14 replies to this topic

[anakinskysolo]

Hello everyone:
Since version 1.2 is about to reach completion, I came back to the whole world of Star Wars vehicles and vessels and started reviewing what new material has been added in-universe and what stats have reference books supplied to ships that didn't have definite stats before. To my disappointment, I have only been able to find that Wizards of the Coasts system of stats is completely different to the one used by West End Games, and the armaments that they give to ships are just completely stupid. For reference, see the Pellaeon-class Star Destroyer stats given by the Legacy Era Campaign Guide, giving the ship 14 ion/turbolaser batteries, which is just nonsense. So I wondered if there is any way of transforming this stats to real, consistent ones that make sense? Perhaps the term "battery" refers to multiple cannons, or something along those lines? Sadly, the Fleet Junkies never released and updated ship compendium, and the only other "reference" that I've found is the webpage http://www.galactic-...e.com/Ships.htm, that lists some stats that appear to make sense for some ships that do not have canonical armaments yet or have those useless WotC garbage, but I don't know how trustworthy they really are. Perhaps Master PR has consistent stats for vessels that he would be willing to release for us to see? It would be very appreciated.

The other thing I wanted to talk about is the release in the last year of several new models along with new mods like Thrawn's Revenge and Republic At War, for instance now we have beautiful models for the Aramadia-class Thrustship, the Hapan Battle Dragons and other ships that I would love to see someday in PR, but because I know that it is difficult at the time for PR to take the time to add them himself, I thought I could attempt to do it on my own. The last time I played the game I was partly successful in adding the MC90 for the Rebels, but as I went back to school and I got bored with playing version 1.1, I never finished what I had started. However, as the new version of the mod looks like its going to be epic, and because I am on vacations until September this year, I thought that I would put myself to good use and perhaps add extraofficial space units to the mod in order for me and others to be able to enjoy if they wish to. However, when looking at the models contained in the mods I mentioned before through the ALO viewer, I realized that although they looked beautiful, they lacked the amount of firing bones required for fitting the canonical weaponry, because those mod teams just stick to destructible hardpoints and do not need to have many firing bones in their models because they do not attempt at making the game canonical. So I wanted to know if anyone would be willing to teach me how to add bones to the models, or just point me to a good tutorial in order to be able to produce models that could fit in PR's mod.

Thanks and keep up the good work, some users have disappeared since people got bored playing version 1.1 so this forums are not seeing the amount of activity that I was used to seeing some time ago, but I know that with the release of version 1.2 the forum is just going to explode with new users and old ones coming back.

Anakinskysolo

[evilbobthebob]

It's coincidental that you should mention sourcing models from other mods. With development on v1.2 drawing to a close, we have been looking into sourcing models externally for a number of different vehicles and vessels. Unfortunately, this tends to be a minefield of contacting different mod members to ask for permission before we add these models. As you said yourself, after sourcing the models we often need to rig them for PR. It's something we're working on though.

As for armaments, that's not my area of expertise so I can't comment.

Thanks for your continued support of the mod!

[Phoenix Rising]

Great post. I'm just going to reply quickly, as it is really coming down to the wire now.

To get the actual weapon counts of ships from Saga stats, you have to multiply batteries by gunners. I'm not sure if it's accurate in all cases (I only use it if there are no alternative sources for armament), but that'll at least get you in the right neighborhood.

Edited by Phoenix Rising, 08 March 2012 - 04:04 AM.

[johnchm.10]

they really need to sit down and agree on these things.

[Kitkun]

Unfortunately, while Hapan Battle Dragons would be impressive, there's no way they can be made to work canonically in the EaW engine.

[johnchm.10]

the problem of the term "battery" when used to describe artillery (naval guns) is that there isn't really a clear-cut definition when it comes to size and numbers. the Ironclad Monitor, for example only had a single pair of cannons mounted in a revolving turret, whereas earlier wooden sailing ships' "batteries" could consist of up to half of their armaments, as the guns were static fixtures and couldnt be aimed to a significant degree, the later HMS Dreadnought's Main Battery consisted of 5 turrets each mounting a pair of 12" diameter cannons

[johnchm.10]

for land forces, a battery usually consists of 6 to 8 cannons, with about 5-7 men per gun, not counting support and observation personnel, commanded by a Captain. which is better then the Star Wars version of a battery, which has 16 or 32 guns, depending on size and about 150 men.

[anakinskysolo]

Ok, so now that v1.2 is out, I attempted to add some bones to a model made for another mod, so I just imported the model to 3ds Max, then entered bone tools and started adding bones. Now the ALO Viewer shows them when I export it. Is it that easy? Or am I missing something here?

[evilbobthebob]

Well, it is generally much easier to add Points instead of Bones (they're in the Helpers section), and you need to make sure that the x-axis of the bone points along the fire cone centre. Apart from that, yeah it's that easy. Obviously you have to code in new hardpoints to let the game use the new bones.

Edited by evilbobthebob, 26 March 2012 - 11:37 PM.

[anakinskysolo]

Great. Yeah, the coding part I more or less know how to do it. I'm really slow at it, but the last time I tried to add a ship the hardpoints did work. Thanks! What I would love to have now are more ship stats, I remember Ghost mentioning that he had a unit spreadsheet with all of their stats? Perhaps this spreadsheet also contains units that are not in the mod yet?

[Phoenix Rising]

I use Dummies to rig. Personal preference.

[anakinskysolo]

I did it! Now I have a properly rigged Lucrehulk. I'm so happy... I guess I'll start working on the coding now... Perhaps I will have a few questions, I hope I do not repeat the ones that I made a long time ago, I will search the forums to see what I asked... PR, do you still think that the Lucrehulk has a 6000 SBD shield rating and 3256 RU? Oh, and I saw this post:

You get most of this information through the D6 RPG system, don't you? And are you planning to release some day this calculations you have made for other ships that are not on the mod?

No... it's really from a variety of sources. I use whatever one makes the most sense for a given ship.

I still hope to redo the website with that information, but the issue is always time.

Are you still planning on doing that? If you need any help, I would be more than glad to provide it, I'm kind of a stats geek (maybe you already realized this XD).

Edited by anakinskysolo, 27 March 2012 - 04:03 AM.

[Phoenix Rising]

Those are Starships of the Galaxy stats against a Golan III. You want to convert against something of similar size, but not everything works. Try it and see.

The website needs to be redone. We're still working out what it should contain and look like. Maybe it'd be easiest to just maintain all the stats in a database and use SQL... we'll see. The graphical part is my weakness.

[anakinskysolo]

Well, it is generally much easier to add Points instead of Bones (they're in the Helpers section), and you need to make sure that the x-axis of the bone points along the fire cone centre.

With points I have to do that too? How is it done? I use autogrid and draw on top, is that ok?

Edited by anakinskysolo, 28 March 2012 - 02:41 AM.

[evilbobthebob]

I'm not very well-versed in 3DS Max. All I do to add bones is place Points then rotate them appropriately so that they point the right way.