Replying to Skirmish AI 2.0 Beta 7 - Post Comments In Thread!

The Necron's Builder Scarabs followed some Necron Warriors, and stood in the middle of a battle as the NW's moved against my forces, so they (Builder Scarabs) were somewhat forced to be a part of it. At first glance I thought that the Scarabs just wanted to reach a certain destination, and that because the NW's were on their path that the Scarabs seemed to follow them. But it wasn't the case after I watched more carefully.

The Builder Scarabs deliberately followed them as if they wanted to repair them.

I'm shocked! Someone mistakes my support detector code for a bug... Starting to cry... :( . (Okay, not really)

No, honestly, the Necron scarab builders are quiet the multitalents in this race. Builder, capturers and detectors. If there are any infiltrated buildings or troops on the map, then Necrons will send one scarab builder as detector support for the attack or defense forces. So no problem at all . The SM do the same with skull probes.


Some more comments to your original report:

1.) Gathering problems
Actually the AI doesn't always 'gather' if you see them gathering troops at a specific point. Normally, if they gather them at their front post, they just wait there until they are strong enough to attack. They constantly compare their army strength with the one of their enemy and if they haven't reached a certain percentage of the enemys army strength they will just wait at a good defense position for them.
I've increased the unit strength of the Necron warriors and Lord a bit in the beta 8. This will give them some more 'courage' for attacks. This will also reduce their intense allied support a bit, since attacking forces only support if it's REALLY urgent!

2.) Hesitation between gathering, ally support and attack
The other races use the same code, so it's mainly a problem of the slow speed of the Necrons. Normally, they'd have the home teleport as compensation, but sadly this feature isn't supported by Relics AI core routines. I've seen quiet a lot of games which Necrons lost simply because they couldn't reach their home base fast enough to save their monolith from being destroyed. But maybe, Relic will add this feature in a patch. We'll see.

3.) The Broadsides used their entrench ability properly this time around
Excellent!

Nice report, like always...

Oh my God Arkhan I feel bad.

I'm sorry mate !

See, the problem is I'm a very disgraceful Necron player (I mean, very). I don't know their strategies, I don't know how they play. The Builder Scarabs being detector units ... I didn't know (isn't the Wraith supposed to be one as well ?). When I started playing DC I immediately went for the Tau instead, meh. Same thing about their (Necrons) speed. I obviously didn't consider that in my tests, making me think they were confused, even though it was right there for me to notice right away (how they move slowly is so evident, it cries and yells at the player). Sometimes I wonder where is my brain.

All other races, including the Tau to a good extent, it's all okay, but the Necrons ... I have much to learn about them, so that I don't mistakingly see an actual feature for them that works properly as intended, as some bug or inconsistency in the codes. Argh ...

The Necron's Builder Scarabs followed some Necron Warriors, and stood in the middle of a battle as the NW's moved against my forces, so they (Builder Scarabs) were somewhat forced to be a part of it. At first glance I thought that the Scarabs just wanted to reach a certain destination, and that because the NW's were on their path that the Scarabs seemed to follow them. But it wasn't the case after I watched more carefully.

The Builder Scarabs deliberately followed them as if they wanted to repair them.

I'm shocked! Someone mistakes my support detector code for a bug... Starting to cry... :( . (Okay, not really)

No, honestly, the Necron scarab builders are quiet the multitalents in this race. Builder, capturers and detectors. If there are any infiltrated buildings or troops on the map, then Necrons will send one scarab builder as detector support for the attack or defense forces. So no problem at all . The SM do the same with skull probes.


Some more comments to your original report:

1.) Gathering problems
Actually the AI doesn't always 'gather' if you see them gathering troops at a specific point. Normally, if they gather them at their front post, they just wait there until they are strong enough to attack. They constantly compare their army strength with the one of their enemy and if they haven't reached a certain percentage of the enemys army strength they will just wait at a good defense position for them.
I've increased the unit strength of the Necron warriors and Lord a bit in the beta 8. This will give them some more 'courage' for attacks. This will also reduce their intense allied support a bit, since attacking forces only support if it's REALLY urgent!

2.) Hesitation between gathering, ally support and attack
The other races use the same code, so it's mainly a problem of the slow speed of the Necrons. Normally, they'd have the home teleport as compensation, but sadly this feature isn't supported by Relics AI core routines. I've seen quiet a lot of games which Necrons lost simply because they couldn't reach their home base fast enough to save their monolith from being destroyed. But maybe, Relic will add this feature in a patch. We'll see.

3.) The Broadsides used their entrench ability properly this time around
Excellent!

Nice report, like always...

I was watching the replay for the first match once more, and I noticed the following ...

The Necron's Builder Scarabs followed some Necron Warriors, and stood in the middle of a battle as the NW's moved against my forces, so they (Builder Scarabs) were somewhat forced to be a part of it. At first glance I thought that the Scarabs just wanted to reach a certain destination, and that because the NW's were on their path that the Scarabs seemed to follow them. But it wasn't the case after I watched more carefully.

The Builder Scarabs deliberately followed them as if they wanted to repair them.

However if I am not mistaken I believe that Arkhan mentioned something regarding builder units from any races that would tend to have such a behavior and that not much could be done about it (or something like that). Could you please confirm Arkhan ? I think I've read that somewhere in a thread from earlier builds. I'll try to check for that myself. I just wanted to point out that it's still present in Beta 7 (if it matters to mention).

As mentioned, mostly noticeable at the specified moment in the first match. It happened at around 8:50 minutes into the game when the Necrons started to gather at their Relic to move south and attack me. Here, some screen shots.






I'm not sure though if the builders for the Tau and Orks did the same. I'll take a look, and report of they do.

Well ... actually it is not that important.

Don't know how it works but what happens when infiltrating units are detected. ? Is IsInfiltrating() false then ? If yes then the commander will still attach, preventing their next infiltration. If no everything is fine.

Um... actually I've no idea.

Don't know how it works but what happens when infiltrating units are detected. ? Is IsInfiltrating() false then ? If yes then the commander will still attach, preventing their next infiltration. If no everything is fine.

I solved the problem by adding an IsInfiltrated() check to the attaching code. Therefore single units are not allowed to attach to infiltrating units. I almost forgot the infiltrating skull probes, but Thudo recognized it and now I've added another check, so infiltrators are allowed to attach to all squads, infiltrating or not.

I suggest allowing to attach to them as long as the corresponding infiltration isn't researched yet.

Commander shouldn't attach to squads which can cloak, forcing them to be visible. I observed a force commander at low health attached to scouts while another scout squad was invisible.

Should be easy to fix.. (based on the Attachments. script in the following faction unitstats.ai)

CSM - do not attach to Cultist and Marine Squads (both Infiltrate)
Eldar - do not attach to Rangers
SM - do not attach to Scouts

All other factions are unaffected. Thanks Larkin for seeing that!

Commander shouldn't attach to squads which can cloak, forcing them to be visible. I observed a force commander at low health attached to scouts while another scout squad was invisible.