81 replies to this topic

[muneyoshi]

I volenteer if you want help testing it

[smashedsaturn]

i think it would be best to have it powerful enough to destroy an unshielded isd in one volley, that would make more sense, would it be possible to implement ion cannons and turbolasters for both rebels and imperials as well full planetary shields, they could disable raids or something like that to make them useful

also, i think i posted about this a while back, did anyone ever make a script that would spawn a hero's ship after there upgraded so say vader's custom isd does not just disappear, but becomes just a normal isd

Edited by smashedsaturn, 19 February 2011 - 11:39 PM.

[DaveAshton]

I doubt it would be able to destroy an ISD in a single shot. That's superlaser kind of power. Zeta mentioned being able to destroy one in one volley. If that's canon, it may need to be balanced for gameplay a bit, be it by making it have a long recharge, expensive, or reducing the power to taking two or more volleys to take down an ISD.

The Empire did build planetary superlasers, they built one on Dubrillion. Whether they would have built them on a galactic scale if Rogue Squadron hadn't destroyed it is anyone's guess. It'd be an almost like-for-like replacement of the Hypervelocity gun: one-shot, massive damage, long reload time.

Edited by DaveAshton, 21 February 2011 - 03:55 AM.

[Ghostrider]

So PR, will the Planetary Turbolaser be able to destroy a star destroyer in a single shot?

Being able to destroy an ISD in orbit is very different from being able to do it in one shot. That's the sort of thing that would spark a massive improvement in shielding technology.

I doubt it would be able to destroy an ISD in a single shot. That's superlaser kind of power. Zeta117 mentioned being able to destroy one in one volley. If that's canon, it may need to be balanced for gameplay a bit, be it by making it have a long recharge, expensive, or reducing the power to taking two or more volleys to take down an ISD.

I just meant to ask how powerful it would be ingame.

Both the Planetary Ion Cannon and the Planetary Turbolaser Cannon are rated at 20,000 damage, and fire once every two minutes.

The Ion Cannon does shield damage, but I'm not sure if it has an energy damage/stun effect. This will put a major dent in the shields of Praetor-class Star Battlecruisers, Executor or Sovereign, and elimitate entirely the shields of any other Imperial-class Star Destroyer. These are found protecting key rebel installations.

The only heroes with a chance to survive the blast of a Planetary Turbolaser Cannon are Ackbar/Home One and Wedge Antilles/Lusyanka. Anything else in the gunsights is toast. However, this has double the cost and is considerably rarer than the Ion Cannon. Rebels in Operation Skyhook should be wary of planets with ground-based Death Star/Superlaser research facilities, and naturally there is one of these on Byss to make Operation Shadow Hand even nastier to complete.

[smashedsaturn]

this just makes it harder and harder to wait for 1.2

[Stormhawk]

This is the best thing I could have found coming back after a few days short of the actual release. We all really really appreciate all of your work on this mod.

Phoenix Rising and Ghostrider, we salute all your hard work and dedication and eagerly await the results!

[implicid]

A question shot into my brain earlier today and made me very curious. In relation to the changes to the AI made, is it now possible to make different AI controlled forces perform different behaviors on the same galactic map?

Two examples that stand out in my head are as follows:

The Alderann forces in the skyhook map that consist of ion weapons.
(Is it possible to make that fleet stay in orbit over the planet than have them float around? They are just a defense force after all.)

Outlaw and illegals.
(Is it possible to make them be stand alone forces where they won't intermingle with others? Say they would only seek you out to plunder if you had a system next to theirs?)
These sorts of things that might be more sensible for who or what they represent.

Just curious if the new AI makes any of that plausible.

Edited by implicid, 22 February 2011 - 09:43 PM.

[Aizen Teppa]

The only heroes with a chance to survive the blast of a Planetary Turbolaser Cannon are Ackbar/Home One and Wedge Antilles/Lusyanka. Anything else in the gunsights is toast. However, this has double the cost and is considerably rarer than the Ion Cannon. Rebels in Operation Skyhook should be wary of planets with ground-based Death Star/Superlaser research facilities, and naturally there is one of these on Byss to make Operation Shadow Hand even nastier to complete.

Thrawn Campaign was my favorite in 1.1. But it looks like things are about to change. :<insert here uncontrollable drolling at OSH>:

[Ghostrider]

A question shot into my brain earlier today and made me very curious. In relation to the changes to the AI made, is it now possible to make different AI controlled forces perform different behaviors on the same galactic map?

Two examples that stand out in my head are as follows:

The Alderann forces in the skyhook map that consist of ion weapons.
(Is it possible to make that fleet stay in orbit over the planet than have them float around? They are just a defense force after all.)

Outlaw and illegals.
(Is it possible to make them be stand alone forces where they won't intermingle with others? Say they would only seek you out to plunder if you had a system next to theirs?)
These sorts of things that might be more sensible for who or what they represent.

Just curious if the new AI makes any of that plausible.

I suspect this is a little over precise. While the Ai knows the difference between a fighter and a bomber (see BEHAVIOUR tags in the XML's), i'm fiarly sure you can't get it to assign different behaviour to particular units.
The only thing you could do is change the guard and chase ranges for indivudual units, as this affects the level of 'unit agression' i.e. at what distance does an enemy have to be from said unit to get it to react.

Best thing to do is try and see. We havn't done it.

Edited by Ghostrider, 23 February 2011 - 08:06 AM.

[Phoenix Rising]

So, the HVs-2 Hypervelocity Gun and the m-68 Planetary Magnapulse Cannon are gone? The w-165 Planetary Turbolaser seems like a great idea, but what is the reasoning behind losing the others? Can they be researched, because they don't seem to be very common, might be a good way to keep them around.

The hypervelocity gun seems like esoteric technology. I never liked how it balanced with it being able to blow out hulls in one shot while the ion cannon does no physical damage. Planetary turbolasers can still one-shot kill destroyers and maybe capitals (depending on how many bonuses you have to damage), but there's a better chance of defending against them, especially with Mon Calamari shields.

The magnepulse cannon is gone only because I didn't want to have two buildings with the same model. There's no tech tree planned for structures as of yet; if we do add one, it's almost certainly going to require someone able to produce some new structure models for us because there just isn't enough variety to do it now. For the foreseeable future, active structures will remain unlocked.

Question: What will the differentiation be between difficulty levels, if any?

There are some subtle differences built into the AI code; for example, the AI will be more aggressive and responsive in Galactic the higher the difficulty. As far as infrastructure goes, there are no differences - other than the global difficulty adjustments that we've always had. I figure it's best to prove that it works for this release and worry about that later; however, if there is a demand for it, I could turn off the advantage-consideration block for the Easy AI.

The Ion Cannon does shield damage, but I'm not sure if it has an energy damage/stun effect.

30-second ion stun.

A question shot into my brain earlier today and made me very curious. In relation to the changes to the AI made, is it now possible to make different AI controlled forces perform different behaviors on the same galactic map?

To some extent, yes, although it would require a lot of special cases. You could eliminate the non-lethal units from attack plans, but I don't think you could prevent the free store from shifting them around to other planets (maybe there's a way to do it with story scripting). At this point, I'm more concerned about general than specific behaviors.

Outlaw and illegals.
(Is it possible to make them be stand alone forces where they won't intermingle with others? Say they would only seek you out to plunder if you had a system next to theirs?)
These sorts of things that might be more sensible for who or what they represent.

It would be interesting to give them a separate faction with Galactic AI, like the Pirates in SoaSE. And I think it makes good design sense to separate outlaws from planetary defense. Aside from space forces (which would still have to be converted), you're talking about setting up a whole new faction though... and if we're going to do that, there are probably a couple of alternatives that would be more prudent.

[CaptainMazerolle]

Wow! This sounds fantastic! I can't wait for v1.2

[Fox83]

Is it really necessary to have objects on space maps? I mostly find nebulas & asteroids annoing since they tend to imobilize SSDs. I rather have big obstacle free maps were even SSD can move around.

[implicid]

Is it really necessary to have objects on space maps? I mostly find nebulas & asteroids annoing since they tend to imobilize SSDs. I rather have big obstacle free maps were even SSD can move around.

I think they can enhance as well as deter gameplay. I would assume that PR and his team are trying to make the space maps accurate for the orbit or niche of space they represent. It's good in that it adds to the strategy for certain maps. However, I believe that caution is needed when doing so.

[Phoenix Rising]

Is it really necessary to have objects on space maps?

It's probably more interesting with terrain, although the maps all need to be redone.

[Stormhawk]

Question about the AI. How will it handle land forces? In 1.1 I occasionally find land forces just floating in space above a planet alone, move n a cruiser with an interdictor and just get a bunch of free kills.

[Phoenix Rising]

Yeah, that's probably going to be inevitable as the AI stages an attack. Some forces are pulled from reserves, while others are built/trained... I'm not precisely sure how it decides which to do, but the force totals are based on its intelligence of the planet it's attempting to take. If it can do it with 10 platoons, fine. Anything moderately defended is likely going to require more. Probably the best I can do in the future is to have it put some ships in-system to protect the army convoy.

Actually, that's curious that there weren't any starships present (unless the fleet had already made its move); only a raid would not need ships. It's likely that the AI was doing "blind" production for a future invasion. If that's the case, it's probably because the alternative offensive options were not working in some way (again, the functionality of the v1.1 AI is suspect). I haven't seen it happen yet in this version, so hopefully it's not an issue. Come to think of it, I don't remember it leaving any frontline planet undefended. If we leave something open with starting forces, it likes to reinforce from nearby strongholds.

[Kitkun]

Yeah, after upgrading to a dualboot Win7 in which FoC became corrupted and lost my bookmarks, I kinda forgot all about PR. Then with the old lag and AI, I just couldn't justify getting back into it. Hoping this helps a lot.

Also, when are you making the next X-Wing game?
Seriously though, I'd love to see what you'd do to that series...

Edited by Kitkun, 09 March 2011 - 11:46 PM.

[Phoenix Rising]

Also, when are you making the next X-Wing game?
Seriously though, I'd love to see what you'd do to that series...

Oh, I have some ideas. For starters, I'd lobby for a 25 ABY setting .

[Henry X]

Well that would lead to some awesome stalling maneuvers wouldn't it? Slow the invasion down by destroying the land forces over their starting point.

[Tropical Bob]

Also, when are you making the next X-Wing game?
Seriously though, I'd love to see what you'd do to that series...

Oh, I have some ideas. For starters, I'd lobby for a 25 ABY setting .

Yeahhhhhhhh. Fightin' dem Vong.

I still want a game or movie based around that era. Damn you LucasArts!