24 replies to this topic

[dancam]

Our idea is to make more services which are common to all divisions available on the main site so we can more efficiently manage and improve them.
Current plans include:

- a new hosting portal (including info, faq, howtos and form), which has already been in the works and is nearly finished
- a new centralised download system for mods, possibly inspired by SourceForge
- ready-to-use website templates for new projects, so you're no longer obliged to create your own site if you don't wish to
- a coding framework for new division websites that will make administration and founding of new divisions easier

Primarily, the idea is that by streamlining the existing sites, and potentially by making them very similar, possibly to the extent of making all Revora sites use the same basic template, we could spend more time managing the network, and creating content. Using this new system, any new hostee would have a page created under their network hub (eg CNCGuild) with details of their mod, news posts and some basic info. By sending a few graphics to the Network Admin, this would create your own mini-site within the existing Hub site, and reduce the need for hostees to create their own sites. This again, would allow you to focus on the creation of your projects and not a site. Note: The creation of a site would still be possible.

This very much goes against how Revora has been run previously, which was very decentralised. Decentralisation has a lot of plus points, including unique web sites, which potentially encourages creativity. However, decentralisation requires a lot of work for both staff members and hostees.

What do you think?

[Detail]

Your other 3 recent feedback topics were good, but this one is mostly "well duh, just do it"

The feedback you want for centralisation of decentralisation depends greatly on the outcome of: http://forums.revora...showtopic=68245
It's a bit like collecting the materials for building a house, but you don't know if you're building a skyscraper or a bungalow.

[Banshee]

Hosting portal

I suggest to place 'the hosting portal' inside the Revora site itself instead of split it. And yea, make hosting.revora.net to redirect to http://www.revora.net/#hosting


New centralized download system

Also, insert it inside revora.net as a Downloads section.


Ready To Use WebTemplates For Hostees

If there were enough resources to create it, it should be interesting. But I'd place it low on priorities for now.


Division Sites Framework

I think this one is very important, even if Mastermind disagrees. Its currently decentralized, but I'd centralize it in one place, as well as the databases from every division. We should use the Site Key to define the scope of what each site can access in the database and store ranks and its permissions for each of the site. The whole T3A articles system engine should be transferred inside some revora.net subdomain. Division sites should simply include it and pass the appropriate parameters, as well as store the templates.

[Phil]

Placing those services "inside" the main page is both hard technically because of the dynamic loading and would require a second-level navigation, as you cannot fit all information about hosting into a single page. However, we can easily link back an forth between those portals (obviously) and using subdomains actually helps people understand where they are (downloads.revora.net is about as intuitive as it can possibly get, IMO).

The website templates for hostees should be rather easy and fast to do if we just make it very limited. Still, that would be an improvement if you ask me.

In regard to the division framework, I think this should be one of our top long-term priorities. I think though that it's technically impossible for every division to use the same files (because of suexec).
We could, however, make sure we separate the "core" or "backend" of the system from the site-specific parts, so we can easily upgrade that part for every site without affecting the user interface. It's really just a matter of proper design and coordination.

[ambershee]

The real question, is what effect, if any, would this have on those who fall largely outside the established divisions?

[Banshee]

There are many effects. The main one is the possibility of creating new divisions to cover these people in a quicker and easier way.

[dancam]

I think DLOTS that whilst it may be somewhat more difficult to implement, the usage and general 'tightness' of the websites would vindicate the extra time involved in doing so. We have a habit of creating a new site for every little whim when more often than not using existing sites would be a better option.

[Phil]

Now I'm not sure what exactly you're refering to...

[Banshee]

Placing those services "inside" the main page is both hard technically because of the dynamic loading and would require a second-level navigation, as you cannot fit all information about hosting into a single page. However, we can easily link back an forth between those portals (obviously) and using subdomains actually helps people understand where they are (downloads.revora.net is about as intuitive as it can possibly get, IMO).

I haven't made a Network menu for nothing. All you need is a Hosting menu and a Downloads menu. Problem solved.

In regard to the division framework, I think this should be one of our top long-term priorities. I think though that it's technically impossible for every division to use the same files (because of suexec).
We could, however, make sure we separate the "core" or "backend" of the system from the site-specific parts, so we can easily upgrade that part for every site without affecting the user interface. It's really just a matter of proper design and coordination.

The core process the whole data. The division simply includes the core and pass the appropriate parameters. It's exactly what we currently do with Masternews. 100% possible. The only problem is that Petrolution's data would have to be reallocated (using T3A as standard), so the game numbers and number of a couple of articles would change. But I'd care of that on my own, if needed.

[Detail]

Meh. Technology should never be used as an excuse not to do something. There is always a way round coding problems.
All that matters is what the viewer experiences.

A new hosting portal

It would be helpful to the viewer. Providing links to it are given a good descriptions - else people might click a link on cncra3.net and be confused to be on a completely different site.

A new centralised download system for mods

Sounds like a fancy download counter to me.

Ready-to-use website templates for new projects

Might as well use Wordpress

a coding framework for new division websites that will make administration and founding of new divisions easier

A new division should either be
- hand made, to fit the unique needs of the new division
- copy/pasted, from an already good similar division

Edited by D, 27 January 2009 - 11:17 PM.

[ambershee]

Meh. Technology should never be used as an excuse not to do something. There is always a way round coding problems.

Yes it should, and no there isn't - hard facts of reality. The end-user experience is limited by your capabilities, regardless of whatever workarounds you may come up with.

[Phil]

I haven't made a Network menu for nothing. All you need is a Hosting menu and a Downloads menu. Problem solved.

Not quite, but I won't go into further technical details. Doing so would mean we (or I) would need to rewrite the whole front page system, which wouldn't be a bad thing in itself. It will just delay things more, obviously.

The core process the whole data. The division simply includes the core and pass the appropriate parameters. It's exactly what we currently do with Masternews. 100% possible. The only problem is that Petrolution's data would have to be reallocated (using T3A as standard), so the game numbers and number of a couple of articles would change. But I'd care of that on my own, if needed.

These are very low-level problems when we're building a new system from the ground up. We'd just need to ensure that we start with a very good design in the first place, but that's material for a technical discussion. I think we agree that we should actually do this anyway.

[Bart]

The whole T3A articles system engine should be transferred inside some revora.net subdomain.

Noooooo! That piece of crap has server it's purpose now, time to replace it
In fact, I'm interested in remaking it. First, I'll work on my own MVC framework to make it usable. Then, I'll create a new version of the site system, but this time with portability in mind. That means separation of back-end and front-end stuff.

I think this one is very important, even if Mastermind disagrees. Its currently decentralized, but I'd centralize it in one place, as well as the databases from every division. We should use the Site Key to define the scope of what each site can access in the database and store ranks and its permissions for each of the site. The whole T3A articles system engine should be transferred inside some revora.net subdomain. Division sites should simply include it and pass the appropriate parameters, as well as store the templates.

I think though that it's technically impossible for every division to use the same files (because of suexec).

There's no reason for centralising the database. The back-end code can very easily be centralised though. It's a matter of putting it in a shared directory (like /usr/local/lib) and giving read-access to everyone. This has nothing to do with domains and stuff, that's all for the client side.

The division simply includes the core and pass the appropriate parameters. It's exactly what we currently do with Masternews.

Actually, masternews works a bit more complicated. It creates the news files in some subdomain of the webserver, where other sites request it. They do this through the server. This is like using your cell phone to call your brother, who is sitting next to you, and asking him to pass the salt. Sure, it works (and you can reach your brother anywhere) but for something less trivial than getting salt or the news, it's too slow.

It would be helpful to the viewer. Providing links to it are given a good descriptions - else people might click a link on cncra3.net and be confused to be on a completely different site.

That's a matter of linking files to a specific site, and show a proper header/colour theme accordingly.

Sounds like a fancy download counter to me.

Not if you also add automatic mirroring, bittorrent, etc. Those are things we really need to cut on our bandwidth usage.

Might as well use Wordpress

Yuk, wordpress. Sure, it works great for blogs (I use it myself) but people (mainly the buzz-sensitive ones) are trying to stretch it to every possible purpose. It wasn't made for that. :(
Woops, got a little confused here. Thought that the suggestion was to use WP for division sites. For simple hosted sites, a ready-to-go wordpress package (including a selection of themes, with the network bar and google ad pre-integrated) would actually be great.

Yes it should, and no there isn't - hard facts of reality. The end-user experience is limited by your capabilities, regardless of whatever workarounds you may come up with.

Quite true of course, though I should add that if there's a workaround or uncommon solution, you should use it (provided that it's benefits are worth the effort, of course). The end-user won't care what you do, as long as they get what they want.

[Clement]

About wordpress for hostees websites, does it really answer to their needed? (I don't know what ewactly wordpress provides)
It seems that the features below are needed:
- News system (common..)
- Menu links
- Galleries (images, videos, musics...)

So it has to be oriented to media, does wordpress provide that?

[Detail]

Yeh, Wordpress does that, and in a really easy to use way too.

[Bart]

Although sites that use WordPress will probably not use MasterNews, since it provides a blog.

Is that bad? No, not really. I guess we should develop some sort of plugin to allow people to post comments with their revora account, maybe.

[Bart]

Illustration to my previous post.

The rectangles are sites.
Rounded rectangles are services.
Yellow blocks are PHP libaries.
FastMVC is my MVC framework.

Attached Thumbnails

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[Phil]

Are you sure you don't wish to use some framework out there that already exists (and works) than writing everything yourself? I'll leave the decision up to you, I just want to know you've considered that.

Also: suexec.
Edit: Seems I was mistaken about suexec and it is possibly to include a common core or libraries of the application. Makes it easier for us.

Edited by Dark Lord of the Sith, 29 January 2009 - 08:29 PM.

[Banshee]

If we use a wordpress that is synchronized with MasterNews instead of its own blog features, then it is not a bad idea. Unfortunately, that would give the staff here a lot of work and Revora lack resources to do it.

[Phil]

Yeah it's certainly a lower priority than the other technical improvements.