50 replies to this topic

[Phoenix Rising]

Neglecting the difficulty of getting PG to do it, would a patch by them solve your problem?

For this issue, negative. Well, unless they could unlock the dev console again, because I'm sure that has some way of tracking how the AI is thinking in-game. But a patch wouldn't be a silver bullet for this issue like it would for the new faction one.

[Tropical Bob]

Or would maybe, again neglecting the difficulty as feld mentioned, getting FoC open source help?

[Phoenix Rising]

Haha, yeah, it would - I'm a programmer more than anything - but open source would mean that someone could release a mod that required neither EaW nor FoC to be installed (or even purchased). I don't expect to ever see the source for EaW, save for the slim chance it gets released once the engine becomes so obsolete that no one could ever profit from it (Star Control).

[Darth Stalin]

Some thoughts about “Space colony AI bug”:
It seems that the AI does not build Space Colony because: either it is invisible for the AI or it has the name non-recognisable by the AI. So, why not go back to rename the Space Colony as “Space station” and make it visible for the AI, like it was in vanilla/PR 1.0? The new system of “space stations” could be then renamed into “orbital shipyard” and put into use. Maybe then the AI could build it and use it properly.

Moreover, if this would not work, then the only solution I can see is to make the ships buildable by default just with (vanilla) “Space station” (of required level), yet the PR space stations/”orbital shipyards” could then be used to increase construction speed as it was designed by PR – IIRC the AI still has advantages in construction time, so it would not hurt it too much; anyway as I remember from play in other mods/vanilla game the AI is very reluctant in building anything besides the “space station” (the defense satellites /gravity wells were extremely rare in my campaigns).

One more solution is to make the “orbital shipyard” being built automatically when required level of “space station” is constructed – I don’t know if that can be activated by any script, yet for the AI it could work well – as the AI builds “space station level 1” it should automatically start construction of “orbital shipyard level 1” and so on.

However for me it seems that the only solution is to rename the “space colony” into “space station” and maybe link it with “orbital shipyard”... maybe in PR 1.2 release?
I appreciate Your work on PR very much, but having to fight mostly against the pirates is rather boring in the long term, as the starting space colonies and star bases are the only shipyards for the player’s main opponent – the Alliance or the Empire. Thus making the AI to build shipyards and warships is the first goal to be achieved.

Edited by Darth Stalin, 16 March 2009 - 08:12 AM.

[Tropical Bob]

Really, we wouldn't even need to "rename" them. If you just change the unit's reference name, then the in-game name will still be the same, since that uses a string entry.

Technically, the name doesn't even matter, since you just input the new Star Base reference name into the AI's Star Base build script...But perhaps it could be a hardcode that the AI only accepts the vanilla Star Base names. Who knows? Perhaps I'll experiment with it if PR hasn't already tried that.

[Phoenix Rising]

Well, yeah, that's just it: I've done everything right, it just isn't working. If the AI can build Golans, then why not Colonies? It's the same procedure.

It's just perplexing and underlines how worthless the vanilla AI has become under so much mod.

[Darth Stalin]

Thus maybe the only solution will be the one I proposed:
to make the ships buildable by default just with (vanilla) “Space station” (of required level), yet the PR space stations/”orbital shipyards” could then be used to increase construction speed as it was designed by PR

BTW: is that possible to make the “orbital shipyard” (PR space station) being built automatically when required level of “space station” is constructed? (of course for AI only; the player has his own brain, does not need a script...)

[Tropical Bob]

Thus maybe the only solution will be the one I proposed:
to make the ships buildable by default just with (vanilla) “Space station” (of required level), yet the PR space stations/”orbital shipyards” could then be used to increase construction speed as it was designed by PR

BTW: is that possible to make the “orbital shipyard” (PR space station) being built automatically when required level of “space station” is constructed? (of course for AI only; the player has his own brain, does not need a script...)

The problem with the vanilla Star Base idea is that the main reason it was revamped was to clear up the build bar. Especially now with more ships in the roster.

[Darth Stalin]

Well, how the build bar was revamped? The Space Colony icon ist still visible and available to build, as well as the icons of PR Space Stations (shipyards). Or was that to move the Space Station from upper row to bottom row? Anyway, was that solution worth it?

EDIT: yeah, I realise: each level of PR space stations allow for construction of specified ship classes, but not the classes from "lower" levels of the stations, thus forcing the "ship construction specialisation" between the planets.
However, maybe there's something wrong in positioning the Space Colony in build row or whatever? (I now do not remember whether the vanilla star base was in upper row or in bottom row).

Edited by Darth Stalin, 17 March 2009 - 07:02 AM.

[Tropical Bob]

So. I tried throwing in <Special_Case_Production> tags for the first level Space Colony, just in case, as well as increasing AI Combat Power and Damage to ridiculous levels, whilst reducing Build Cost and Build Time to insignificant values.

I got nothing still.

The only other thing I can think of is that perhaps the EaW Star Base system doesn't like the "Variant of" system. Eventually I'm going to get around to trying that and renaming the Space Colonies back to the vanilla "(Faction)_Star_Base". But I'm kind of tested out right now from restarting PR like 50 times and waiting for 50 weeks to go by each time for the AI to take one planet...

[Phoenix Rising]

The only other thing I can think of is that perhaps the EaW Star Base system doesn't like the "Variant of" system. Eventually I'm going to get around to trying that and renaming the Space Colonies back to the vanilla "(Faction)_Star_Base". But I'm kind of tested out right now from restarting PR like 50 times and waiting for 50 weeks to go by each time for the AI to take one planet...

That's an interesting thought, but, as it is, it's only the EaW AI that doesn't seem to like them. In my experience, either EaW likes variants (ships) or it doesn't (hardpoints).

Still, it's probably worth a test - did anything come of it? I know the AI's annoying, but you can delete the Pirate starting forces on the Core or something and it should engage the free grab behavior of the AI, which is essentially no-brainer attack mode.