18 replies to this topic

[isledebananas]

Don't worry this isn't another suggestion . I've been wanting to ask this for sometime since I saw the updated faction units list in the main Development forum. The Berserkers have become the new elite unit. What I want to ask is are they going to be horde units or still single units? Also will they possess similar traits to other elite units no matter what form they come in?

It would be kind of strange to see the Berserkers in a horde, also they don't really where much armor. Single unit elites would make them pretty unique but how well they would be at their job is something else.

[Arveanor]

actually I kind of like all the suggestions popping up everywhere.

That as it may be I think the berzerkers could become an integral part of isengard siege if the bomb is made more usable. How about the ability for the bomb to be stealthed while in a mob of uruks?

[isledebananas]

That is the main hangup I have about Berzerkers being the only elite. Meaning their function is really important for Isengard. You don't want them blowing themselves up like that since it takes time to level them especially. I was thinking perhaps an armored version of the Berserkers(yeah I know doesn't make sense since berserkers should be by their nature sans armor) as maybe an upgrade could be the elites for Isengard. That way the regulars can still do their suicidal things. The model would be similar just with added armor and helm but with the same exact animations.

I think that idea for stealthing the mines around other Uruks is great it certainly increases their use and effectiveness. Otherwise they were just helping the enemy blow your guys up with long range fire arrows. Now to defend against it a detector unit would be needed as well as maybe some fire arrow capable archers.

[khamulrulz]

berserkers are still individuals, although i think that a strong uruk horde, like the rotwk deathbringers, could replace the now-extinct uruks of orthanc. deathbringers are good visually, and also have that unique bloodlust or whatever it's called ability where they get a huge boost to damage but lose health. i think they would be good in s.e.e.

[Arveanor]

Have to agree with both of you guys, sort of at least. They definitely need a well armored elite unit that still has huge damage. If Berserkers are the elite then I do think they need the HA upgrade which virtually changes them into a new unit. The best way to go imo is to make berzerkers very cheap with a hugely expensive HA upgrade. This way you can easily get the suicidal bomb detonators while at the same time having to put down a huge sum on the elite units. Also it's necessary to make sure that there is a limit on how many berzerkers can be upgraded--not on how many can be built, I don't know if that's possible but it would be nice.

And what about upgrading berzerkers to 'deathbringers'? it would basically just be an armor upgrade but... it might could work, although I don't think we should just use the units from rotwk, but perhaps something similar, which may end up being what I said in the first place.

[khamulrulz]

berserkers are meant to be lightly-armored though - in the movie they only wore those masks. these would be limited to 12 guys. deathbringers would be a small horde of decent-armored and great-damage uruks, limited to 2 battalions. this is in line with all the other factions, which have two anti-hero units.

[Arveanor]

umm well the idea would be that they would upgrade from berzerkers into 'deathbringers' and could you go ahead and give a list of all the factions two anti-hero units? I'm not doubting you but it's beyond me to think of 'em all.

Plus the system I proposed would allow a higher use of bombs.

[Nazgûl]

I hate the "deathbringers".... yuck! =p

[khamulrulz]

what about an elite unit with massive shields? they could still have the deathbringers' cool ability. if you don't like the deathbringers, then shieldbearers would be my next pick

[isledebananas]

I have to agree with Nazgul that the "deathbringers" were kind of blah. The horned helms really don't fit Isengard's style at all, in fact they don't fit in Mordor or Moria in my opinion either. Their upper body armor was nice but that weird loincloth thing was just meh. Also, just a thing I noticed is that currently none of the elite units have shields. I think that is kind of a cool trend, but its really negligible.

[KingElessar2384]

The Uruk-Hai of Orthanc were pretty good to me.......

[Dzhon]

How about elite human guards for Isengard? Orthanc was originally a Gondor outpost, but was left to fend for itself as that kingdom declined and eventually given to Saruman. The books mention that the quarters within Saruman's stronghold were clearly inhabited by men, not orcs, and the films show stockpiles of goods (fresh fruit, pipe weed, etc.) that probably wouldn't be consumed by orcs.

TATW's concept is a good place to start.

http://totalwar.hong...d=Orthanc_Guard

[Lugdush]

Hey,heres a suggestion,since the Urukhai of Orthanc are being laid to rest,how about adding Uruk Captains as an elite unit for Isengard?In the movie TT,Saruman had a captain or two commanding his host at Helms Deep.I see that Ridder Geel has some VERY impressive Uruk Captains in his RC mod.It would be great to see them added to this mod.Maybe give them a War Chant ability at level 2,boosting other Uruks in their area for a short period of time,then at level 5 give them a Carnage ability similar to Lurtz and Ugluk.Only two of these elite units would be allowed on the field at once,similar to the other elite units in this mod.It stays true to the movie theme.What do u think,Nazgul?

[ElessartheHigh]

In that case it would require Ridder Geel's agreement . On Uruk Captins don't fit into an Elite Unit , but rather a support unit , with a leadership and a horn power . For Elite , I think Uruk Axemen will be great , or they would be called Uruk Brutes , the one we see in Fellowship of the Ring , nearly attacking Merry and Pippin . That's only an idea , nothing more

Edited by ElessartheHigh, 15 September 2011 - 07:15 PM.

[Lugdush]

I know that it would involve Ridder Geels agreement,but I guess I kinda assumed it would be cool with him,since he is involved with SEE as well.I just thought it was a cool idea to replace tho Orthanc unit.I like the Uruk axemen idea too.

[Nazgûl]

Afaik RG doesn't hold copyright to Uruk Captains? Besides, he's my friend and part of the team, so I'm sure it's np! However, I wouldnt want a horde of captains so I doubt that. I love the berserkes and I think they are great as elite. Just like Gondor will get single unit Fountain Guards =) ot all factions has to have a counterpart to other faction's units and gear =)

All facitions might get "captain" upgrade though, instead of "forged blades"... but that's for anothr debate

[Lugdush]

Yeah,I really like the Berserkers too,I guess I just wanted something extra.Isengard doesnt really have a ton of units like alot of the other factions do.Plus,those Uruk Captains in RGs mod look awesome!There is only 4 warriors per unit,so it isnt like there is a huge horde of Captains running around or anything.Have you looked at them,Naz?If your busy with other stuff,I guess I can always bother You about it when you start working on Isengard.URUKS RULE!

[Nazgûl]

Yeah, I'm only working on Moria atm, until this faction is done... The idea of Isengard is not loads of different units, but loads of uruks. They have uruk-hai scouts, swordsmen, pikemen, crossbowmen and bereserkers as "elite" units. So far I find that quite enough. The idea is to have hundereds, thousands of uruk-hai. No real point of adding captain squads. I might make the BCs into captains instead

[Gollum]

I like the BC as captains adds a special flair