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Ever wonder why bfme2 is the way it is?


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#1 ttandchotmail

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 09:03 AM

G'day to all

I have seen many people talk about how EA are crap and that the state of bfme2 is bad to say the least. Bugs everywhere, hundreds of animations, voices, special effects, objects in the programming but not even used in the game.

Ever wonder why?

Well a couple of years ago I came across a very sad news article which caught my eye about the almighty, challenge everything EA. I actually replied to this journal and got a reply from EA spouse and found out it was BFME2 that her husband was working on at the time. I'll post her reply after this post.

Follow the link and you'll see for yourself.

http://ea-spouse.livejournal.com/


Or read below



My significant other works for Electronic Arts, and I'm what you might call a disgruntled spouse.

EA's bright and shiny new corporate trademark is "Challenge Everything." Where this applies is not exactly clear. Churning out one licensed football game after another doesn't sound like challenging much of anything to me; it sounds like a money farm. To any EA executive that happens to read this, I have a good challenge for you: how about safe and sane labor practices for the people on whose backs you walk for your millions?

I am retaining some anonymity here because I have no illusions about what the consequences would be for my family if I was explicit. However, I also feel no impetus to shy away from sharing our story, because I know that it is too common to stick out among those of the thousands of engineers, artists, and designers that EA employs.

Our adventures with Electronic Arts began less than a year ago. The small game studio that my partner worked for collapsed as a result of foul play on the part of a big publisher -- another common story. Electronic Arts offered a job, the salary was right and the benefits were good, so my SO took it. I remember that they asked him in one of the interviews: "how do you feel about working long hours?" It's just a part of the game industry -- few studios can avoid a crunch as deadlines loom, so we thought nothing of it. When asked for specifics about what "working long hours" meant, the interviewers coughed and glossed on to the next question; now we know why.

Within weeks production had accelerated into a 'mild' crunch: eight hours six days a week. Not bad. Months remained until any real crunch would start, and the team was told that this "pre-crunch" was to prevent a big crunch toward the end; at this point any other need for a crunch seemed unlikely, as the project was dead on schedule. I don't know how many of the developers bought EA's explanation for the extended hours; we were new and naive so we did. The producers even set a deadline; they gave a specific date for the end of the crunch, which was still months away from the title's shipping date, so it seemed safe. That date came and went. And went, and went. When the next news came it was not about a reprieve; it was another acceleration: twelve hours six days a week, 9am to 10pm.

Weeks passed. Again the producers had given a termination date on this crunch that again they failed. Throughout this period the project remained on schedule. The long hours started to take its toll on the team; people grew irritable and some started to get ill. People dropped out in droves for a couple of days at a time, but then the team seemed to reach equilibrium again and they plowed ahead. The managers stopped even talking about a day when the hours would go back to normal.

Now, it seems, is the "real" crunch, the one that the producers of this title so wisely prepared their team for by running them into the ground ahead of time. The current mandatory hours are 9am to 10pm -- seven days a week -- with the occasional Saturday evening off for good behavior (at 6:30pm). This averages out to an eighty-five hour work week. Complaints that these once more extended hours combined with the team's existing fatigue would result in a greater number of mistakes made and an even greater amount of wasted energy were ignored.

The stress is taking its toll. After a certain number of hours spent working the eyes start to lose focus; after a certain number of weeks with only one day off fatigue starts to accrue and accumulate exponentially. There is a reason why there are two days in a weekend -- bad things happen to one's physical, emotional, and mental health if these days are cut short. The team is rapidly beginning to introduce as many flaws as they are removing.

And the kicker: for the honor of this treatment EA salaried employees receive a) no overtime; b) no compensation time! ('comp' time is the equalization of time off for overtime -- any hours spent during a crunch accrue into days off after the product has shipped); c) no additional sick or vacation leave. The time just goes away. Additionally, EA recently announced that, although in the past they have offered essentially a type of comp time in the form of a few weeks off at the end of a project, they no longer wish to do this, and employees shouldn't expect it. Further, since the production of various games is scattered, there was a concern on the part of the employees that developers would leave one crunch only to join another. EA's response was that they would attempt to minimize this, but would make no guarantees. This is unthinkable; they are pushing the team to individual physical health limits, and literally giving them nothing for it. Comp time is a staple in this industry, but EA as a corporation wishes to "minimize" this reprieve. One would think that the proper way to minimize comp time is to avoid crunch, but this brutal crunch has been on for months, and nary a whisper about any compensation leave, nor indeed of any end of this treatment.

This crunch also differs from crunch time in a smaller studio in that it was not an emergency effort to save a project from failure. Every step of the way, the project remained on schedule. Crunching neither accelerated this nor slowed it down; its effect on the actual product was not measurable. The extended hours were deliberate and planned; the management knew what they were doing as they did it. The love of my life comes home late at night complaining of a headache that will not go away and a chronically upset stomach, and my happy supportive smile is running out.

No one works in the game industry unless they love what they do. No one on that team is interested in producing an inferior product. My heart bleeds for this team precisely BECAUSE they are brilliant, talented individuals out to create something great. They are and were more than willing to work hard for the success of the title. But that good will has only been met with abuse. Amazingly, Electronic Arts was listed #91 on Fortune magazine's "100 Best Companies to Work For" in 2003.

EA's attitude toward this -- which is actually a part of company policy, it now appears -- has been (in an anonymous quotation that I've heard repeated by multiple managers), "If they don't like it, they can work someplace else." Put up or shut up and leave: this is the core of EA's Human Resources policy. The concept of ethics or compassion or even intelligence with regard to getting the most out of one's workforce never enters the equation: if they don't want to sacrifice their lives and their health and their talent so that a multibillion dollar corporation can continue its Godzilla-stomp through the game industry, they can work someplace else.

But can they?

The EA Mambo, paired with other giants such as Vivendi, Sony, and Microsoft, is rapidly either crushing or absorbing the vast majority of the business in game development. A few standalone studios that made their fortunes in previous eras -- Blizzard, Bioware, and Id come to mind -- manage to still survive, but 2004 saw the collapse of dozens of small game studios, no longer able to acquire contracts in the face of rapid and massive consolidation of game publishing companies. This is an epidemic hardly unfamiliar to anyone working in the industry. Though, of course, it is always the option of talent to go outside the industry, perhaps venturing into the booming commercial software development arena. (Read my tired attempt at sarcasm.)

To put some of this in perspective, I myself consider some figures. If EA truly believes that it needs to push its employees this hard -- I actually believe that they don't, and that it is a skewed operations perspective alone that results in the severity of their crunching, coupled with a certain expected amount of the inefficiency involved in running an enterprise as large as theirs -- the solution therefore should be to hire more engineers, or artists, or designers, as the case may be. Never should it be an option to punish one's workforce with ninety hour weeks; in any other industry the company in question would find itself sued out of business so fast its stock wouldn't even have time to tank. In its first weekend, Madden 2005 grossed $65 million. EA's annual revenue is approximately $2.5 billion. This company is not strapped for cash; their labor practices are inexcusable.

The interesting thing about this is an assumption that most of the employees seem to be operating under. Whenever the subject of hours come up, inevitably, it seems, someone mentions 'exemption'. They refer to a California law that supposedly exempts businesses from having to pay overtime to certain 'specialty' employees, including software programmers. This is Senate Bill 88. However, Senate Bill 88 specifically does not apply to the entertainment industry -- television, motion picture, and theater industries are specifically mentioned. Further, even in software, there is a pay minimum on the exemption: those exempt must be paid at least $90,000 annually. I can assure you that the majority of EA employees are in fact not in this pay bracket; ergo, these practices are not only unethical, they are illegal.

I look at our situation and I ask 'us': why do you stay? And the answer is that in all likelihood we won't; and in all likelihood if we had known that this would be the result of working for EA, we would have stayed far away in the first place. But all along the way there were deceptions, there were promises, there were assurances -- there was a big fancy office building with an expensive fish tank -- all of which in the end look like an elaborate scheme to keep a crop of employees on the project just long enough to get it shipped. And then if they need to, they hire in a new batch, fresh and ready to hear more promises that will not be kept; EA's turnover rate in engineering is approximately 50%. This is how EA works. So now we know, now we can move on, right? That seems to be what happens to everyone else. But it's not enough. Because in the end, regardless of what happens with our particular situation, this kind of "business" isn't right, and people need to know about it, which is why I write this today.

If I could get EA CEO Larry Probst on the phone, there are a few things I would ask him. "What's your salary?" would be merely a point of curiosity. The main thing I want to know is, Larry: you do realize what you're doing to your people, right? And you do realize that they ARE people, with physical limits, emotional lives, and families, right? Voices and talents and senses of humor and all that? That when you keep our husbands and wives and children in the office for ninety hours a week, sending them home exhausted and numb and frustrated with their lives, it's not just them you're hurting, but everyone around them, everyone who loves them? When you make your profit calculations and your cost analyses, you know that a great measure of that cost is being paid in raw human dignity, right?

Right?

Edited by ttandchotmail, 19 November 2009 - 05:41 AM.

No chance of returning....Zero chance of surviving....Well!? When do we get started?
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#2 ttandchotmail

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 09:07 AM

Here is my post to the live jounal site and the reply from EA spouse

Dated 20th January 2007


ea_spouse (ea_spouse) replied to your LiveJournal comment in which you said:

Wow EA spouse I can really feel what your saying here. Your use of words has opened my eyes to what goes on with EA. If you visit the Electonic Arts lord of the rings battle for middle earth 2 forum you can find me there. I for one can now understand why this game is in the state it's in. A lot of gamers there are actually talking about boycotting all EA games due to a severe lack of technical support and community response. But I can now see it's not the employees that are the problem it's the management and upper management. I hope this story you've told here has had a happy ending for you and your family.

Regards

ttandc


Their reply was:
Subject: Re: wow
Hi there, and thanks for your message. It's good to hear from someone who played the game, I know there are so many, but I haven't exchanged much with the fans.

Any failings you're finding certainly weren't the team's fault. They were up against phenomenal odds and they worked like dogs on that game, I can promise you. They're great people and they did a tremendous job in spite of the conditions they worked under. It's remarkable, given the conditions, that the game came out as well as it did -- which is to say very well -- and is a testament to the skill and dedication of the individuals involved.

As I understand it, things are better at the studio now, and the guys immediately responsible for that particular project (though I think the overall responsibility chain does go all the way up to the top) are no longer there. Then again, most of the BFME2 team has also moved on from what I understand.

Thanks again for your note, and for stopping by. =)

Edited by ttandchotmail, 18 November 2009 - 09:12 AM.

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#3 ttandchotmail

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 09:15 AM

Some of the replies on this site are amazing
http://ea-spouse.liv...al.com/274.html

And these are some of the news articles on it

http://kotaku.com/27...pouse-revisited

http://pchiusano.blo...pouse-case.html

http://au.gamespot.c...ws/6148369.html

Edited by ttandchotmail, 18 November 2009 - 09:20 AM.

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#4 ttandchotmail

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 09:28 AM

If you've read this far then good for you :good: An amazing story that opened my eyes a bit to the games industry. I never flamed the development team after reading this and felt more respect for what they actually did put together in such a trying time.

I may still say things like Damn EA or EA are crap from time to time but I always mean the upper management and not the development teams. Those corporate goons that sit in their skyscrapers ( EA CEO Larry Probst ) and think of nothing else but $$$$$$. Sure money is a part of making games but if that's your only reason for making games then your in the wrong industry.

Edited by ttandchotmail, 18 November 2009 - 09:31 AM.

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#5 Námo

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 10:15 AM


That was really an eye-opener ... extremely interesting, and very sad. :grin: Thanks for sharing this, TT. :good:


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#6 ttandchotmail

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 10:31 AM

No worries mate :good:
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#7 khamulrulz

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 12:48 PM

a good read... it's a shame, because if these guys had been let to work at their own pace, i'm sure the game would have turned out better. just like other ea games such as fifa. the dev teams churn out average stuff because they are given deadlines and rushed, when fans produce better work on their own time, without any pressure or fatigue. what ever happened to the gaming industry being fun?
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#8 m@tt

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 01:17 PM

Already knew a bit about the rushing. Mark Skaggs was part of the BFME 1 management team and appreciated the Tolkein books and wanted to put more in, but when the team was rushed to finish and features, units/heroes etc got dropped, he got fed up and left the team.
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#9 Bart

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 02:45 PM

This happens everywhere (not just the games industry) although this is an exceptionally bad case (I read about it before BTW). Good managers are those who have been part of the team and then risen above it, not those who start at the top.

This is the reason I want to start my own game company

(btw, i say let's move/copy this topic to the main t3a news)
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#10 NewErr

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 04:25 PM

I can't belive I just read all those texts. Anyways ...

I can say most of us thought about this reason about bfme2 not beeing so great , witch is the most obvious, and even I read this the first time I felt like I already know it .I totaly respect the artists , designers , programmers for theyr hard work in those conditions that EA made ,and as ttandchotmail said , if I even swear EA games , I swear those guys who made that crap management .

Respect :good: .

#11 Gfire

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 04:31 PM

This is the reason I want to start my own game company

Here, here!

Don't have time to read the whole thing right now. I'll be back this afternoon, or maybe while on tech support later. :good: No one ever needs tech support, and I think this counts as research.
Greetings, community.

#12 Sûlherokhh

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 05:59 PM

...
(btw, i say let's move/copy this topic to the main t3a news)


And so it is ...

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#13 Guest_Guest_*

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 09:36 PM

How many hours was it? A work day should not be more than 9 hours long. Sitting more than 9 hours is not acceptable. 24 huors, 6 hours for sleep. 18 hours of time you are awake. That is 9 hours work on games and 9 hours to do whatever you want.

This is the reason I want to start my own game company

I'm joining, but I won't work more than 9 hours every monday - friday. And i want at least 15 dollars every hour in salary. If that is ok with you. Let's make the most awesome lord of the ring game, true to the lore. :good:

#14 Kwen

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Posted 18 November 2009 - 10:06 PM

Nobody even knows who you are...

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#15 Vortigern

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 12:16 AM

If you ever do manage to set up a gaming company, I'll happily work as a beta-tester and plot deviser for you. :lol: Freelance, of course.

A genuine true-to-the-lore LotR game may well suck, you have to be prepared for that. Generally the reasons people make changes to the lore (of any idea-to-game transition) is to increase or improve playability and cohesion, not just because they like fucking with the purists.
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#16 NewErr

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 02:40 PM

A genuine true-to-the-lore LotR game may well suck, you have to be prepared for that. Generally the reasons people make changes to the lore (of any idea-to-game transition) is to increase or improve playability and cohesion, not just because they like fucking with the purists.


Agree ,How would be Bfme2 without Gimli's Slayer power? :lol:

#17 Gfire

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 05:21 PM

Not what I would have chosen as an example of straying from the lore.

Truly, though, I think making your own world for your game to exist in is the way to go.

Edited by Gfire, 19 November 2009 - 05:23 PM.

Greetings, community.

#18 Kwen

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 06:49 PM

I'm not sure we give EA enough credit... While the game may have been misleading in the previews, and many things were cut, we were still given a very compete, fun, and innovative game to play. EA even gave us the rights to Mod it to our liking so that we would not have to be satisfied with their game. We can make it our own, so long as we stay within the boundaries.

I love playing BFME1 and I even enjoy playing BFME2 once and a while... The games are still very good if you step back and look at it not as a complaining disappointed player, but an enthusiastic fan.

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#19 NewErr

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 07:07 PM

Yup , the games weren't bad at all .Most of the game's beauty is the surprise element(witch may be pleasent or not so pleasent) .Like Living World Map in Bfme1 was totally killer , and we all missed it when moved to Bfme2 .Or another thing was the buildings with castles system , was totally original and it wasen't from the Lore , it was Ea's pure imagination :lol: .Go EA .

Respect :p .

#20 Lauri

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Posted 19 November 2009 - 07:57 PM

Erhm, castle building part of the lore talk? :lol:
I think your meaning originallity..

I think that BFME is a great game, much better than 2 and RotWK... Because it's original
It's got a nice campaign, having heroes is awesome (though as Rohan it's unbalanced.. much) and the castle way of building, is just super cool
Of course, that was screwed in BFME2, when they brought back build-everywhere, something you find in every other game :p And they brought us walls that were strong like cardboard..

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