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C&C universes...


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#1 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 08:58 AM

i have realized how the three universes, tiberium, red alert and generals, could all link together...

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you see, it goes:
our universe goes along as it is, till Einstein uses his time machine, to go back and erase hitler.

now there is two universes, our one, and the red alert one, in which hitler is gone and soviets come to power.
upon the allied victory, the universe leads to red alert two
but upon the soviet victory, we get the tiberium universe...

now, hear me out, as i was a sceptic of the idea that soviet victory leads to tib universe, allied to red alert 2, but i have looked over it, and have come to find a fair few points that could support this idea

1. kane is kane from tiberium universe (duh)
2. he is stalins adviser in the soviet campaign, but in the allied one you see no reference to him
3. they kill stalin, and whats her name goes on about how nod will use the soviet union for a while, before discarding it in the 1990's
4. the tiberium universe is set shortly after this, meaning events could very will have occurred this way
5. given that the soviets take over europe, and then kain takes control of the soviets, this gives him perfect access to italy, and the tiber river, where it is said that he already knows that the tiberium will land there
6. if the soviets defeated the allies, then this could explain the loss of allied technology from red alert to tiberium dawn, the soviet tech is not so easy, but perhaps it just became outdated or to expensive to run (some of the surviving allied tech could also be lost this way)
7. nod could then have been able to build funds and power from leeching it off the soviets bit by bit, after all, kain would be controlling the soviets and do mostly what he wants with them (only thing holding him back would be wanting to remain hidden)

now there are probably some others i have now forgotten, but theres a few points to think about (of coarse, eventually communism could fail, or stop being practiced, the soviet union falling apart, and the nations all joining the GDI, which does have Russia as one of its members)


now, if we believe in this, then we know now that there are three universes

-ours
-red alert (allied victory)
-tiberium (soviet victory)


now, from there the universe go on un-split, our universe eventually leading to generals, thus you have your three universes all tieing in.


now an interesting fact:

the erasing of hitler could very well have had more effects then we first realized, not only did it bring power to the soviets, and the two wars that followed, but it could very well be directly responsible for yuri too.

the symbols on yuri's forehead are jewish, it can therefore be supposed that he could be of some jewish lineage. Hitler killed many many jews, yuri could well have been one of the many to be killed (and even if he is not jewish, the jewish symbols on his head could very well have been enough for the nazi's to judge him as one)

thus with his death by the nazi's, he never became the mad man we all know and love (not to mention that without the soviets he would also have not had his opportunity...)


and now a more far out idea,
what if kain was either abducted by the scrin? or traveled through time to the future of tiberium

i mean, scrin technology could be the reason why he never seems to age, he might have been infected by some super advanced nano bots or cloning, something or strange like that, he could also then have a way to know about tiberium, where it was going to land, and all that other stuff about it he knows

this could also be from the ships nod have been collecting, but what if this collection started with a ship that kain had been abducted by? either he somehow took control, or it crashed, letting him escape and take it for himself. thus the advanced tech of nod, and all the stuff they know about tiberium....
(yes, thats a bit more far out, but i just thought of it then and thought i'd add it in to the discussion)

Edited by some_wierdGuy., 21 March 2008 - 01:29 AM.

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#2 TX1138

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 09:05 AM

I've heard this exact theory somewhere before...
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#3 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 09:28 AM

really? i havn't... i thought i was the first to come up with it ;) ,i didnt copy it if there is, i came up with this myself :shiftee:

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#4 TX1138

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 10:45 AM

2. Kane is stalins adviser in the soviet campaign, but in the allied one you see no reference to him


Actually, Kane appears in one RA1 Allied briefing mission. He can be seen in the background when Stalin is making a broadcast boasting the Soviet's nuclear arsenal.

Edited by TX1138, 19 March 2008 - 10:47 AM.

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#5 OmegaBolt

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:05 PM

1. kane is kain from tiberium universe (duh)

It is spelt as Kane in both.

And yeah... this plan ain't new, though I don't think it is right. In TD the whole of Europe wasn't Nod, or Soviet, and even Russia was GDI if I remember right. Personally it's best just to have them separate. Tiberium/Ra1/Ra2/Generals. TBH I don't like associating Ra2 and with Ra1 and besides, 2 seems to be a start over. Einstein built the Chronosphere again and it just happens to be the only one in the world? You could say it was a merging of timelines like in YR...

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#6 GodSun666

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Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:50 PM

Wow. nice info :crazed:! i like it :crazed:!
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#7 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 21 March 2008 - 01:29 AM

thanks godsun

It is spelt as Kane in both.

And yeah... this plan ain't new, though I don't think it is right. In TD the whole of Europe wasn't Nod, or Soviet, and even Russia was GDI if I remember right.


sorry, kain... kane, im use to my friend called kain who is spelt like that... i'll fix it


and yeas, europe wasn't nod because nod finished up with the soviets in the 1990's, you, the soviet commander became the leader of the soviet union, you "keep the peace" till nod "tires of the USSR" after which you go off with nod, leaving the soviet union under control of whoever

so nod completely removed itself from the soviets, thats why russia and europe aren't part of nod, instead they join with GDI(a world anti-terrorist organization... and i mean, all the nations dont like terrorists so...), then kain shows himself, and you have tib dawn

so the soviets didn't stay under nod control, and most likely europe didn't stay under communism for to long either...


so it does make sense

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#8 Millennium

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 11:19 AM

Hmmmm... Certain remarks made in CNC3 point to the fact that Kane's various non-human traits are not the result of Scrin technology. He is in the Scrin database, but they refer to him as something even more ancient.

But why would Kane not appear if Hitler survived (thus leading to Generals...)? Option 1: Kane died in a KZ (unlikely)...
Option 2: Kane secretly leads the GLA!!!

Edited by Millennium, 30 March 2008 - 11:22 AM.

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#9 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 01 April 2008 - 07:17 AM

he just might never have come to power in the other two like he did in the tib series

i mean, yuri didn't come to power in the tib series... why should kain come to power in the red alert or generals series?

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#10 raminator

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Posted 01 April 2008 - 02:45 PM

generals is just an a$$biotchgame that had the cnc in its name to be selled better...
so take this one out...
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#11 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 09:07 AM

why does everyone hate generals so much? it wasn't a bad game...

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#12 raminator

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 11:54 AM

it was no cnc!
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#13 OmegaBolt

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 12:17 PM

It was Warcraft in the modern world.

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#14 Beowulf

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 01:54 PM

It was Warcraft in the modern world.

So?

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#15 Romanul

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 05:15 PM

1.Warcraft is made by Blizzard whilst CnC by WW/EA.

2.Warcraft is simply mithological whilst CnC is alternated universe.

#16 MCV

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 05:52 PM

i have realized how the three universes, tiberium, red alert and generals, could all link together...

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you see, it goes:
our universe goes along as it is, till Einstein uses his time machine, to go back and erase hitler.

now there is two universes, our one, and the red alert one, in which hitler is gone and soviets come to power.
upon the allied victory, the universe leads to red alert two
but upon the soviet victory, we get the tiberium universe...

now, hear me out, as i was a sceptic of the idea that soviet victory leads to tib universe, allied to red alert 2, but i have looked over it, and have come to find a fair few points that could support this idea

[Stuff]


Stop it! Right there! You're commiting mistake number one; Wild Mass Guessing. It's really, really simple.

WW made C&C TD
WW made C&C RA as a prequel to TD
WW made C&C TS as a sequel to TD
WWP made C&C RA2 as an non-canon spinnoff
WW/EA made Renegade, which doesn't fit anywhere (I'll explain later)
EA made Generals, using "C&C" to increase sales.
EA released C&C TFD, retconning TD and TS into one universe and RA and RA2 into another. (And Generals into a third)
EA released C&C3 TW as a sequel to TS

See. Easy. No "split timeline," no "advanced technological regression" just a buch of different timelines. Original WW canon is RA+CS+AM->TD+CO->TS->FS
New EA canon is TD+CO->TS->KW->FS->TW->KW, as well as RA+CS+AM->RA2->YR->(Timejump; RA3)

Pick one, don't dither.
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#17 OmegaBolt

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Posted 03 April 2008 - 06:37 PM

It was Warcraft in the modern world.

So?

Warcraft is generic (Or was the first before it became "generic", whatever). C&C has IMO the best base and army construction method; the sidebar. No other game has this and yet when EA made Generals they prefered to use the same build method every other RTS uses. Why, when theres perfectly original and fantastic method in the series never used by any other game (Except Dunes, but made by the same guys)? This instantly makes Generals another generic RTS, and a Warcraft clone.

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#18 some_weirdGuy

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 07:03 AM

with the new engine and new graphics they decided to try out a new build method, they got the point soon after that everyone liked the original way better...

this still doesn't make generals a bad game
(also, a bet when generals 2 comes out it will have the original way of building)


@MCV

yes i know that WW/EA really messed up and really made it up as they went along, but it is fun to try and fit them all together
i dont care that they are now saying "oh, they have nothing to do with each other, 3 different universes"

really, i am fitting it together for myself, not because we dont already have explanations from EA


the thought of how this fit together came to me when i heard a theory about time travel, that says that when you go back in time, you dont go back to your own reality(or else the whole kill your grandfather paradox*), instead, you go backwards, and 'across' in a sense, in that you go back to a parallel reality, after all, in your time you didnt go back, or else you wouldn't be able to change anything as it would already have been changed(see *)

anyway, so when you go back in time you actually go back and into a parallel reality, in this reality you change things, you dont go back to your reality when you change things, you go back to the one you jumped to(cause in your original reality, you changing whatever didnt happen)


so yes, technically the three games are in their own universes(see, i didn't just disregard what they said, i thought this through)

* the kill your grandfather paradox, as i called it, is where, say;
you go back in time, and accidentally kill your grandfather,thus your father is never born, thus you aren't born, so with you not being born, that means you dont go back, you dont kill grandpa, so you are born, so you do go back, so you do kill him, so you dont, so you do, so... and thus you are caught in a never ending time paradox

where as if you jump to a parallel universe, then it doesn't matter if you kill your grandpa, as supposably your real grandpa is still safe in your original universe
it just means the 'parallel universe you' will not be born

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#19 Beowulf

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 03:35 PM

Warcraft is generic (Or was the first before it became "generic", whatever). C&C has IMO the best base and army construction method; the sidebar. No other game has this and yet when EA made Generals they prefered to use the same build method every other RTS uses. Why, when theres perfectly original and fantastic method in the series never used by any other game (Except Dunes, but made by the same guys)? This instantly makes Generals another generic RTS, and a Warcraft clone.

So? It's the gameplay that counts and WarCraft/StarCraft play better than C&C does. Far easier than building one thing at a time.

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#20 OmegaBolt

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 05:19 PM

So? It's the gameplay that counts and WarCraft/StarCraft play better than C&C does. Far easier than building one thing at a time.

Interface is gameplay. Warcraft and Starcraft and slow and boring games, C&C (With it's leet interface :rolleyes: ) is far smoother, easier and much more fun. It has way more interesting sides to play with. The only thing cool about Starcraft is Protoss and Warcraft is just... fantasy.

Oh and I guess you've not played C&C3? You can build more than one thing at a time in that game, even with C&C sidebar building. And yes, it's a great game.

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