43 replies to this topic

[Az3r^]

maybe Ash but to be fair the tornado is an awesome plane.

ive noticed the Eurofighter hasnt been mentioned yet, how about that for anti-building or anti-tank ?

[wilmet]

If it's set 2010-2015 sorta time...Britain probably wouldn't be using units as outdated as the Tornado and Nimrod (which is an ASW or recon plane, not really a bomber). They'd prolly use something the Yanks gave them, or perhaps the French Mirage-2000s.

Bearing in mind also that the F-35 is a carrier-based craft...I have to concur that the F-117 is perhaps a more suitable alternative. The Raptor and the F-35 look really similar, too.

most of the RAF's tornadoes were upgraded to GR4 level between 1998 and 2002 I believe, and are set to last until the 2020s.

some nimrods are also being upgraded with revised airframes and better electronics etc (project is on hold for some testing though). there is also talk of some being converted to bombers capable of launching cruise missiles among other things.

about the F-35, there are 3 models in planning with some visual differences between them, perhaps mig can play on that? I agree that it is very similar looking though

ive noticed the Eurofighter hasnt been mentioned yet, how about that for anti-building or anti-tank ?

it's called EF-2000 in mig's list, it's also refered to as typhoon in the RAF and for exports.

[Mig Eater]

Does anyone have any info on a new RAF stealth plane project called "Replica", I only have a photo of a large scale wind tunnel model that I found on a forum ages ago... not even sure if it's real TBH :/

[DAA]

Mig Eater for the chinese bomber you could give them the license built tu-95/142 or H-6(license built tu-16)

Edited by DAA, 03 April 2006 - 01:34 AM.

[wilmet]

corax

Replica

you've probably seen this already and there's not much to go with, but anyhoo....

[Rawlo]

just something for you all to keep in mind, alot of you keep saying that the older plains are out dated etc and aren't really capable of being front line fighters, I'll point this out to you, almost all of fighters being designed today are made to be able to carry out a mission completely annialating entire bases with only a small escort or even none in one attack, with no ground support at all. Almost all of them also move so fast that by the time you notice it it's gone and completely aced you base, without a chance to retaliate which will almost definately result in aircraft spamming by most players.

The idea with aircraft in RA2 and YR was that the be support units only, and the game was hard coded that way. they can only fly in hit a target and leave without micro management. I'm sure the idea of these mods isn't to ave 3 units that are used exlusively, and can ace a base in one strike without any danger atall of being shot down. I personally think that the aircraft list should be more focassed on adding the stars of the various airforces, sure the A-10 was slow, but hell it looked good as it flew over you enemies tank rush and wasted half and severly dameged the rest. The B-52 was another classic, man they look awsome as the glide as gracefully as two tomcats fighting on a tin shed, blowing the fuck out of an unwary base, severerly damaging everything. truth be told I'm not sure what you should use for an anti building but it should be something slow loud and ugly for the single purpose that it suites the way the game works, it looks cooler, and it gives the enemy the chance to strike back, all very important parts of an RTS.

Another thing is that despite the fact that countries are almost always making new things to blow each other up, they almost never have the money to build these things in bulk and so are constantly using older revamped planes, if your going to be making a mod on realism as Mig is known for, then please don't tell me that in the next 5-10 years all of the worlds finanshial difficulties are going to go, "well we've had a good time staying here but it's time to leave now, seeya"

In short newest and greatest isn't always the best.

plus, I wanna play as the americans and watch as a strike of three A-10s blows the fuck out of a tank cluster and then move in and clear it out with my M1A2s

[Ash]

http://en.wikipedia....:Baereplica.jpg

Saw this shot on the wiki. The RAF plans to replace the GR4 anyway as part of its Future Offensive Air System by around 2017, when it was supposed to be in full operation. The Typhoon and F-35 are both part of the plan, but they're gonna use the F-35A (the Carrier-based version).

Granted, our wonderful government decided to scrap the project...why not make it so it wasn't? The Replica and the Typhoon would be excellent choices. And I suppose the Nimrod could be let go, despite the fact it's a thirty-year-old design rehashed...

Edited by Paradox, 03 April 2006 - 10:06 AM.

[Rawlo]

oh forgot to mention, another thing is that if your going to have almost any of the planes mentioned they're going to have to be non player controlable airstrikes cause so far the only one thats a vtol is the harrier afair

and also there is no such thing as a feild air feild capable of supporting a squad of fighter craft.

the only aircraft controlable to players should be hellicopters and you should probebly figure out how to get them to come in from of the map if you can reactivate that logic from TS

[Ash]

The bombers aren't player controllable. Also, planes have multiple rockets...and they'd only get to use them all on a single target if it was done your way...

The idea's to have a war, not be encumbered by the fact that a country can't produce it because it *might not* be able to afford it. Otherwise, why would mig've made that thousand-tonne tank in D-Day?

There's no way the damage is gonna be realistic...that would make it completely BORING, so the air units won't be able to rape everything...and I would hope the tanks don't either. Yay, i can't even take one hit...what's the point?

[Mig Eater]

CR isn’t some ultra realism mod Rawlo, if you want that go play True War...

The Replica is a few years outside CR’s time frame so I think it’s best to stick with the Tornado.

You know it’s strange that in this thread we are discussing highly advanced weapon systems but in the one about Russian MBT’s the advanced stuff has been given a no go & I’ve been told to use current equipment

[Rawlo]

I know, if it were ultra realism, you could forget about the tanks because every plane in the arsenal completely smoke just about any production tank that we're going to make for the next couple of years, AAA, all those modern planes can fly way over there range, misiles again range, everything a vehicle can fire can be aced by speed or range. so yer I understand it's not realistic.

Admittedly the realism aspect isn't my main problem, my main problem is that shit loads of mods use these fighter and things because they're the newest thing out, they look ugly in game, they look ugly in real life, they almost never have any unique ness to them, because they're all designed along the same lines, there's no such thing as heavy bombers now because a single F111 ardvarc with a weazel for an escort (bomber and anti AA escort) with a medium sized nuke cruise misile can sneek into a country almost no matter what the security, go for a target, and destroy far more then a heavy bomber could do with conventional weapons

and so if we don't have any of these things because they're old, we're going to end up with a whole heep of planes that look almsot exactly the same, the only ones that had any real character were the older ones because they didn't have the tech to to make what they do now. In real life character doesn't matter half as much as keeping the crew alive, but this isn't real life, a mods/games success is based more on how cool a unit is then how modern it looks, if you don't beleive me look at the americans in cnc generals, they kick-ass but thats about it, they look about as warlike as an unpainted farrari. (with the possible exeption of the tanks, the tanks were cool )

I know I'm rambling but you gotta see my point, planes all look the same these days because they just change the mold (metaphorically speeking) a little to suit the purpose of the craft, different countries start with different molds but they're all looking for the same thing, and it's not what a gamers looking for. I rest my case, well. not really, but again you get the idea

again sorry for the essay

[Mig Eater]

Yes I do see your point but I’m making a near future war game so it’s going to have near future units not Cold War stuff...

[Ash]

The planes don't look 'exactly the same'. The F-22 and the F-35 DO look very similar, and so might indeed be hard to tell apart ingame. But there are lots of tanks I could say that for.

It's no surprise that variants look the same. After all, they're variants. But planes are very distinctive.

As for their effectiveness vs tanks...as Mig said, it's not gonna be an uber-realism mod. We KNOW planes rape everything in real life, a fact you went into detail to me about on MSN, but I already knew
Expensiveness, not-being-as-powerful-as-real-life, slow reloading times and paper armour will prevent the air-rushing.

I do hope that TR's mods don't fall into the one-hit-kill trap. I expect they won't, but what the hickey.

[DAA]

Mig I dont agree with the fact that you chose the tu-22m as a bomber for the chinese.

1. There are currently 0 TU-22MS in the inventory
2. Here is a fas.org/nuke article on it :

In mid-1993, China approached Russia concerning the sale of a number of Tu-22M Backfire strike aircraft to replace its aging H-6 Badger bomber fleet. No other weapon system has caused as much concern as did China's efforts to obtain the long-range Tu-22M Backfire bomber. With a a dual use unrefueled range of 4000km, this purchase alone would have substantially upgraded Chinese air coverage of the area around Taiwan or the South China Sea. Though spare parts would become a problem, the mere possession of this system, let alone any production capability, would have constituted a substantial upgrade to the Chinese Air Force.
However, reports that China actually purchase four of the 4 Tu-22M [Tu-26] long-range BACKFIRE bombers proved unfounded. The deal apparently foundered due to Russian concerns that the sale of such an advanced aircraft would alter the military balance in the area. Following Russia's rejection to sell any Tu-22M BACKFIRE bombers to China, it remains to be seen whether and how the PLAAF will replace its obsolescent strategic bomber force.

This is a good link that shows the inventory of the chinese airforce:

http://fas.org/nuke/...raft/index.html


and from this link we can see that the h-6 is the most common aircraft in the chinese airforce inventory.

[Mig Eater]

Cos the Tu-16/H-6 is shit & I think they deserve something better. A lot can happen in 10 years & it wouldn’t surprise me if China gets the Tu-22m in the future.

[DAA]

Mig what version of the tu-22m are you planning to implement for the PLAA

[Allied General]

Mig what version of the tu-22m are you planning to implement for the PLAA

Dude this is why you Mig Eater, u ask these tiny, really minor, nit-picking questions it would also help if you read other peoples posts.

http://www.sinodefen...dattack/h61.asp

The chinese already have an Tu-16 under the codename H-6

Personally I would like China to use the Tu22m which Russia was planning to sell to them as seen in this article

http://www.sinodefen...ndattack/hx.asp

pic of Tu22m

http://aeroweb.lucia...mbers/tu22m.htm

No need to post the same sh*t again, I think Mig Eater already know.

In an mod where terrorists have offically assigned themselves into an global network of terror and since its set in the future anything is possible.

Look at Lord of War.

Perhaps the russian enconomy suffered another cold war afterwards downturn and russia just sells so it can gain money and because the UN doesn't have as much influence, etc, etc.

Finally FAS is out of date, look at Chinese Defence Today (its in one of my links) here is there quote

However, since late 2004 there has been some major shift in the Russian government’s policy towards the sale of bomber aircraft to China. On 13 January 2005, the chief of the Russian Air Force, Vladimir Mikhailov, said that the Russian military could sell a number of Tu-22M3 and Tu-95 bomber aircraft to China. He confirmed that Russia would send Tu-22M3 to take part in the joint China-Russia military exercise in 2005, and Russia’s clear intention to sell the aircraft to China. It is not known if China is still interested in buying this aircraft.

Political upheaval equals anything possible.

Edited by Allied General, 08 April 2006 - 09:27 PM.

[LEGO]

i'll be suprised if China got tu22m, so far as i know all news of "China's Tu22m" are rumors.
Su30mkk can do the job good enough.
and you can search for "jh-7" or "fbc-1", a tornado-class fighter-bomber/light bomber, which is the real succesor of H-6.
dont worry about balance, if Russia call in a tu22m, China just call in 2 jh7s, it's still balanced, and more features.

and it will be unflexible if you just set Anti-tank/ship,anti-building, heavy bomber for every side, you can have more rolls and mix them.
like this:
su39 AT/AP(anti-personal/light armor)
su34 AS/AB/WildWesel
tu22m AS/AB
Su17/22 AP/AB
H-6 AB (eliet H-6 AS/AB cos upgraded with C-802 ASM)
F117 AB
A10 AT/AP
F15E AT/AS/AB/WW
....
then you can have a hell lot of choices...

this will bring some new strenth and weakness, ect: France can easily got a AS power as their light attacker Super Etendard is a AS/AP, and Russia can only have a decent AS power after obtain a costy Su34 or Tu22m

BTW, i'm a Chinese, so i guess i know the PLA better than most others here
here is a JH7 vxl i'd like to share

Attached Files

•  jh7n.vxl   52.63KB   22 downloads

[Spikey00]

O_o as long as the majority of the people get what they want.. thats fine with me xD