52 replies to this topic

[Nazgûl]

Hey forum and fellow LotR-nerds! I'm just a little bit curious to see who amongst you that agree with me about the Hobbit movies. Here's my little summary and personal grading... 

 

The Hobbit - an Unexpected Journey. I'd rate it 4,5 of 5. I have seen this one several times, and even though I still feel more of a "wow" factor about the Lord of the Rings movies throughout (5/5), I must say I am very pleased and happy about how the first Hobbit movie turned out. Amazing scenery, convincing caracters (such as Bilbo, Azog, Great Goblin and Thorin's Company) with awesome makeup and CGI, wonderful music, strong LotRs-ambience and overall good actors.

The Hobbit - Desolation of Smaug. I'd rate this one 3 of 5. Seen this one two times, and not sure if there will be more. For some reason, PJ & Co seem to have done almost a "George Lucas" here, and drop from the standard they once set, into more of a main stream production. There's still a lot of the things that was good in the first film, that is still good in this one. But meh...

1) I am Swedish, and the actor Michael Persbrandt is a good Swedish performer - IN SWEDISH... but absolutely NOT in English. When I imagined someone to portray such a strong character as Beorn, I visualized someone big and sturdy (like John Rhys Davis kind of sturdy). Someone with authority, with a proper build rather than gigantic side burns like some kind of Wolverine on acid, and proper English pronunciation please. This was almost pathetic and painful to watch - not to mention embarrasing for me as a swede.

2) What the heck is up with the silly flirtation going on between a dwarf and an elf? Not to be "racist", but Tolkien would probably be upset? I think they did a good job with the new character Tauriel, but do we really need to see several minutes of this highly unlikely and silly Twilight-ish romance, combined with Legolas childish jealousy? It reduces the pace of the story and steers it into a completely unnecessary and completely made up side track.

 

3) The scene with the barrels in the river... omg? Looks good and all - dont get me wrong. But am I the only one that finds the scene too long? And when Bombur bounces around hitting all the orcs on random like a ping pong ball and then does a spinning move like a washing machine... I mean, come on?

4) The elven guard of Mirkwood? Who the heck designed that armor? It just looks odd and more like a sci-fi space costume then an elven armor in Middle Earth?

5) Well, this is lore-criticism as well though, but... what are the odds of finding the Arkenstone within minutes from entering the chamber, amongst 100 000 billions of coins and treasures? If I was PJ, I would have bent the story slightly so that Smaug would have kept the Arkenstone close, so that Bilbo would find it when Smaug emerges... considering that Smaug knew about the Arkenstones importance. But, yeah.

6) Smaug vs Dwarves was... oh boy? A gigiantic super powerful ancient intelligent creature vs a handfull of small dwarves operating a smelting works made for a whole city, using it to "battle" the dragon. This scene could defenitely have been directed in a more beleivable way. And when you think you've seen it all, it culminates into:

7) the gigantic golden statue trap that melts upon Smaug. I have no words... it's just... xxx!   

Seven deadly sins for me...

Edited by Nazgûl, 08 May 2014 - 09:20 PM.

[Lauri]

Unexpected Journey: 4/5

Desolation of Smaug: 2/5

 

1. Don't blame Michael for that. I'm 90% sure that accent is how PJ wanted it. Personally, I feel that PJ made the worst possible Beorn there is. Again, this is not on Michael.

2. Elves and men have romance, why couldn't dwarves? I don't know if Tolkien has said anything specific between dwarves and elves\men. But yeah, the romance in the film is bollocks.

3. I like how Bilbo didn't get a barrel, but they had a spare one for Bombur. The whole scene is a mockery.

4. Probably WETA.

5. I don't recall how long it took in the book, but I think it works fine in the film. I don't remember if Smaug had a special relationship to the Arkenstone anyways, seeing as nobody was allowed to take even a single penny, so I don't see why he'd keep it particularly close.

[{IRS}Athos]

In the books, Bilbo didn't find the Arkenstone until after Smaug had left, as he had the leisure time to poke around. He found it when he was looking around by himself, although the rest of the dwarves were inside at the time as well (Smaug having collapsed the entrance of the secret door).

[Lenwë]

Yeah the barrel scene was to keep the non-lotr fans interested with some action movie type of thing.

 

The Arkenstone though, I mean was that supposed to be fate? Just like how in AUJ the perfect moon was shining as they stayed in Rivendell.

 

Fate..............

[Mathijs]

AUJ: 80/100

 

Obviously not on the level of LotR, but an entertaining and, dare I say it, heartfelt Middle-earth film. Highlights for me were the prologue, the unexpected party, and Gollum. I hated the Stone Giants scene, and felt the ending was pure cheese and too obviously tacked on after the 3-film decision was made. I hated Azog on my first viewing, but I've come to appreciate his addition over subsequent viewings. 

 

DOS: 50/100

 

I was and still am severely disappointed with this film. There were good bits, and unlike you guys, I *loved* this portrayal of Beorn, along with the outlandish accent, as well as the portrayal of Thranduil and the Woodland Realm. Gandalf in Dol Guldur was decent, the prologue in Bree was decent, Bilbo's encounter with Smaug was terrific, but that's about it for me. I cannot watch the Tauriel/Kili stuff (especially that healing scene, I remember me and my girlfriend having to control our laughter in the cinema), and the Smaug vs. Dwarves confrontation was just fucking stupid. Watching that I felt my heart sank because, as Nazgul mentioned, it was just too reminiscent of the bullshit Lucas pulled with his Star Wars prequels.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

Honestly, I guess I'm one of those few who preferred the sequel. I try to watch book-films objectively, so I enjoy them for what they are rather than what they try to be. Hence, with the Hobbit films thus far, my one problem has been that golden statue CGI mess which was entirely unnecessary and not particularly well executed. Also, the slightly disoriented Smaug vs Dwarves scene was slightly too long. Other than that, I thoroughly enjoyed both.

[{IRS}Athos]

I agree with Mathijs's points about the first film. Nothing for me to add there.

On the subject of DoS, I found the barrel-chase scene completely ridiculous and out-of-place, but that didn't mean I didn't find it funny. True, it may not have aligned with the tone of the film, but it was much closer to the tone of the book compared to other parts of DoS (the overwrought gold-surfing, for example).

[Mathijs]

Oh, yes... Thorin surfing a wheelbarrow on molten gold. 

 

Seriously, the whole Dwarves vs. Smaug scenario reads like it was written by a bunch of stoners.

[Bofur]

I'm agreeing with Renny, here, in that I found DoS more interesting than AUJ, as loads of the film is spent in new locations, as opposed to AUJ, which seemed a little too like FotR, to me, in terms of plot.

However, having watched AUJ several times on DVD, I certainly prefer that as an adaptation.

Things I do like about DoS:

Title Scene
Dol Guldur
Mirkwood and Spiders
Thorin/Thranduil confrontation
The Barrel Sequence
Lake Town Arrival
Everything Gandalf!
Everything in Erebor, except for the molten Gold. That looked ugly.

Edited by Bofur, 08 May 2014 - 07:21 PM.

[Mathijs]

Hmm, yes, the spiders were pretty neat (though parts of the Mirkwood environment in those scenes were bad CGI). Laketown looked cool.

[Elric]

I likes both of the films however if you compare it to the book then the second film blows. If you watch it as if you haven't read the book it's interesting and keeps your attention.

The romance however is what I truely disliked. It just wasn't the right time or place for such a concept.


On a side note in both films did anyone get bothered by all the bright colors compared to the regular lotr movies? I know camera quality is improved but in lotr I could of sworn they muted the colors except for the elves scenes at rivendell.

Posted from my iPhone

[Mathijs]

The teal and orange color grading in AUJ did bother me at times, yes. It's an annoying cinema fad that needs to go away.

[Nazgûl]

I hated Azog on my first viewing, but I've come to appreciate his addition over subsequent viewings. 

 

DOS: 50/100

Watching that I felt my heart sank because, as Nazgul mentioned, it was just too reminiscent of the bullshit Lucas pulled with his Star Wars prequels.

- What he said! I was surprised by Azog at first, but he grew on me. Now I love that caracter =)

- Yes, I can't help but to think of how Lucas butchered his own universe with the utter crap he called prequels, and in some way, PJ almost ventured into the same direction, even though not as far. I really hope hope Battle of the Five Armies will be 5/5

You guys brought up so many good things that I had to extend and add more points to my review as well

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

I think I'm the only one here who actually liked Fili and Tauriel's little flirty thing. I think it's kinda cute, and I think it works. It gives the Hobbit another Arwen-Aragorn like thing (though admittedly it feels slightly less authentic, but I think that's just natural Dwarvish unsubtleties rather than a fault or the writing)

[Nazgûl]

Well that's just it, to me it's a "rip off" from their romance. They even added the "starlight" to Tauriel as she heals Kili (like Arwen healing Frodo).

[Mathijs]

Not only did they add it, they added it badly. God, that scene was unintentionally funny. The weird zombie-look in her eyes, the numb chanting...

 

The whole 'romance' could have worked if they'd echoed Gimli's adoration of Galadriel. Kili distantly being awed by her grace and beauty, so different from the negative portrayal of Elves he'd grown up on.

 

Kili's 'I could have anything down my trousers' line was so tremendously awful it took me right out of the film. And Legolas' involvement making it a love-triangle? Gods no. So bad.

[Bofur]

The teal and orange color grading in AUJ did bother me at times, yes. It's an annoying cinema fad that needs to go away.

I'm trying to forget that colour grading in Goblin Town. Everything orange, except the backlight and Sting. Eurgh.

[NewErr]

I did love the Mirkwood  Palace Guards, indeed it seemes very goofy at first but then again, after diggin up that design it really looks awesome.

The only thing wrong is where they are used, you would have never guessed if used out of context , that those guys were the royal guard of MIRKWOOD. On first glimpse you might say they were some guards of Gondolin or something very high-elvish. That , most likely, is because of the color scheme they used for them. The soldier from the Battle of The Five Armies, well , those looks super badass and silvan like ( except that helmet , that one still looks a bit goofy )

I still don't like very much theyr shields tho...

Edited by Valaquenta10, 09 May 2014 - 11:25 AM.

[Nazgûl]

Kili's 'I could have anything down my trousers' line was so tremendously awful it took me right out of the film.

Indeed... aweful!

[Echo]

There were a few things that bothered me in DoS. The Dol Guldur scene of Gandalf was good until he faced Sauron, the battle and Gandalfs constant moaning was just... out of place. And the "Saaaaurooon" quote of Gandalf didn't quite fit there as well, but that's what I think. Also the part where they all leave the hidden door after sunset, doubting their own map and secrets whie Bilbo as the only non-dwarf keeps trying to open the door and does the math eventually. Though the map was a little bit confusing in the movie because it had "setting sun" and "last light of Durins Day" in it, but still unfitting that the Dwarfs give up so fast and Thorin drops the only remaining key to Erebor on the ground without hesitation. No comment about the molten gold scene. All in all, the movie was not bad in my eyes, but it wasn't convincing either. What I really, really missed in the movie is a proper highlight/conclusion of the movie at the end. While all former movies had a highlight scene and an obviously fading ending scene, this one did not:

 

FotR: Battle of Amon Hen, Boromir's death and the breaking of the fellowship

TTT: Battle of Helms Deep, Destruction of Isengard, Gandalf's quote about the battle for Middle-earth

RotK: Battle of the Black Gate, Destruction of the ring, Aragorn becomes king, Hobbits return home, journey to the grey havens

 

AUJ: Bilbo says why he wants to help dwarves after the Goblin Town scene, Azog prepares for one final attack, Thorin gets defeated, Bilbo saves him, Bilbo & Thorin become friends and we get a peak at the lonely mountain

DoS: Battle against the dragon, Dragon gets molten in gold, flies to Esgaroth basically in the middle of all the action... sudden end... that just makes no sense