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Which are the most difficult custom maps of rotwk or bfme2?


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#1 vegetassj2345

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 04:18 PM

Hi to all, and my friend are playing rotwk from some months, but now we are very good in defeating brutal opponents..so i ask...which are the most difficult maps for 2 human players of rotwk or bfme2?

Of course i want maps with a very good ai!

Edited by vegetassj2345, 03 December 2012 - 04:19 PM.


#2 Lauri

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:03 AM

The most difficult maps are the ones where you play against your friend.

The AI will never be that good. I understand that it's great fun to play with your friend, but playing against him is also quite cool, just to see who's better.

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#3 vegetassj2345

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:50 PM

can you suggest me please at least some maps in which ai attacks with not small waves but with a huge army? (practially first ai create a lot of units then it launch the attack with all its forces)...at least we will have some fun!

#4 Bofur

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 09:02 PM

Well, if you want a less skirmish-y map, then Legends by Crusard is unbeatable IMHO
This can be found, with all other relevant info, here: http://www.the3rdage...tem-483?addview

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#5 Elric

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:08 AM

Me, Geel and Blauw beat it after something like 3-4 hours :D

haha it inspired me to create my own rpg type map but i never finished it due to the fact of losing a lot of progress but i think blauw might still have it. I might put it up for people to test whats done of the first map so far. haha

Edited by {IP}Apollo, 05 December 2012 - 03:09 AM.


#6 vegetassj2345

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:24 PM

Yes but this is a non-skirmish map, i want a skirmish map in which the ai attacks with hordes..because like this beating the ai is more difficult and more funny, for example i like to see the ai hordes assalting my fortress! :)

#7 Gourbish

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:41 PM

Are you playing with a mod or not ?
I'm playing on the vanilla with some of my modifications and what I did to make multi skirmish more difficult is :
-> I tried some adjustments in the file "skirmishaidata.ini"
=> The AI could use little bigger armies, forcing AI to use all powers of its heroes...

But one thing which lacked in the vanilla is that AI rarely comes with high leveled heroes or units and with few light points (depending of you player style).
-> So I increased the number of neutral units (more spiders, gobelins, trolls, drakes, barrow wights) in lairs with a faster respawn.
-> I edited the AttributeModifier "BrutalAIMultiPlayer_Bonus" for adding "Modifier = EXPERIENCE 150%".
In that case, AI will gain more XP, and if there are many lairs in the map, the AI will win many Xp and lights points when it will kill the lairs.

With tunings like that, some maps could be more difficult. For example the 8 player map called "tournament hills" (it's a symetric map with gobelins and barrow wight lairs with outposts in each corner).

#8 vegetassj2345

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:49 PM

i'm playing with my own mod...you give me a good idea! :thumbsupcool:

you know how to force the ai to build a big army first and then attack? sometimes it does like this but i would want this type of attack always.If you know how to do it...i will be so so so thankful to you. This is the thing that i really want to know.



Also Do you know how to teach the ai to use all the power of the spellbook? Normally ai uses just eye of sauron and wasteland (or smth like this)...i read that this is difficult is it true?


Also how did you do to force ai to use heroes?

Edited by vegetassj2345, 06 December 2012 - 07:17 PM.


#9 Gourbish

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 04:24 PM

In the "skirmishaidata.ini" :

1) Powers' using
You have "DifficultyTuning" blocks. But there is no block for highter difficulties.
For example, I added these blocks :
DifficultyTuning HardTuning
Difficulty = HARD
EconomyMaxFarms = 9
EconomyUpgradeProbability = 1 : 1	;//When the AI decides to build a farm
SpecialPowerActivationProbability = 1 : 1 ;//When the AI decides to activate a spell or hero power
OffensiveTacticActivationProbability = 1 : 1 ;//When the AI decides to activate an offensive tactic
End
DifficultyTuning BrutalTuning
Difficulty = BRUTAL
EconomyMaxFarms = 12
EconomyUpgradeProbability = 1 : 1
SpecialPowerActivationProbability = 1 : 1
OffensiveTacticActivationProbability = 1 : 1
End

You could see that "SpecialPowerActivationProbability" is about the activation of powers. So with the 1:1 value, AI will use power everytime as possible. BUT.... It depends on the fact that the hero has the "AISpecialPowerUpdate" for the power in his code. Because without this "AISpecialPowerUpdate", the AI won't be able to execute the power.
What we do here is only to increase the chance that the AI will use powers.


2) Teams
For each faction, there are that stuffs :
"ValueToSetForMaxOnDefenseTeam"
"CombatChainSearchDepthForTeamRecruits_AttackTeams"
"CombatChainSearchDepthForTeamRecruits_DefenseTeams"
"CombatChainSearchDepthForTeamRecruits_ExploreTeams"

You'll see the comments to learn more their goal as I didn't really understand how it is used.

-> I increased the "ValueToSetForMaxOnDefenseTeam" form 10 to 15 because I wanted to have AI bases with more units defending. I didn't verify if it works well... :p

-> I increased the "CombatChainSearchDepthForTeamRecruits_AttackTeams" from 2 to 6 and it seems that the AI attacks are more aggressive.



So I didn't find how to tell the AI to build big armies before attacking but with my changes, I believe that the AI comes with more units.


3) Finally, like I explained before, I think that the fact that AI could come with heroes high leveled and with more light points increases the difficulty. When it puts an army of the dead and comes with king Dain and his level 10 power, it could be a difficult moment to live. :)

Edited by Gourbish, 07 December 2012 - 04:50 PM.


#10 vegetassj2345

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 04:37 PM

aha as far as i can see these blocks are for the hero powers..but for the ring powers? for example the final power...meteor attack (or smth like this)..the ai in my games never used it. With your code..that i added now in my ini.big, the ai will use it...maybe?

Edited by vegetassj2345, 07 December 2012 - 04:42 PM.


#11 Gourbish

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 04:52 PM

aha as far as i can see these blocks are for the hero powers..but for the ring powers? for example the final power...meteor attack (or smth like this)..the ai in my games never used it. With your code..that i added now in my ini.big, the ai will use it...maybe?


The comment says that it concerns spells and hero powers. So I understand that it means all powers.
But maybe the AI is not well implemented for this power.

--- edition ---
I saw that there is the "AISpecialPowerUpdate" for this power so it is activable by the AI.

But the problem is probably : does the AI have enough light points to by this power ? Because it needs many light points and maybe the priority is given to the Balrog, so it will need again more light points.

Edited by Gourbish, 07 December 2012 - 04:57 PM.


#12 vegetassj2345

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 05:07 PM

maybe......anyway i think this is the best we can do :thumbsupcool: ....and for change the attack style of the ai as i asked before? nothing?

Edited by vegetassj2345, 07 December 2012 - 05:07 PM.


#13 Gourbish

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 05:16 PM

I edited my "big" post. You'll see some things not wrote at the beginning. At the moment it's all I know.

For me, one thing I'd like to change is learning AI to save his heroes and not sending them to suicide !
So, if somebody knows how to do.......

Edited by Gourbish, 07 December 2012 - 05:17 PM.


#14 vegetassj2345

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 05:19 PM

yessssss i read your post...also this thing to use high leveled heroes is good :thumbsupcool: .....even if i can defeat even Sauron with my custom hero! ;)

And yes if someone knows how to do this thing of heroes and light points, and how to effectively teach to ai to use huge armies instead of spamming little waves after little waves...he can post here.


THANK YOU Gourbish for your kind help!

Edited by vegetassj2345, 07 December 2012 - 05:21 PM.


#15 Telcontar

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 07:32 PM

The AI uses the high-level spells when it has enough points. I was working on a Dol Guldur faction some time ago. I wanted to be able to try the new spells quickly, so I made all players begin with all light points. Even normal AIs gave me some frights when I was testing a new spell or hero and found out that the only one enemy AI had casted both top tier spells on my fortress.
You can give spells like Saruman's Speechcraft to the enemy to create more experienced armies and place custom enemies (weak but that give a lot of experience) next to the AI's fortress.
If you always play with the same faction, I think you can give your enemy's faction advantages in playertemplate.ini, but the only one I've worked with is the initial amount of resources.

(The sky has fallen)

Edited by Telcontar, 15 December 2012 - 01:42 PM.


#16 vegetassj2345

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:46 PM

AHA OK! u know how to make the attack of the ai more powerful? most of the times it attacks just with little waves...how about make the ai attacking with huge hordes?

#17 Telcontar

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:17 AM

In skirmishaidata you have info about what percentage of the army is a unit in each phase.
There are 3 phases (more or less, in the 1st phase they gather resources and build their base, in the 2nd they are still preparing themselves but they also attack and in the 3rd they launch the attack with all their power).
You can use this to make them attack more at the beginning, and you can also increase the max command points (or decrease the cost in command points of each unit) and their resources to make them have more troops.
You will find in this file other things you'll find useful, as "MustUseCommandPointPercentage", which forces the AI to fill a percentage of their command points in each phase with troops.

(The sky has fallen)

EDIT: You can change not only the initial light points, but also the speed at you gain them, in rank.ini

Edited by Telcontar, 16 December 2012 - 05:26 PM.





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