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Sexual Orientation over Identity


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#1 DIGI_Byte

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 11:42 AM

Recently I got dumped (pun) with some news about a friends partner who came out of the closet

its somewhat of an ackward situation that he's kind of oblivious about but that's not the reason for this thread. we got into a debate about homosexuality and how its not a choice.

 

I would really like to hear your opinions on this matter

 

I'll be looking at the broad spectrum of variables that create what we are as people but at its core, it would be about sexuality and our position on it.

 

So to get started, my friend and I had a disagreement, him blaming the relationship all on his partner being gay after 4 years of being together (coming out of the closet)

Essentially the situation was this: "My girl realized she's gay so were not together anymore"

Me, I would consider more factors then just "oh I think I'm gay now"

that being relationship stress and other factors that I'm unaware of.

 

that lead into a debate about sexuality and how someone cannot just suddenly stop being attracted to men simply because they had an epiphany of being gay even if it was gradual over a year, and that she was actually leaning towards homosexual interests for reasons and that she lost that desire to be with her current partner

 

He accused me of not having modern views on homosexuality when I said, people could not be 100% homosexual, specially when she was in a relationship for so long. his point was that people are "gay or straight" and that's a fair call, people have life styles and live by those choices like fashion and sexual orientation based on their own feelings.

 

But that doesn't answer the real question what makes a person 'gay or straight'

With genetics and those freaky mutations we get when we're born, the way our minds are wired in that regard are not a simple yes or no switch and that's why gay marriage and couples have been such a confusing and heated debate for centuries, with prejudice and alienation, it puts people in a position, specially with those who are bi or bi-curious as anti-gay people use that as proof that its a choice. As we know, it is not a choice.

 

 

From what I know, and what many people agree on is that Hetero/homo is more of a bar, most people are genetically placed to one side or the other, but its not perfect as some people are in the middle. However no-one is 100% one way or the other as perfection doesn't exist in natural genetics, but we can be very close that we can confidently say we are 100% this or that, that however is our perception of ourselves that we identify with. People with more homo-orientation but still on the hetero side would still comfortably identify themselves as hetero. and thus, the conflict was born.

 

now the factors behind being 'gay or straight' are layered and each factor doesn't need an explanation, I've arranged them by the most likely heaviest controller on a persons sexual identity

(orientation has always been misused in context)

 

#1 Genetics (True Genetic orientation)

#2 Mental health (trauma, abuse, phobia)

#3 Self Awareness (aware of your natural thoughts)

#4 Love/Relationship

#5 Peer Pressure

#6 Society

#7 Confidence

#8 Understanding

 

All those factors and many more contribute to what we consider our identity whether it be Hetero, Homo, or Bi. People tend to believe that sexuality is a restraint on who we can and can't love, However taking that out of context also leads to the same common misconceptions such as "gay is a choice" - The truth that many can agree on is that relationships are formed on our base genetics and orientation but not limited too (other factors) that includes Bi-sexual who even though 'Bi' still side with one orientation over the other.

 

Love is another topic that goes hand in hand with sexual orientation and is influenced by it.

However love can come in many forms like family and friends, and those bonds can be compared to platonic relations where sexual desire plays no effect. However this topic is mostly about sexual relations, and how we identify ourselves.

 

 

 

Concluding the primary subject: For those who come out of the closet mid relationship, Good on you because you're being honest with yourself, even if you aren't 100% sure on how you identify yourself. Our identity is all we have and its ok if it changes later. Just be aware that there are many more factors then you initially understand.

Like losing interest in your current partner for other reasons; Growing apart, personal change, or dysfunctional problems. At the end of the day you're trying to find yourself, sometimes you have to move on and if that's how you feel. at least be honest with yourself.

Conclusion: Our Identity is how we live by, but its not always true to our genetics and we all must find our place where we are comfortable, for most of us that is easy, others its not so easy.

 

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Feel free to share your thoughts, I tried my best to rant without leaving conflicting grey areas, it a very deep and layered topic that many people take for granted, and even then I tried to include every spectrum in a neutral topic.

Would you have a different arrangement on how variables affect us and our identity?
Also, don't ask about my 'friend' its just a ackward situation that's even messier then you think
I feel that my views are very open and modern, being accepting of all people and understanding that life has more factors and variables then we can perceive. in the end, our sexual orientation is who we are when we're born because genetics are just ugly

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TLDR: With enough encouragement even the straightest man would love to take a D


Edited by DIGI_Byte, 21 November 2013 - 02:23 PM.


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#2 Radspakr Wolfbane

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 01:50 PM

Here I was thinking this topic was advertising a cage match, never judge a thread by its title.


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#3 Irenë Hawnetyne

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 01:59 PM

Yes. That's my 20 cents, as they say.


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#4 DIGI_Byte

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 02:26 PM

Edited title, more suitable.
you agree with the post Irene?



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#5 Irenë Hawnetyne

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 03:28 PM

Pretty much, yeah. Kinda skimread tbh, I'm at school (and supposed to be working)


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#6 Pasidon

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 05:02 PM

Wow.  Come on down to Revora.  Where we only talk about sex and Satan.  My gosh.


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#7 Coretella

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 11:24 PM

http://www.roosterta...1-third-edition

 

One of the best explanations I've found.



#8 MattTheLegoman

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 01:58 AM

Yeah, at church we had a similar explanation. ;p But it wasn't all cartoony like that - it came from a ~90 year old brain scientist.


Edited by MattTheLegoman, 22 November 2013 - 02:01 AM.

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#9 Radspakr Wolfbane

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 02:08 AM

Ha "Ask me next week" I like that he's like I'm straight now but next week I just might bang a dude. :p

 

But I think this was pretty much covered back in Irene's topic.


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#10 Beowulf

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 06:37 PM

If I hear anyone saying that sexuality is a choice, I will promptly run them over with my SUV. It's not a choice and it never will be. I won't pretend to know why some people end up the way they do but the simple fact is that they do and there's no "curing it." I, myself, am not heterosexual, nor am I on the other end of the spectrum. I fall in the middle but the "risk factors" that usually come up? I qualify for basically none of those. I had a steady homelife, a positive childhood and nothing else that people claim are root causes of a different sexuality. Just boils down to people being fucking different and some people not being able to handle that.

 

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#11 Irenë Hawnetyne

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 07:33 AM

Correction: Just boils down to people fucking differently.


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#12 Beowulf

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 03:51 PM

Correction: Just boils down to people fucking differently.

There's that too.


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#13 DIGI_Byte

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 03:52 PM

there's no choice because we are a slave to our genetics even if we identify ourselves as something different.



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#14 duke_Qa

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:33 PM

I read a psychologist's description of sexuality that split it up in five onion layers:

 

1. Sexual identity, the core, very very hard to alter, surgery and hormone treatment being the most adapted aides.

2. Sexual preference. Homosexual/heterosexual or in between, relatively static and more or less impossible to alter, colors the person's preferences further out.

3. Sexual interests. Them kinks, all those little things you like about someone, what you fill your drives with(I guess I'm getting old if everyone has gone to streaming their stuff). Can go against your preferences but usually align.

4. Sexual role. What sort of role you take on culturally, do you like manly jobs/hobbies or womanly jobs/hobbies and if they match your body and all that. Can be adjusted as much as your job/hobbies are adjusted. Probably also goes with relationships, giving you a role as a boyfriend/girlfriend can be something people desire.

5. Sexual disinterests. What turns you off and/or gives you the "NOPE", the blacklist that most easily can be adjusted and ignored if the pro's outweigh the cons. Usually "I don't want to have sex because I/you would get pregnant and I don't want that" goes in here until the pros. 

 

So I guess I'm saying its not just black and white, but some constants are constant.


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#15 Beowulf

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:43 PM

some constants are constant.

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#16 Irenë Hawnetyne

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:27 PM

1. Sexual identity, the core, very very hard to alter, surgery and hormone treatment being the most adapted aides.

2. Sexual preference. Homosexual/heterosexual or in between, relatively static and more or less impossible to alter, colors the person's preferences further out.

3. Sexual interests. Them kinks, all those little things you like about someone, what you fill your drives with(I guess I'm getting old if everyone has gone to streaming their stuff). Can go against your preferences but usually align.

4. Sexual role. What sort of role you take on culturally, do you like manly jobs/hobbies or womanly jobs/hobbies and if they match your body and all that. Can be adjusted as much as your job/hobbies are adjusted. Probably also goes with relationships, giving you a role as a boyfriend/girlfriend can be something people desire.

5. Sexual disinterests. What turns you off and/or gives you the "NOPE", the blacklist that most easily can be adjusted and ignored if the pro's outweigh the cons. Usually "I don't want to have sex because I/you would get pregnant and I don't want that" goes in here until the pros. 

 

 

 
I've considered this before, though not sequentially. It's quite a sensible way of putting it. Out of interest, what are your NOPEs?

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#17 Hostile

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 07:42 PM

My guess is there are at least a large % of people who we all knew right from our childhood that they were gay. Then there are the ones you suspected but weren't sure, then found out later they were gay. Then there are the ones that you never saw it coming, but they were gay. Then there were the ones who were only gay for alittle while...

 

I don't think it's a choice. I think it's genetic. Besides the people who can't get sex and simply want to close thier eyes and get off.

 

Why do we continue to question something that has been around since the beginning of time? Does it take THAT long to figure out something so basic? And why are these people having so much trouble getting married? I would think, "hey let these two people get married and then we don't have to deal with it until they get DIVORCED."

 

So many questions, so little time. If two gay people get divorced, who pays the alimony?

 

And the same with prostitution. In the states, they say about abortion "well it's my body" so why can't you sell your body then? Why is it a crime to charge for something that's perfectly legal to give away for free? You can donate your body to science, you can have an abortion, but you can't blow out your brains and God forbid you ever decide to smoke weed.

 

porn=prostitution with a camera and legal

hooker=prostitution without a camera and illegal

and why does legal have one "L" and illegal have two? Why is the country called the Philippines and yet the people are called filipenoes?

 

Does that make any sense?



#18 Irenë Hawnetyne

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 08:49 PM

That last bit. Just a little sliver of pure awesomeness there.


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#19 Pasidon

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 10:04 PM

Don't worry.  I'll find a cure for you guys.


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#20 Hostile

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 10:25 PM

Wow, you can actually found a cure for ass-burger?

(Asperger syndrome)

When you find that cure, you come find me. I'd like to cure what ails me.

 

http://en.wikipedia....perger_syndrome






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