63 replies to this topic

[Vortigern]

Pasi: You mean ridiculous to the point of France?

[duke_Qa]

I'm no fan of the burka(or Chadris and other tents) either. Keep to the hijab if you want something like that. If you want to cover up your face and walk around in public in high-population cities with active law enforcement patrolling the streets, you are asking for them to stop you and ask you to identify yourself. Easier to have your face available for passive identification from afar.

[Pasidon]

Alright, skip my curiosity. But I don't know how common manhunts are or any situation where you needed to be ID'ed in the streets to the point burkas become a major issue.

Pasi: You mean ridiculous to the point of France?

I remember reading a similar article in the New York Times, but I was more referring to the ridiculousness of a singular global ban.

[duke_Qa]

There was just a case on the news about a integration course for immigrant women, where they get paid to go to school and prepare them for getting jobs. A report was made and published that the women with overly strict dress codes were unable to get jobs, because the clothing did not pass the hygiene and security standards for the jobs they were applying for. Basically, they were too constricted in their clothing to be able to handle unusual situations that were expected of them, and the hygiene was also less savory for some reasons I didn't really catch, but it probably had much to do with the same things as the constriction problems. Also, women who got employed quickly became more moderate in their religious beliefs because they got actual interactions with their new society.

One of the interviewees was a 35-45 year old Somali woman who'd been wearing this tent since she was 15. She said that she rather go back to Somalia than to get more moderate and practical clothing for work. I guess Somalia isn't as bad as they say it is. The fun thing about this case was that the integration minister(socialist) grudgingly agreed that the county who had made the report had the right to stop paying these women for going to school if they were unwilling to get a job because of their religious clothing. Quite sensible since I think they spend $400mill on this integration school every year, and paying people for going to job/integration-school if they are not interested in integration or jobs, is not very constructive.

[Pasidon]

That's an interesting variable. I was aware these Burkas made it easier to profile these women, thus making them targets in many scenarios for racial profiling. But the hygiene thing I haven't even considered. If they wear them to avoid natural lighting, I can only imagine what strange dermatological conditions many of these women have in their later years.

[duke_Qa]

I think it was mostly a lack of sanitary possibilities when they've been to the toilet, maybe there is some tradition that they cannot change dresses outside of the home or they only have one of them or something.

[Pasidon]

I guarantee it is related to income. Their husbands may be wealthy, but that wealth will not be distributed to spousal sources, such as clothing since they don't need more than one piece of clothing to function in life. And as another thought, since coitus is initiated very rarely in a typical religious middle-eastern spousal household, a women has very little need to keep good hygiene and the husband doesn't need many good reasons to force her.

[duke_Qa]

I find it more likely that the clothing gets so much in the way, that they get filled with bacteria while working. And when handwashing happens the clothing just contaminates your hands again because they've not been washed at the same time.

[Námo]

In support of Charlie Hebdo:

[Námo]

Astonishing evidence from Islam's most holy scriptures: Who killed the Prophet Mohamed?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ica84DxQhrI

According to the Qur'an and the Ahadith (by Sahih al-Bukhari, considered by all Muslim scholars as being the most reliable Ahadith), Allah killed him ... for being a false prophet!

[Pasidon]

I suppose this is where we would see pictures from the crime scene, only to be given death threats for seeing them. But I think I've heard the same before with the same scriptures (I think). Shows why I never give a hoot about how 'reasonable' and 'logical' cries of the Islamic extremists when their own scripture proves them to be a lost cause.

<---- Derp Pony is Islamic, by the way.

Edited by {IP}Pasidon, 05 November 2011 - 06:45 PM.

[Stayin´Alive]

Its not islam noob. Its people when you see in the news, rumours. On the other hand:

 

Read whole bibble you wont find anything well. In fact there are more things in old 'taste'ment.

In fact if you read wordwar journals you will % 100 find similar words of "killing", "lets kill","do this", "do that". Well even if you dont see, i assure you there are more. Including allies. There is no exception.

Those are not daily life instructors. They are mostly historical books. That gives information from the psycotic history. They are based on real fights mostly between awoken, determined "good" sides versus reckess rich and "bad" sides. But when these are not understood, there will be "the extreme" & "the bad" behaviors by any worshipper. Both in fact are same shit.
 

Any historical Texts or Religious texts are not to blame. People are to blame. People who are easily "obsessable" to blame. Thoughtles people are to blame. Phorahs in this century are behind the biggest corporations who like this scene very much. You help more them with keeping talking this way. I dont see any problem with quranic text for my self. But it doesnt mean I have problems with %90 of the muslims.

Edited by Stayin´Alive, 14 October 2013 - 09:18 PM.

[Mathijs]

Well, you've got to wonder: if the 'obsessable', gullible people were not raised to see merit in violent doctrines, would there still be so many islam-related problems around the world? 

 

In other words; who is to blame, the hapless, dumb victim, or the cruel guy manipulating him to do bad deeds?

 

And before you go 'no no man, no, no', please take the time to read this: http://wikiislam.net...slim_Statistics

 

Specifically, these: 

Children

• 4 out of 5 Middle-Eastern women are sexually abused between the ages of 3 and 6 by family members.

• More than half of all Yemeni girls are married before reaching puberty.

• About 1 in 10 pregnancies in the Arab world ends in abortion. In Pakistan every 6th pregnancy is terminated.

• 94% of Yemeni children (2-14 yrs) subjected to violence from a parent or guardian. (read more)

Free Speech

• Turkey has more journalists in prison than any other country in the world, almost double that of China and Iran.

• 40% of Indonesian Muslims say they would use violence against those blaspheming Islam.

• 78% of British Muslims support punishing people who publish cartoons mocking the Prophet Muhammad.

• Since 1990, 52 people accused of blasphemy in Pakistan have been extra-judicially killed by lynch mobs. (read more)

 

Terrorism

• 2012 report finds the majority of world's terrorism committed by Muslims. Almost 9000 deaths caused by Sunni terrorists in 2011.

• Esposito/Mogahed find almost 4 out of 10 Muslims worldwide are extremists who think 9/11 was totally/partially/somewhat justified.

• More than 95% of all suicide bombing attacks conducted worldwide are carried out by Muslims.

• 2011 Study finds no link between poverty and support for militant Islamic groups. (read more)

Women

• In terms of cultural/tribal/religious danger to women, 4 of the 5 most dangerous countries are Muslim majorities.

• Egyptian women are sexually harassed 7 times every 200 meters and well over two-thirds are harassed on a daily basis.

• The Maldives, an Islamic country with a 100% Muslim population, has the highest divorce rate in the world.

• Egyptian study contradict widely held belief that unveiled women are more likely to suffer harassment than veiled ones. (read more)

 

Note that these statistics are sourced and authentic. You've got to wonder, would these still be so god-damn terrible if Islam (which literally preaches most of these issues as virtuous) was absent. Cause and effect and all.

Edited by Mathijs, 14 October 2013 - 09:40 PM.

[Pasidon]

It's Asia.  There's not a sane country in that entendre of stupidity.  I would lock up journalists and suppress foreigners too if my country had a list of crimes longer than the Dead Sea Scrolls.

 

Oh wow... I can't believe I made this topic.  The dumb things I used to care about...

[Pasidon]

Its not islam noob.

Oh, almost missed this.  Congrats on having 2 years to consider the topic and still not finding a better word than 'noob'.  I better call the fire department after that mad sick burn. Now I probably should stay away from dry tender and Call of Dooty players for awhile.

[Stayin´Alive]

I d suggest if any one of you had a little historical knowledge about christianity which have to be said next to many things you say about any folks on this earth. especially if "they" are so much in amount.

There are many more things.

On the other hand if you ever knew once up on time, people, under the very same name ,"islamic umbrella", were appreciated by all means by all of the world. And you could not count any of them you saying. Well at the same thime dont ask what european descendancy were doing.

 

Dont you think so there must a problem about today's muslims? Those you call muslims are not really islamic doctrinal represantators. All arre cults and traditions rather than being islamic. There are two levels for islamic initiation. first one becomes muslim. then if he is proven by some skill and degree on "islamic philosophy" called mu'min.

On the other hand most of you saying are quite bombastic. They are not quite true. Yes ther eare problems but the way all western orientalism is to not to solve but instigate. western people dont realize what they are doing. but its instigating. you shouldnt do it like that.

They are different folks. They dont represent islam or quran even if they think they are doing. they more like representing heritage of arabic ignorance.

Whatever you call them, they are nothing to do with islam. And if you are wise enoguh you would not call them muslims. even if they are, that make some philosophical errors and consistencial problems.

[Mathijs]

You can keep playing the 'they're not muslims because I'm muslim and I don't like what they're doing therefore they can't be muslim' card for as long as you wish.

 

But it doesn't make it true.

 

And the whole 'but the West/Christianity did bad things too' argument is terribly childish. I know they did. Doesn't excuse Islam from being a terrible idea with terrible consequences.

[Stayin´Alive]

I didnt say they cant be muslims. even if i typed, I meant hey cant be islam; but ofc they muslim and alive representators, wrong or correct. I am trying to figure out the difference between islam and muslims.

Islamic knowledge(as well as other religions) came by prophed not by his 1000 years later "follower"s. So you cant simply read it and whenever there are mentioned "the muslim" and "mumin",  "deserves heaven", one shouldnt simply be feeling awarded. No its not that ! mass muslim populations 1st deception. Another one is its ALSO a historical book. you cant simply read and understand what there written....

and its not childish.

I tell you by that (or i had in my mind while teling them were): societies have cycles like 300 500 years. they reborn in every cycle. Or get deeply into mess. which means, the father is not the son the son is not the father.

Sins dont pass thru generations but mistakes do; and the rate of effort that is put on, by thoughts, to solve misatkes and alternate potential habits, by all the society decides how the mistakes will affect the fate of the society....


:::

Edited by Stayin´Alive, 16 October 2013 - 12:11 AM.

[Stayin´Alive]

http://wikiislam.net...slim_Statistics

 

There are lot of amazing statistics. Most of them are not surprising at all for me.

You guys may realize what has been wrong; but they havent realized yet. Or simply they dont want to face it. "How will you approach and tell them these issues" will determine your role in the future. This is my point.

GL & HF.

Edited by Stayin´Alive, 16 October 2013 - 12:32 AM.

[Pasidon]

Statistics are a bad source, especially if it comes from Islam's Wiki page.  4 / 5 Americans like disco, so you should just assume I like disco.  

 

If it matters, about 99% of the stuff I posted on this topic 2 years ago, I probably changed my mind or, or stopped caring about.  Or both.