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Student Riots in London over future fee increase


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#41 Ash

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 11:35 AM

What I love the most is how they're still insisting the new fee hike is "fair", when on the day of the first riots the PM is in China explaining that the reason for the hike is so that we can subsidise to cost of foreign students, especially the Chinese.

So the proposal is for saddling future students with a lifetime of debt and cutting back on the quality of their education, so that foreign students can study in the UK cheaper, then piss off back home and pay into their economy, whilst the UK gets absolutely no benefit from it except a generally lower level of education. Genius!

Yet of course if a British student wanted to study in their country, they'd get shafted for the costs.

Ever heard of the Erasmus scheme? Whereby students in any EU country could go to any other EU country to study and still receive credit? Did you know that that student will always pay the costs of their home university, not to the host university?
So, if I paid 3k a year, and I wanted a year in, say, France, I would still have to pay 3k a year. But the cost of uni in France is only a few hundred Euros.
On the other hand, a lad from France came to study at our uni and lived in our halls of residence. He paid just a few hundred Euros, while the cost of studying in the UK was 3k at the time.

How exactly by any stretch of the word could this constitute being 'fair'. There is nothing fair about anything this government has yet done since it came into power. For that matter, no government since the late 70s-early 80s has done anything that would constitute fairness. Every single person who has ever held a position of governmental authority - local or otherwise - since 1974 should be charged with treason, while those who have held power since 1997 should be charged with treason, fraud and embezzlement.

As for the supposed £7 billion all these cuts are supposed to save? Guess who's government has just prepared a £7 billion bail-out package for bankrupt Ireland?

Thankfully, the Irish refused to take it - at least there's ONE government out there looking out for the interests of the British people.

That's a beautiful irony, isn't it? A country that could sorely benefit from that 7bil actually declines it! Probably for the purposes of political points-scoring but we'll take it.

Foreign aid, the EU, the benefits system (not pensions) could all stand to be slashed. Abolish the CPS and all these environmental quangos, deny any expenses except admin/commuter costs (that would come out of their constituency budgets anyway so negate them), remove all subsidy for arts institutions - if they can't run under their own income then let 'em close! Demand the money back from the banks and instead allow the Bank of England to run personal bank accounts to outcompete the others. Bring the troops home - that'll save a few bob. Repeal huge chunks of the Health and Safety at Work Act and stop fining local councils for breaches of the DPA (that effectively amounts to fining the taxpayer).
With these savings, and more, we could afford new housing and industrial projects and subsidies to create jobs and cheaper housing (but they won't because this keeps prices artificially inflated, as does witholding huge petrol reserves). We could afford to lower taxes across the board, which would in turn make the economy spiral upwards and growth would surge.

Raising taxes and VAT will do nothing but shove people further into poverty from which they cannot escape or afford to work, end up on benefits because they don't have to pay taxes that way and it'll end up a bigger drain on state finances than it already is.

#42 ambershee

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 11:52 AM

Ever heard of the Erasmus scheme? Whereby students in any EU country could go to any other EU country to study and still receive credit? Did you know that that student will always pay the costs of their home university, not to the host university?


It's no secret that up here in Preston, maybe as many as half of the students are international; we have so many students coming from China that they have their own private classes and occupy entire halls of residence - so many in fact that they never really have to come into contact with anyone except other Chinese people and lecturers, forming an entirely insular community. I've been here for 18 months and have not once had the opportunity to even speak to one of them; they're seen going to-and-fro between university and their homes, and that's it. A large number of my friends up here are also not British - most of them are German or Greek, with a smattering of the Polish, French and a few others besides.

Raising taxes and VAT will do nothing but shove people further into poverty from which they cannot escape or afford to work, end up on benefits because they don't have to pay taxes that way and it'll end up a bigger drain on state finances than it already is.


No kidding. People are often already better off on a lower-income or working part time and receiving benefits in the current system - let alone in the new system where they'll be paying even more tax.

#43 Allathar

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 02:52 PM

Foreign aid, the EU, the benefits system (not pensions) could all stand to be slashed. Abolish the CPS and all these environmental quangos, deny any expenses except admin/commuter costs (that would come out of their constituency budgets anyway so negate them), remove all subsidy for arts institutions - if they can't run under their own income then let 'em close!

The current government here is trying to do something like this, only to encounter mass protests by the leftards. They want to raise taxes and lower subsidizing on cultural institution - great, 90% of the 'art' those subsidized hippies are making ends up being bought by the government anyway because noone wants their pretentious shit. The climate thing baffles me even more, billions are being pumped into solving a problem that doesn't even exist! Foreign aid should be completely abolished as well, it's counterproductive and a waste of money which could be very well spend on, I don't know, healthcare. Over here our elders, having payed taxes all their lives, are now lying in their own waste in nursing homes, not allowed to take a shower more than once a week (too expensive, after all), while at the same time Ahmed the non-integrated muslim gets a hug and benefits, while his two dozen kids are terrorizing the streets and making life a living hell in the cities. But, the leftards say, Ahmed deserves those benefits - noone wants to hire him because every employer is racist and discriminating to Muslims! (ignoring the fact that Ahmed doesn't speak the language, ritually slaughters his goats and doesn't want to integrate - I mean, why would he? It's not like refusing to integrate stops his monthly paychecks from the government ;)).

Western Europe really must be the only place where the elected representatives of that nation's people care about and look after the interests of everyone but the people of the nation that elected them.

Nail, head.
It has been reported that some victims of rape, during the act, would retreat into a fantasy world from which they could not WAKE UP. In this catatonic state, the victim lived in a world just like their normal one, except they weren't being raped. The only way that they realized they needed to WAKE UP was a note they found in their fantasy world. It would tell them about their condition, and tell them to WAKE UP. Even then, it would often take months until they were ready to discard their fantasy world and PLEASE WAKE UP

#44 ambershee

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 06:10 PM

On the plus side, I'm looking forwards to the riots here in Preston tomorrow.

#45 Allathar

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 07:52 PM

Blah, the only riots here are 'riots' against the planned lowering on art subsidizing...
It has been reported that some victims of rape, during the act, would retreat into a fantasy world from which they could not WAKE UP. In this catatonic state, the victim lived in a world just like their normal one, except they weren't being raped. The only way that they realized they needed to WAKE UP was a note they found in their fantasy world. It would tell them about their condition, and tell them to WAKE UP. Even then, it would often take months until they were ready to discard their fantasy world and PLEASE WAKE UP

#46 Tom

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 10:25 PM

That previous post Allathar sounded a bit like it was from the Daily Mail ;)

Anyway. There is another walkout and protest next Tuesday (30th Nov). I think these things are going to become common. Thank god!

People need to go further and realise that the education cuts are very much associated with the bankruptcy of Britain which is mainly STAGED by a few elite banks as part of a globalisation agenda. Destroy the old order, bring in the new order - one of super unions like the EU.

These protests need to realise this too and evolve into a movement against this. The EU is important to be resisted because at it's very heart it is totalitarian. I bet they love it when they can bail out nations like Ireland because it means in the future they will be able to usurp more power away from it.

#47 Phil

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 10:35 PM

Ah Tom, you and your conspiracy theories... ;)

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#48 Tom

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 10:42 PM

Part of it is not theory. Their irresponsibility and the fear mongering and propaganda that came out of the media to convince people to bail out the banks bankrupted us.

The theory part is that it weakens us enough to put us in a situation where a majority of people will feel the problem is so bad that they might support more globalisation or power to the EU.

#49 ambershee

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 11:29 AM

What?

#50 Allathar

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 12:02 PM

Anyway. There is another walkout and protest next Tuesday (30th Nov). I think these things are going to become common. Thank god!

Yeah, I wish there were some decent riots here as well. But so far there's only protesting by previously mentioned leftards against the healthy things the right-wing government is doing for my country. Now, if there was a left-wing government, I'd have a decent excuse to stop working and start protesting and kicking against the order.

People need to go further and realise that the education cuts are very much associated with the bankruptcy of Britain which is mainly STAGED by a few elite banks as part of a globalisation agenda. Destroy the old order, bring in the new order - one of super unions like the EU.

Trust me, the banks didn't want the economic recession either, let alone for some crazy conspiracy theory to take over Europe. If anything, the banks want it the other way around - less power for the EU government means more power and money for them, after all.

These protests need to realise this too and evolve into a movement against this. The EU is important to be resisted because at it's very heart it is totalitarian. I bet they love it when they can bail out nations like Ireland because it means in the future they will be able to usurp more power away from it.

Agreed. One of the worst things was a few years ago - we could vote for a European Constitution. The results was a clear 'no'. EU pushed it's agenda anyway, renamed it the 'Treaty of Lissabon', and now we're stuck with it. I don't know whether the bureaucrats in the EU seriously think they're helping us with those ridiculous rules and regulations, or whether it's indeed all for the power - either way, there needs to be put an end to now, before it's too late.


Part of it is not theory. Their irresponsibility and the fear mongering and propaganda that came out of the media to convince people to bail out the banks bankrupted us.

It was necessary, otherwise we'd have witnessed the fall of the economic and monetary system. It was expensive, yes, but it shouldn't have bankrupted you if the government had decent reserves. But no, the whole EU bureaucracy, foreign aid, climate help, and immigration took an immense toll on those reserves already, so there are indeed problems now and harsh measures like cutting back on education.

The theory part is that it weakens us enough to put us in a situation where a majority of people will feel the problem is so bad that they might support more globalisation or power to the EU.

Agreed. While globalizing and more power to the EU might solve the problems temporarily, it will only bring a lot more problems in the future with it - for example, the introduction of the euro gave the economy a little boost and made international trading a lot easier, until Greece started creative accounting.
It has been reported that some victims of rape, during the act, would retreat into a fantasy world from which they could not WAKE UP. In this catatonic state, the victim lived in a world just like their normal one, except they weren't being raped. The only way that they realized they needed to WAKE UP was a note they found in their fantasy world. It would tell them about their condition, and tell them to WAKE UP. Even then, it would often take months until they were ready to discard their fantasy world and PLEASE WAKE UP

#51 Námo

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 04:00 PM


... The EU is important to be resisted because at it's very heart it is totalitarian. I bet they love it when they can bail out nations like Ireland because it means in the future they will be able to usurp more power away from it.

Agree!

@British Revorians: Britain may have an undemocratic election system, but at least it has a few honest politicians. This one is spot on:


Also, it's encouraging that for the first time one of the MSM are supporting a campaign for withdrawal from the EU: GET BRITAIN OUT OF EUROPE

... One of the worst things was a few years ago - we could vote for a European Constitution. The results was a clear 'no'. EU pushed it's agenda anyway, renamed it the 'Treaty of Lissabon', and now we're stuck with it. I don't know whether the bureaucrats in the EU seriously think they're helping us with those ridiculous rules and regulations, or whether it's indeed all for the power - either way, there needs to be put an end to now, before it's too late.

The Netherlands voted NO ... and so did France, too. But as the EU elite don't mind the peoples that didn't matter. Denmark did vote NO already in 1992, but the people were lured by the government to vote yes in an additional referendum, by having various exceptions from the EU regulations. We did vote NO to the common EU currency ... and as far as I know, the British people are 55% for leaving the EU.

However, the Treaty of Lissabon does have one good article: §50, which states that a country has the right to leave the EU ... and the whole proces is rather simple, it can be all be done in about two years time. Before the Treaty of Lissabonprocess such an article didn't exist. For further information, see this article, part III.

@Allarhar: The 2.9% cap increase spearheaded by the Dutch Government has been circumvented by the EU Commission:

The EU Commission has unveiled its new budget proposals - sticking to a 2.9 percent increase as demanded by EU ministers. But the commission has also added a "contingency fund" of up to €3.5 billion to be spent in the event of "unforeseen circumstances" – a sum which does not figure in the slated annual increase.

This means that the headline figure to be approved remains at 2.9 percent above last year, while the actual sum spent by the end of the year will be close (or even above) the six percent increase demanded by MEPs. As an exercise in having it both ways, this is quite creative, as long as we the people don't mind being taken for fools.


@all: please sign this petition: EU: TIME FOR PEOPLE-POWERED DEMOCRACY!


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#52 Vortigern

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 04:20 PM

Ireland also voted no, and then their government held another referendum. It kinda seemed like "It's your decision. What's that? No, you say? OK, let's try this again. It's your decision as long as you say yes." And here in Britain we were promised a referendum but that never happened in the end. Representative government, eh?
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#53 Tom

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 06:14 PM

I like the Nigel Farage video! It's true that we do have a few credible politicians left. Personally in the USA I think Ron Paul is another one in that arena, although some think hes nuts. I think he talks sense, even if I don't agree with him on every count.



What we really need as well (I know this is a little off topic) is more transparency and alternative media sources. Is anyone else happy that WikiLeaks is leaking millions of classified US / Pentagon documents on the Iraq and Afghanistan war so that media can sieve through them and hopefully get more of the truth to people?

#54 Hostile

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 07:56 PM

I initially had honestly believed the EU would have been a good thing, but that was before I got better educated on the importance of the nation state over larger entities. Tom, I don't believe releasing documents that will expose operatives in Iraq or Afhganistan is going to do anything besides getting people killed.

#55 Námo

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 08:39 PM


off-topic:

... It's true that we do have a few credible politicians left. Personally in the USA I think Ron Paul is another one in that arena ...

He is seen by some as the father of the the Tea Party Movement ... and btw his son Rand Paul (R-KY) was elected on November 2 as one of the Tea Party's high-profile senators.

Ron Paul made another impressive speech at the Tax Day Tea Party in Washington DC may 15 2010, calling for an end to big government: ... so there sure are some parallels to the Freedom and Democracy movement of Europe.

Interesting, a Rasmussen poll some days before (may 2010) showed some remarkable figures for the 2012 presidential election: Obama would gain 42% of the vote compared to Pauls 41% - a statistical dead heat. Fox News interview with Ron Paul: ... here Ron Paul describes the Obama administration as 'Corporatism', again a parallel with the Euro-sceptics.

/off-topic.


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#56 Tom

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 12:10 AM

He was the father of the tea party movement but it has been hijacked by complete nutjobs and shills *cough glenn beck*

Ron Paul should run for president under the republican ticket again in 2012. I believe this time he'll get the attention he deserves.

All the administrations since Reagan have been corporatist. America is living in a corporatist society, not quite capitalist and not quite fascist... yet.

Eric, you are probably right about the documents getting people killed... but if your government, like ours, wasn't so corrupt in the first place then this wouldn't be the case. The American and British governments both lie about intelligence to take their populace to war, promote propaganda to fulfil political agendas, lie to their citizens every single day in regards to the terrorist threats to promote fear and more control, commit atrocities across the world, conspire against other nations and promote a foreign policy that make the world want to hate us. We live in countries that are ruled by a small elite who have no interests other than their own.

The only real evidence we had to back up that Saddam may of had weapons of mass destruction where the receipts from the ones we sold him.

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