53 replies to this topic

[Kekoulis]

I would say a cap of two squads. The Kill-Team is exclusive to the DA. The ones we have are ex-veterans or traitors.I doubt they would keep the same formation as before.

 

Also,for this reason,I won't be making termie heroes.These are exclusive to DA.

[Gambit]

Yeah, no need for Termi heroes of course, but...

 

I would say a cap of two squads.

"Two" as in, "Melee and Ranged"? But isn't this the standard config?

I was thinking we should take a different approach to Fallen.

The Kill-Team is exclusive to the DA.

Indeed, but... The multi-leader approach is the only alternative I came up with.

The idea is to keep the Fallen, minimal. Not TOO MANY squad choices. And the ideal of ONE termi squad sounds OK to me.

So why not a leader-based squad, but we name it differently ?? For example ex-kill team veterans, or simply use an irrelevant-to-kill-team name, that is more "catchy":

 

I mean, if we follow the "small squads" approach for FA squads, we should follow the Hardened Veterans rule. (the other "meat" squads will be regular Infantry, possibly scores of it, eventually!)

Under this rule, ALL FA Marines are Veterans. And this way, small squads WILL stand a chance against other races' squads.

 

So why not Fallen Angels Veteran Terminators (as name), and with multi-leader approach? I mean, 4 leaders + 2 Termi members will be OK.

Ideas?

Edited by Gambit, 23 October 2019 - 09:07 PM.

[Kekoulis]

 

So why not Fallen Angels Veteran Terminators (as name), and with multi-leader approach? I mean, 4 leaders + 2 Termi members will be OK.

Ideas?

First:
I am not making Fallen Deathwing Heroes/Leaders.

This means no Fallen termie Banner Bearer,Apothecary,etc.

 

We are not going to just turn the DA into chaos.

 

Second:I suggested a cap of two squads.Whatever weapons.My reasoning is that the fallen are a jack of all trades.They have a bit of everything in chaos flavour but not the specialization the normal DA has.And they are in small numbers.

If you want a kill team,then make it as each unit has a weapon choice,although again,this would be the same as the Kill-Team in the normal guys.

Unless you do not mind and combine the two ideas.

 

Like a ranged kill-team and a melee kill-team.

 

Same deal with the bikes if we end up adding them.

 

Just normal bike squads.No bike leaders.

[Gambit]

I am not making Fallen Deathwing Heroes/Leaders.

This means no Fallen termie Banner Bearer,Apothecary,etc.

No need for those, we do NOT want to replicate the Dark Angels.

With all the weapons the Termies have already, they WILL appear as the Veterans we want them to be.

And we do not want any special for Termies, no leaders or anything.

We are OK

 

Second:I suggested a cap of two squads.Whatever weapons.

This is the standard solution, and this is was I was after in the first place.

I posted the question, in case we could make something different for the Fallen.

But yeah, if everything else fails, we will resort to the standard implementation.

My reasoning is that the fallen are a jack of all trades.They have a bit of everything in chaos flavour but not the specialization the normal DA has.And they are in small numbers.

Exactly my reasoning!

If you want a kill team,then make it as each unit has a weapon choice,although again,this would be the same as the Kill-Team in the normal guys.

Indeed,...

Unless you do not mind and combine the two ideas.

Like a ranged kill-team and a melee kill-team.

YEAP!!! This is it!

Deathwing Kill-Teams are multi-purpose. They can have BOTH melee AND ranged weapons. That is the idea and concept of kill-teams anyway.

So if we make TWO teams with one role (ranged only/melee only) we are AWAY from the Kill-Team idea.

Perfect. Case solved

 

 

Same deal with the bikes if we end up adding them.

Just normal bike squads.No bike leaders.

Hmm... We will see in the process, but yeah I think only one squad of bikes SHOULD be in.

We have Tacticals/Termies, so one squads of Bikes is OK to add to "complete" the race.

[fuggles]

Malal army when?

Make the base a thunderhawk or something movable that has to leave, so you have to have a backup base in place before then.

Or go Herzog zwei and make them scar controlled so you build units that do specific things, attack, defend, patrol.

[Kekoulis]

Malal army when?
 

Never.Fuck malal.

 

I agree with the Thunderhawk as HQ.

 

My model can work like that brother Gambit.

Edited by Kekoulis, 25 October 2019 - 05:38 PM.

[Gambit]

Aha!

So then TH HQ it is

We will need some more coding of course, but I have it covered!

 

Right now, I am in the process of putting in the units and the squads.

I am not far, the race is only a few days old! So far, I have put in the following:

0] Warpsmith: Their builder, an EXCELLENT model. TONS of weapon choices, we will see what to use.

1] Tactical Veterans + Tactical Veteran Sergeant: They start fully with melee weapons and bolters. They can get flamer/plasma/melta/volkite (the volkites will be unlocked with a research)

2] Havoc Veterans + Havoc Veteran Sergeant: They start fully with simple melee weapons (knives) and all carry bolters. They can upgrade their heavy bolters to autocannons/Lascannons/Missile Launchers/Heavy Volkites (again, the volkites will be unlocked with a research)

3] Raptor Veterans + Raptor Veteran Sergeant: They start as expected, but can get flamers and plasmas.

4] Veteran Termies: The team consists of ONE member. And 4 "leaders" (total of 5). These members are NOT sergeants, but "simple" Veteran Termies. They get: Heavy Flamer / Autocannon / Plasma Cannon / Missile Pod.

5] Veteran Assault Termies: The team consists of ONE member. And assault 4 "leaders" (total of 5). These members are NOT sergeants, but "simple" Veteran Termies. They get: Thunderhammer+Shield/DaemonSword/ ChainfistsPair/LightningClawsPair.

6] Renegades: They get 7 light "2-handed" weapons, to choose from. They will be our "meatshield"

7] Advanced Weapon Renegades: They come in pares. They have 6 weapons that you have to "stand" in order to fire.

 

They have no UCS/Icons/Weapons this far, of course.

 

Any suggestions?

 

---------------------------

 

Next, I have to add two more (the last) infantry entities, that will most possibly be members of a command squad.

... Which means, I am moving to leaders. And brother Kek has sent me MANY!

But from now on, I will go slower, we are talking about 20 units already in so far - and I was VERY careful in putting them in.

Took me too much time.

So... Slower

 

 

Once done with the units, I will post the Race Design I have created (99% based on your input).

Edited by Gambit, 25 October 2019 - 06:06 PM.

[Kekoulis]

All excellent as always!

But an objection.

According to the fluff,don't the Havoks always start with Heavy Bolters as they are the heavy weapon specialists and then upgrade to different weapons?
 

The Devastators start with bolters(although,I always wondered why on some mods,the number of the upgrades is less than the actual members instead of being equal).

Edited by Kekoulis, 25 October 2019 - 11:47 PM.

[fuggles]

Suggestion - no builder. Self building units, animation is a flare and then the building is dropped from the air.

[Kekoulis]

Suggestion - no builder. Self building units, animation is a flare and then the building is dropped from the air.

No.

I already made a Warpsmith.

Unless you can suggest a workaround.

[fuggles]

Make them all marines buildings with wargear that gives them chaos bits so you can customise how far you fall?

[Kekoulis]

Make them all marines buildings with wargear that gives them chaos bits so you can customise how far you fall?

Oh God hell no!

 

I am not doing that.

[Gambit]

According to the fluff,don't the Havoks always start with Heavy Bolters as they are the heavy weapon specialists and then upgrade to different weapons?

Brother Kek, I accidental wrote "bolters" above! If you look again, in the very next sentence, I say "They can upgrade their heavy bolters to...".

So yeah, they all start with heavy bolters. And they all, always carry heavy weapons

 

No builder

Well, after having seen brother Kek's Warpsmith, I DEFINITELY want to use him!

The Fallen are Dark Angels anyway, and we can design them as we want them to.

My approach is: "Tempted by Chaos, but didn't fully succumbed to it".

The mechanic behind this, is a SHIFTING ALIGNMENT game. The same as Cypher.

So they are NOT fully chaos!

Let's keep the builder.

 

That being said, we still keep that TH HQ idea?

Or I make them "standard"?

[Kekoulis]

Keep the TH as the HQ and the rest of the Chaos buildings we agreed.

 

A mixture of good and evil.

 

And have the Warpsmith build them!

 

Maybe even give him a retinue of evil servitors!

 

(Or not.)

Edited by Kekoulis, 25 October 2019 - 11:47 PM.