60 replies to this topic

[Kitkun]

Brentaal IV.
Now that I think about it, Tepasi was rather tough. Lots of slugthrowers and massdrivers it seems. (Or at least, as I remember.)
Empress Teta was harder than average, but not terribly tough. I did, however, use eight Venators IVs in the attack. Using only the TIE Fighters, I took down everything but the space colony. I had to send in the TIE Interceptors for that.
Kuat was surprisingly weak though. Perhaps 'neutral' ships can have a lower pop cost?

[Tropical Bob]

Kuat is pretty strong by GFFA Standards (well the legal planets anyway) - it tops out at about 18 ISD-I Equivalents, including the yards and Golans - for early GFFA era this is pretty bad, considering the ISD is barely a year old at this point! If you note Kuat has just completed construction of it's second Level 5 Production Yard, making it very heavily defended at this time.

As to upgrades, everything at Kuat is fresh off the production lines, including 4 Vic-II's - which are about as new as you can get at 18BBY.

The only thing missing is a possible dreadnaught class - perhaps a single Praetor-I, but I have made these very rare indeed at 18BBY. In fact in my GFFA universe, the Kuat Drive Yards have just delivered a Praetor-I to a very rich client in the Core, so Kuat just has it's normal ISD defences at this point.

Has anyone discovered the location of this ship at all....???? Think big, think very rich.

Doesn't Arkania have one as well? Or whatever planet it visually northeastish of Carida. Or do they have a Bulwark-class?

PS. What's the verdict on Tepasi and Empress Teta - I made them slighly different to normal?

I don't think I had too much trouble with them. In fact, I kind of agree with Ba Boracus. Once maybe two or three planets have been conquered, everything becomes a push-over in the Core Worlds. Like I had mentioned before, I took Kuat with two Venator-classes, some Acclamator-classes, and some Dreadnaught-classes. The only reason I really lost anything was because of a surprise hyperspace jump of a ton of ships in my fleet's blind spot.

Perhaps we could just up the Pirate Faction's space unit cap?

[Ghostrider]

Doesn't Arkania have one as well? Or whatever planet it visually northeastish of Carida. Or do they have a [i]Bulwark[/i]-class?

Yup. It's a salvaged Bulwark. There is one on one of the outer rim worlds as well.

How was Brentaal IV by the way? or Muunilinst? I tried to make both of these quite nasty.

[A1Dasdfsdkli4r2]

Has anyone discovered the location of this ship at all....???? Think big, think very rich.

PS. What's the verdict on Tepasi and Empress Teta - I made them slighly different to normal?

Ghost.

I remember scouting it and seeing that Preator, and thinking "that's the last planet I want to attack," but specificly, I don't remember. I had to wipe my computer recently, and I didn't save my saves. I think It was on Arkania. Tepasi wasn't a hard fight, but an interesting one.

Edited by Ba Boracus, 23 February 2009 - 06:57 PM.

[skie9173]

Personally the worst battle i had thus far was over Mandalore. I was playing the rebels, with essentially a starfighter fleet, with a few assault frigates, and a Quaser for support. More or less all of the fighters and the assault frigates were fully upgraded. Everything was going decent till i just saw half my fighters pop. Wasn’t watching close and one of the fire-ships slipped through and all but crippled me. Pulled out and came at them again with a rebuilt fleet, just took those fire ships out when i saw them and it wasn't bad. Moral of the story i guess is to always watch those transports lol

[Tropical Bob]

How was Brentaal IV by the way? or Muunilinst? I tried to make both of these quite nasty.

I'm still slowly making my way through the Core Worlds Campaign, and so haven't touched the Inner or Outer Rim Campaigns yet.

I'm currently working towards Brentaal IV. I took Tepasi, and am currently building more infrastructure and fleets before I attempt it. I have a feeling it's not going to be too hard in my current situation though. Tector IV- and Venator IV-classes sweep everything aside easily. The only impediment is building them. The Venators take forever. I'll let you know what happens when I do attack though.

[Phoenix Rising]

Wasn’t watching close and one of the fire-ships slipped through and all but crippled me.

Heh, glad to know they actually work as intended .

Tector IV- and Venator IV-classes sweep everything aside easily. The only impediment is building them. The Venators take forever.

That's one of the main reasons why complements have to be changed: it's impractical to use carriers.

[Tropical Bob]

A Praetor-class!? Perhaps it stands a chance?




Oh wait...Nevermind...




Can you say "OWN-SAUCED!"?




Nothing can hold off the adapted Imperial Creeping Barrage for long.

Tector IV- and Venator IV-classes sweep everything aside easily. The only impediment is building them. The Venators take forever.

That's one of the main reasons why complements have to be changed: it's impractical to use carriers.

Especially if the AI is made to upgrade and build Space Colonies and Star Bases, because then, though you may have swarms of fighters, they'll all be nothing compared to the more advanced enemy fighters. Plus, it'll take time for the swarm to fully gather as well.

[Ghostrider]

Ok. looks like I need to tweak the campaigns at some point.

I have probably been a bit too sparing with the Vics and Venators. ISD's are pretty new to GFFA, so there won't be too many more, but I can see the need for a bit more in the heavyweight department. And Kuat will get a Praetor of it's very own!
It's also clear from Tropical bob that Praetors need some decent anti-fighter support - say 3-4 Venators.....

I'm kinda busy now with Thrawn and Shadow Hands among other things, but when I get some spare time, I'll nudge the Core Worlds and other large planets with a few more ships. Basically I think I need a few more cruisers and capitals floating around somewhere.

The good news is that this won't add to the file size very much, as one more line of code will add a LOT of firepower!


Feedback much appreciated - please keep adding to this post - even if it's a small line - anytime you see anything interesting, let me know.

Are there any planets that you didn't like?

Ghost.

[Tropical Bob]

Ok. looks like I need to tweak the campaigns at some point.

I have probably been a bit too sparing with the Vics and Venators. ISD's are pretty new to GFFA, so there won't be too many more, but I can see the need for a bit more in the heavyweight department. And Kuat will get a Praetor of it's very own!
It's also clear from Tropical bob that Praetors need some decent anti-fighter support - say 3-4 Venators.....

I'm kinda busy now with Thrawn and Shadow Hands among other things, but when I get some spare time, I'll nudge the Core Worlds and other large planets with a few more ships. Basically I think I need a few more cruisers and capitals floating around somewhere.

The good news is that this won't add to the file size very much, as one more line of code will add a LOT of firepower!


Feedback much appreciated - please keep adding to this post - even if it's a small line - anytime you see anything interesting, let me know.

Are there any planets that you didn't like?

Ghost.

What I think is that the Pirates need a higher space unit cap. The Praetor-class wasn't even out when the battle began, and was the last ship the AI hyperspaced in. So I was able to clear out basically everything else, and surround the AI's hyperspace point, before the AI even brought the behemoth in.

You are definitely right about the Venator-class. I'm not sure about the popularity and use of the Victory-class as of 18BBY, but I know the Venator-class, and probably the Acclamator-class, should be rather abundant.

Maybe Kuat should get the Praetor II-class? It's logical that they would keep the best for themselves and sell the lesser ones off.

[Ghostrider]

What I think is that the Pirates need a higher space unit cap. The Praetor-class wasn't even out when the battle began, and was the last ship the AI hyperspaced in. So I was able to clear out basically everything else, and surround the AI's hyperspace point, before the AI even brought the behemoth in.

You are definitely right about the Venator-class. I'm not sure about the popularity and use of the Victory-class as of 18BBY, but I know the Venator-class, and probably the Acclamator-class, should be rather abundant.

Maybe Kuat should get the Praetor II-class? It's logical that they would keep the best for themselves and sell the lesser ones off.

I remember PR being slightly annoyed that the films didn't show a single Victory class - it was as popular as the Venator at the time. Praetor-II will have to be a 'no'. The Praetor-I has only just been developed. Kuat gets more ISD's though. The Lions' share of them.

[skie9173]

maybe its just my opinion but the pirate fleets in the mon cal area of GFFA (i'd assume outer rim is the same) all seem to be pretty strong. there was one or two planets there that were easy to take but i didn't really expand that area till much later in the game. please not this i not a complaint at all, i really kinda liked having just a few planets to build up specfic ways to counter the pirate fleets in the area.

[Phoenix Rising]

What I think is that the Pirates need a higher space unit cap.

I'm wary about doing that, since it kind of taints the consistency of the game. I mean, they're still pirates... you're supposed to grab their worlds. They just have a bit more than an IPV and some V-wings now.

Also, I should probably point out that the people who are going to respond on the boards are going to be among the best at PR. I think the average player is going to lose some ships at Brentaal IV. If you can take it without any losses, then you're really exploiting the gameplay to the fullest, which is kind of the point.

I remember PR being slightly annoyed that the films didn't show a single Victory class - it was as popular as the Venator at the time.

Yeah, the overabundance of Venators shown in the Battle of Coruscant does bother me. Whoever told the carriers to engage oversized frigates (ones that slaughter fighters no less) at point-blank range isn't a very good tactician. Where were the Victorys, on lunch break ?

[Ghostrider]

maybe its just my opinion but the pirate fleets in the mon cal area of GFFA (i'd assume outer rim is the same) all seem to be pretty strong. there was one or two planets there that were easy to take but i didn't really expand that area till much later in the game. please not this i not a complaint at all, i really kinda liked having just a few planets to build up specfic ways to counter the pirate fleets in the area.

It's all down to the planets. I populated all GFFA planets according to each planet's potential mineral wealth, general economy etc.
It so happens that the ones near Mon Calamari, eg. Jabiim, are heavily industrialised and moderately tough.

Note all outer rim planets are NOT the same. It's all down to resources. Muunilinst is damn scary, and probably the second or third richest planet in the galaxy. It ranks up there with Kuat, Brentaal IV and Nal Hutta for it's defenses! (or it will be when I have tweaked the campaign!)

Nespis VIII is a quick victory though (see script for the planet to find out why), then use Nespis as a Cruiser construction facility - then taken Onderon, and build up for Jabiim. I had to attack each of these last 2 at least twice, nibbling away at the defenses and retreating before I took losses, to do this. Then you should be ok. However, Columex is very nasty, and the planets nearer the Perlemian trade route are much stronger, so take care as you head west. Don't forget that Etti IV and Bonadan are massive CSA holdouts - so leave them alone for a while.

If a planet is on a trade route, it will be stronger than average due to the increased amount of resources available, and the extra credits allow you to buy bigger ships!

Mon Calamari is a tricky one in some ways - you have to choose between building up cruiser construction for the short term, or going for level 4 facilties, researching the Liberty and then getting big cruisers for the mid-game. This has a big knock on effect for the short term game though.
Personally, I take the short-term hit and go for level 4 research and construction, and use Nespis VIII for a spam cruiser facility.

I've just thought about that. Dumb idea actually. It takes 24 weeks from start to finish to upgrade to level 4, research a Liberty, and build one. You can build 14 Dreadnaughts in the time - more if you have a second level 3 yard. You would be better off building cruisers and frigates in the early game, and going for Capital research on the first conquered world that can support a level 4 yard and research facility!

Tip. Always build a second yard if you can, before you start building ships. A second yard cuts production time in half. Despite the delay, your are building quicker by week 4 regardless (assuming you have enough money)


Ghost.

Edited by Ghostrider, 26 February 2009 - 09:39 AM.

[Phoenix Rising]

Personally, I take the short-term hit and go for level 4 research and construction, and use Nespis VIII for a spam cruiser facility.

I've just thought about that. Dumb idea actually. It takes 24 weeks from start to finish to upgrade to level 4, research a Liberty, and build one. You can build 14 Dreadnaughts in the time - more if you have a second level 3 yard. You would be better off building cruisers and frigates in the early game, and going for Capital research on the first conquered world that can support a level 4 yard and research facility!

The problem with that is, thanks to the awesome impotence of EaW's interface, you can't sell off any star base after it's been constructed. Mon Calamari has some major discounts on ships - but only if you have the proper shipyards built (Levels 3, 4, and 5). I guess I'd hit frigates/cruisers early and hope there are enough free slots left for capitals later. On Outer Rim, I believe it is your only starting planet that can support anything bigger than a Level 2, so it's a real operational problem.

[Tropical Bob]

What I did in Core was to make Byss and Coruscant a little more rounded when it came to ship production, since they already started that way. So they have some Star Base 1s, 2s, and 3s. Coruscant has a 4 or two so I could research some capitals there and not sacrifice production at dedicated planets.

For my initial fleet composition, I went for some sizable Cruiser fleets, consisting of Acclamators and Dreadnaughts. Carida was the spearhead when it came to preparing and launching invasions, because of the diverse nature of Byss and Coruscant. I think Balmorra was my first target, which I converted to a dedicated Capital planet. From Byss, I took Kalist IV first to get a dedicated Freighter planet for better income, then moved towards Empress Teta and Kaikielius so I could begin connecting my separated planets. Then I moved south from Balmorra, eventually reaching Corellia, which then made my Empire "whole." Now I'm going from Byss to N'zoth, and driving along the hyperspace route from there to Coruscant (Whichever one it is), as well as beginning my campaign against the Perlemian Trade Route, since I now have several dedicated Capital planets, as well as one or two dreadnaught ones as well. I prefer to max out infrastructure before I do anything else at that planet.

With my current game, I found that if you dedicate to capitals as soon as you can, it may take a while, but it's a nice pay-off. You lose less ships than if you take in large numbers of Cruisers. Though the Core Worlds Campaign is a little spoiled when it comes to Capital ship production, since all the planets basically have the infrastructure to get Star Base 4s or 5s. That's the main reason that I like CW most: You don't start with tiny planets. I like my Capital Ships.

I'm wary about doing that, since it kind of taints the consistency of the game. I mean, they're still pirates... you're supposed to grab their worlds. They just have a bit more than an IPV and some V-wings now.

Eh. You're meant to grab their worlds, but it's obviously supposed to be a challenge to a certain degree. I just think that the Pirates getting all these large numbers of ships, and only being able to use a small number at a time, really defeats the purpose of the challenge. Like with Kuat: Had more Imperial-class Star Destroyers been in the battle at any time, I probably wouldn't have been able to take it so easily with a fleet of Acclamators and Dreadnaughts, with my two or three Venators.

And especially later in the game, you have all the advantages, since you have access to all the different levels of production, newly researched ships, upgraded ships, etc., while the Pirates are stuck with their early level ships, salvaged ships, and passenger liners. It becomes almost trivial to have them in the way. And since, at the moment, the AI doesn't build Space Colonies, so get shafted with only three or so production-capable planets, the Pirates are the only real detriment to Galactic domination.

Also, I should probably point out that the people who are going to respond on the boards are going to be among the best at PR. I think the average player is going to lose some ships at Brentaal IV. If you can take it without any losses, then you're really exploiting the gameplay to the fullest, which is kind of the point.

That is a good point about the player skill level. I never really thought about it that way.

Edited by Tropical Bob, 26 February 2009 - 11:57 PM.

[Phoenix Rising]

Eh. You're meant to grab their worlds, but it's obviously supposed to be a challenge to a certain degree. I just think that the Pirates getting all these large numbers of ships, and only being able to use a small number at a time, really defeats the purpose of the challenge.

The real problem is that the AI isn't reinforcing as soon as it takes losses, but it's waiting until it's almost been defeated to bring new ships in. I'll have to see if there's a way to change that.

[Ghostrider]

[attachment=22174:Campaign...uter_Rim.xml]Hiya all.

Here is a big thanks to all who have contributed to GFFA with their excellent comments in this thread - please find amended campaign files based on your comments.

They are MUCH harder, with increased starbases, and LOTS more capitals and destroyers, especially Vics and Venators, but with enough ISD's to keep you... worried. File sizes are about the same, so no worries there!

I will send these to PR for revised upload, but as he is away, that might take a week or so. I will make an announcement then with some more news.

Enjoy - and keep those comments coming!

Please re-load Slim and Core - trade routes exceptions removed!

Edited by Ghostrider, 03 March 2009 - 03:08 PM.

[coinich]

Eh. You're meant to grab their worlds, but it's obviously supposed to be a challenge to a certain degree. I just think that the Pirates getting all these large numbers of ships, and only being able to use a small number at a time, really defeats the purpose of the challenge.

The real problem is that the AI isn't reinforcing as soon as it takes losses, but it's waiting until it's almost been defeated to bring new ships in. I'll have to see if there's a way to change that.

Not always a horrible thing; I was attacking Metellos, methinks, and just when I thought I was mopping up the last of the resistance, 8 Acclamators and other ships hyperspaced in right in front of my already weakened fleet. I had to hightail it out just to keep my precious ships alive, which were taking half hours to produce.

Edited by coinich, 01 March 2009 - 07:06 PM.

[Tropical Bob]

Hiya all.

Here is a big thanks to all who have contributed to GFFA with their excellent comments in this thread - please find amended campaign files based on your comments.

They are MUCH harder, with increased starbases, and LOTS more capitals and destroyers, especially Vics and Venators, but with enough ISD's to keep you... worried. File sizes are about the same, so no worries there!

I will send these to PR for revised upload, but as he is away, that might take a week or so. I will make an announcement then with some more news.

Enjoy - and keep those comments coming!

Not sure if this was a bug for just my download, or with all of them:

Lines 578 and 3419 of the Outer Rim Campaign have incomplete ending tags. They are missing the s> out of </Starting_Forces>, causing a game crash.

Edited by Tropical Bob, 01 March 2009 - 05:56 PM.