and stalks that you rely on. They need that energy, and those parts, to survive and reproduce. YOU ARE DENYING THEM THAT. How the fuck can you live with yourself? All that cruelty. All the suffering and exploitation and energy and work done by the plant only to fill your belly. THAT is every bit as cruel. And don't say that the crops are cultivated for us - so too are the cows and the pigs and the sheep and the chickens we eat.
An incredible amount of energy is not wasted to produce a single cow - what a callous attitude you have for that cow! I'd argue that the plant's energy is wasted creating you, not just for the reasons I have previously iterated, but because you're such a fucking waste of space that you aren't worth feeding. You honestly believe all animals are kept in squalid hellholes and abject misery. That simply isn't at all true. And even if it was, the animals are our property - you believe it's OK to kill plants and eat them, why is a cow any different?
Probably not. You have no evidence, at all, to suggest that the animals are kept in anything other than humane conditions, well-fed, well-watered, well looked-after. There is no reason to believe the animals are unhappy. They don't even suffer in death. Let me ask you this: Your dog got cancer. It's on the last inch of its life and is suffering. Do you think it is more cruel to have it put down, or to leave it alive to suffer more?If you curbed your appetite for meat, the animals would be happier,
Also, let me ask you this: You have two choices in my current scenario: You are in the Gobi desert. There is no plant life within your ability to walk to it, as your camel has just died. You are hungry. If you eat the camel, you'll live long enough to be rescued. If you don't, you will starve to death. What do you do?
Bullshit. Plants are not efficient energy sources. Think of all the trees we'd have to cut down just to fit all the extra farmland on (and you PETA types are nothing if not anti-deforestation! Oohh, double standards, fucktard). Not to mention the cruelty to vegetables. What sort of processes don't you think vegetable-based foods go through? Never heard of fertiliser? Pesticide? Preservative treatment? Cross-cut cloning (you don't even want to know what genetic modification went on to make broccoli, cauliflower and maize-wheat). You know that apple you're munching on? I hope you washed it first...oh wait. That'd hurt all the precious little bacterias....our environment cleaner
Not so. I'm not about to die of anaemia or protein deficiency. And just because I eat meat doesn't mean I don't eat plants. The world isn't so fucking black and white as that. True, if I eat 9 steaks a day, 5 burgers and 20 glasses of full-fat milk a day, I'm probably not going to be all that healthy. But neither is someone who eats 20 packets of crisps, 5 bags of peanuts, and 20 glasses of orange juice. Everything is OK in moderation.and - you would be healthier!
Better luck next time, you overpious preachy shithead.
@Vort: I take issue with the attitude and the preachiness. That's why I created this thread. If he wants to disagree, that's fine, but look at his post. His post proves my point about overpious holier-than-thou bollocks about how we're all damned to hell because we eat the occasional burger. That is why I flame, not because he disagrees. He's welcome to do that, but he's also welcome to not talk down at me like I'm some sort of retard because I eat what I want to eat, not what he doesn't want me to eat.
