15 replies to this topic

[Nargun]

Hello there, I'm Nargun and I'm new around here. This is my first post, but I've been checking out this forum for a while now, and I've even agreed to help someone with a project in the future. But I wanted to share the concept I have for my own project that I'll be doing when I have enough experience. I'm not asking for help in any way, I simply want opinions, critisism, to see what you guys think.

 

My plan is to make a total conversion mod that brings the world of The Elder Scrolls into BFME 2 and/or ROTWK. There will be ten factions, representing the ten races of Tamriel. There will also be ways to recruit the aid of other things, such as Daedra, Dwemer, the Tiger Dragons of Akavir, and so on.

 

I've been working on the unit, structure, spell and upgrade trees of a few of the races so far, for example,

 

 The Orsimer are a low structurally defensive faction but can defend themselves with their units, and they have access to some of the best upgrades of all, being master craftsmen. They have the aid of some other beastly races such as trolls and goblins. They must also make a choice mid-late game to follow the Aedric god Trinimac or his corrupt Daedric form, Malacath, which will affect how their endgame plays out.. Through destruction or redemption.

 

Buildings: Orc Stronghold(Fortress), Beast Warrens(Barracks), Longhouse(Elite Barracks), Oricalcum Forge(Upgrades), Oricalcum Mine(Resource), Shamanic Shrine(Support Barracks)

 

Units: Goblin Pack(Spearmen), Goblin Spearthrowers(Archer), Mountain Troll(Seige), Orc Axethrowers(Elite Archer), Orc Berserkers(Elite Infantry), Goblin Shaman(Support), Aedric Priest(Support) -OR- Daedric Cultist(Support)

 

 

I realise some of the features I have planned might not be plausible in the game's engine, but that's something I need to discover and change if need be. Anyways, I hope you liked this crazy concept I've shown you, let me know what you think.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

I'll be honest, this sounds pretty cool, if you can pull it off. Also, I'm glad to see you're willing to learn the trade to do it

 

There are two problems I have with it, however, the first being that ten factions is a lot. Too much, in fact. Do two of the most prominent first, then see if you can do any more, because this stuff takes a lot of time and effort. The second is that... since when did TES Orcs and Trolls/Goblins ever fight on the same side?

[Nargun]

I'll keep in mind the thing about the amount of factions, thanks. I had considered combining races into a smaller number of factions but too many of them just hate eachother or have geographical restrictions.

 

As for the orcs getting goblins and trolls, there are a few reasons. One issue that reaches across all the factions is that, it's difficult to design enough units for the singular races in TES, I mean, the only example of cavalry I found at all were Khajiits riding Battlecats (Which is bloody epic). Also, while researching about the orcs, I found something (Can't remember where/what it was now) that stated the capitol city of the Orcs was also full of other beastfolk. And even if the orcs and other beastfolk didn't live together, I can't see why the orcs couldn't whip up some goblin slave forces for war times.

[Lauri]

The reason you have difficulty finding enough units for every single faction is because you restrict yourself to creating one faction for each race. You'll have to compromise, and team up a lot of the factions. I'm certainly no expert on the lore, so I can't really be of help there. However, I think your best bet could be to have three factions, where you simply make the factions from Elder Scrolls Online:

Daggerfall Covenant - Breton, Redguard, Orsimer.

Ebonheart Pact - Nord, Dumner, Argonian.

Aldmeri Dominion - Altmer, Bosmer, Khajiit.

 

Imperials aren't a part of any of them, so you're free to do as you wish with them. By doing it this way, you'll avoid a major problem I think you'll encounter with 10 factions: Copy-paste syndrome. While you can make some factions uniqe, with the Altmer having a magical approach, while Redguards are warriors, I don't see how you're going to make Redguards and the Orcs really unique factions. I mean, you have 7 units for the Orsimer faction, but only 2 of the units are actually orcs. 3 of them are goblins, which I don't see happening, and there's also a troll, which I also don't see happening. So instead, I would suggest you use the Orcs you have, but replace the other units with Breton and Redguard units. Bretons have magical powers, so they could be both offensive capabilities and support. The Redguards are, however, very similar to Orcs in that they are great warriors. So you'll have to see what works best.

 

Or you could mix races in your own custom history, to make the best possible factions. Whatever you do, don't do too many factions.

[Nargun]

I did think about combining the races into 3 or 4 factions for a long time, it was actually my initial plan. The problem is that, it just doesn't feel right, whichever way I did it. The Elder Scrolls Online Factions are just wrong, the only races out of that which work are High and Wood Elves working together. Bretons, Redguards, and Orcs have a high dislike for eachother. Nords and Dark Elves are the same, and Argonians despise Dark Elves.

 

I have made a list of combined factions, but as I did more research, it was obvious that it would not work. For example I had Argonians and Khajiits together as a sort of Slave Rebellion against the Dunmer (Who had a faction all to themselves because many of their units were slaves/monsters), But the two beast races actually despise eachother, although it is little mentioned.

 

I am not arguing with you on the point that 10 is too many factions. It's pretty massive for this game. But unless I forgo all historical, geographical, and cultural reasoning and make an arcade type mod which just mashes certain races, then 10 factions is my option.

 

As a side note, there are actually three orc units. The Priest and Cultist are orcs, but you can only choose one. And I believe Isengard's faction in the base game has only 4 Uruk-Hai units? (Swordmen, Pikemen, Crossbowmen, and Berserker guy)

Edited by Nargun, 21 June 2014 - 10:26 PM.

[Lauri]

There is an Orc race in Tamriel. There is not an Isengardian race in Middle-Earth. Saruman used Uruk-hai, orcs, and men of Dunland in his armies. Sauron had Uruk-hai, orcs, trolls, and men in his armies, maybe more. My point is that your making ten race-specific factions, which isn't really comparable to vanilla BFME factions. Even Elves have different kinds of elves in the faction, working together.

 

The Elder Scrolls Online is now a part of the lore, so I don't see why you discard it. The best way to go about it is to create your own story. A Deadric lord has manipulated three factions to join forces, and the other factions have to work together to fight back the invaders, however they are split into two blocks aswell. Or, you know, be creative.

 

It is, however, your mod. Do as you wish. I would strongly advise you to work on no more than two factions at a time though, to reduce the workload. Preferably one, actually.

[Nargun]

Sorry for the Isengard thing, I had just woken up with a cold when I posted that so I had forgotten the Dunlanders, Orcs, etc.

 

Anyways, I'll try to be more open minded about the factions. Perhaps I'll use the combined factions I had planned previously. We'll see.

 

Thanks for your insight.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

The Elder Scrolls Online Factions are just wrong

 

 

Hahahaha!

It might not be something you agree with, but it's their lore. They do what they want, and they can't exactly be wrong

[Pasidon]

I wanna see Daedra Vs. Bears.  Those are the only two factions you need.  You can even make M'aiq the Liar a hero for the bears.  

[Mathijs]

I like your thinking and open-mindedness Nargun. Just be sure to understand the workload you're facing here. As Lauri suggests, I would pick one faction and work on that. And even then, 10 factions will, in the end, be the end of your project. It's too much.

 

You could also divide them Skyrim-style. Imperials, Stormcloaks, and Thalmor. Or perhaps Fighters Guild vs Mages Guild vs Thieves Guild vs Dark Brotherhood

[Pasidon]

The guilds should be like the faction buildings you can capture that give you unique unit build types.  Like the inns that allow you to make rangers and hobbits.

[Mathijs]

That's a really cool idea.

[Nargun]

The guilds should be like the faction buildings you can capture that give you unique unit build types.  Like the inns that allow you to make rangers and hobbits.

That was my plan, actually. Having Guilds instead of Inns, and also Daedric Summoning Circles and something that allowed you to recruit Akaviri races (The Vampire Snakes, Tiger Dragons, Snow Demons, and Monkey People)

 

But I've been thinking, it would be very cool if I combined the races of Tamriel into a small number of factions, then had one or two Factions that were Invading Tamriel, like another Akaviri Invasion

[Pasidon]

What would be amazing is allowing customization rather than choosing factions.  I like an RTS with customizable components that are balanced and diverse.  You don't even need to worry about factions if players can make their own with amazing options.  You give them a sandbox of races, divines, magics, armor types, class types, heroes... and they can all synergise in really cool / diverse ways.  Like you can pick to have your faction comprised of Argonians and Nords, and both have natural affinities with different components you can choose from, like armor weights or weapon types.  And weapons / spells and armors can be upgraded in-game.  Like if you choose your Argonian Conjurers to have heavy armor, in game, you can spend septums to buy orcish, dwenmer, ebony, and/or daedric upgrades.  But in a way that doesn't drown the game session with upgrade options.  This suggestion is attempting to craft an amazing BFME style RTS, but also staying true to the level of freedom in an Elder Scrolls game.

[Nargun]

I think I drooled a bit as I read that. I think there is a game which does something to what I think you mean, called Elemental: Fallen Enchantress. http://www.elemental.../UnitDesign.png

 

Is something like that even possible in this game though?

[Zeta1127]

Ah, Elemental and the awesomeness that is Stardock. I haven't ever played Elemental, but I have the utmost respect for Stardock thanks to Sins of a Solar Empire (with Ironclad Games) and the Galactic Civilizations series.

 

A thought just occurred to me, in order to pull off The Elder Scrolls style customization, something like the Isengard Focus upgrades that are a part of the Saruman of Many Colours spell book power from The Dwarf Holds mod and/or the choice of third spell for Angmar Sorcerers from RotWK would probably be necessary.

Edited by Zeta1127, 24 June 2014 - 01:26 AM.