130 replies to this topic

[KebaxKapak]

1)

<<Yes, but we are talking only one brother here (brother Kekoulis), and he is REALLY preoccupied with the tons of stuff already in cue...

So the short answer is "we work with what we have" for now, regarding 3D. But WE HAVE MUCH ALREADY!>>

 

Yeah I can believe that, I just asked to know how the team is working

2)
Ok I get that

3)
Thank you for all those informations, it's really intresting and little by little I understand how the whole thing is working, it's really cool

 

4)

Ok, so I will wait to level up before creating new armor types ^^

5)
Yes the game is installed in the C:\program files (x86)\THQ\Dawn of war - Soulstorm

I tried to run the config file as administrator and here is what I got :

--------------------------------------------------------

 Dawn of War: Unification - New Races Mod Detection v4.6

 Based on code created by Evil Isador at www.moddb.com

 --------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 CHECKING FOR REQUIRED MODS:

 

 ++ERROR++ Required mod not found - Unification Bugfix.

 

 ++ERROR++ Required mod not found - FreeUI.

 

 ++ERROR++ Required mod not found - Objective Points.

 

 ++ERROR++ Required mod not found - Chaos Daemons.

 

 ++ERROR++ Required mod not found - Inquisition Daemonhunters.

 

 

 CHECKING FOR OPTIONAL MODS:

 

 No optional Race Mods found.

 

 

 SUMMARY:

 

 ++ERROR++ 5 required Mods were NOT found! (see above)

 All required Mods must be installed correctly before running Unification - New Races.

 

 0 optional Race Mods found.

 

 Press any key to continue...

 

 

 

 

I don't understand because all those mods are in the same folder (THQ\Dawn of war - Soulstorm)


6) Just a question, I know you're working as hard as possible, this is not an invitation to work harder, but, when do you expect the mod to be released ? If you have any idea or estimation.


Thank you again for taking the time to help me entering the modding world and understanding the matrix, or at least, the corsix ^^
I'm really glad that I've found some nice people, or that some nice people found me

[Moreartillery]

I do not recommend making new armor types, its a ton of work for little gain.

 

When you make a new armor type you have to add it to every weapon and damage causing ability, and add it to the unitstats.ai file of every unit for every race! Not to mention that it makes balancing harder.

 

A much easier way is to change the displayed name of one of the existing armor types, that way you don't need to change everything else. For example my mod changed tp_vehicle_low to say 'light vehicle' ingame, and my mod only really has four armor types, Infantry, Heavy Infantry, Light Vehicle, and Vehicle/Building. Since all tanks in my mod have the same armor type its much easier to compare how effective they are. Also remember that certain ability's can only be cast on specific armor types. If you made a 'Daemon Engine' armor type, marines wouldn't be able to use their melta bombs on it!

 

I recommend using as few armor types as possible, and using hit points to differentiate units. Players can see how many hitpoints a unit has but the effect of armor is hidden from them.

Edited by Moreartillery, 12 July 2020 - 02:28 PM.

[Gambit]

I do not recommend making new armor types, its a ton of work for little gain.

Exactly. By the way brother Moreartillery, the ONLY addition I would make is to differentiate the monster from the daemon type.

Now, we have both, described by monster_med and monster_high.

But what about Tyranids? Or the Squiggoth? Or the Kroots?

Alien Hunters also impact the most, because the hunt Monsters not Daemons.

But hey, it's OK.

When you make a new armor type you have to add it to every weapon and damage causing ability, and add it to the unitstats.ai file of every unit for every race! Not to mention that it makes balancing harder.

Do not forget abilities, special attacks and also actually UPDATE the AI to include those types! (the CORE coding is the easy part - I would HATE updating the stats of ALL weapons of ALL races on the other had!)

 

 

 

 

Yes the game is installed in the C:\program files (x86)\THQ\Dawn of war - Soulstorm

Then you HAVE to manually modify the Unification New Races .module file, as I told you.

Just look therein for instructions.

As for me, I NEVER install games in a System folder!! Only apps.

Games come and go and I need full unrestricted access....

 

6) Just a question, I know you're working as hard as possible, this is not an invitation to work harder, but, when do you expect the mod to be released ? If you have any idea or estimation.

More than a month, less than two, I guess...

Listen, if you STILL have issues, just PM me and I will end you everything you need

My current Beta is better than that awful public release!!

The problem is that my version is compatible with the LATEST version of mods.

And I have 7+ updated releases to make the next month! (Sal/WH/IDH/DA/CD/IF)

[KebaxKapak]

 

 

A much easier way is to change the displayed name of one of the existing armor types, that way you don't need to change everything else. For example my mod changed tp_vehicle_low to say 'light vehicle' ingame, and my mod only really has four armor types, Infantry, Heavy Infantry, Light Vehicle, and Vehicle/Building. Since all tanks in my mod have the same armor type its much easier to compare how effective they are.

 

Yeah that's smart, I personnaly i would have like to detail a bit more and I though about making really one armor type for each "real" fluff armor type (like a ""Ernergetic armor"" armor type, a ""Terminator armor'', a ""Tau Exo-armor"" etc"" ) but I understood by your answer and Gambit's one that this is really a huge task, not that much complex but a long list of files to relate and adapt to this new amor type.
I think I'm going to adopt the same strategy as yours for the moment, more basic but more efficient, because there is already tons of thing to do.

 

 

 

I recommend using as few armor types as possible, and using hit points to differentiate units. Players can see how many hitpoints a unit has but the effect of armor is hidden from them.

Well I like the idea of a game that is a bit more obscure and requires more experimentations to be mastered. But you showed me it's a big task and I tink i'm going to follow your method of light armor/heavy armor and light vehicle/heavy vehicle and buildings, I think it's a good idea

I'll think about my "multiple amor type plan" when I would have done all the rest and really have time to do it well.

[KebaxKapak]

 

Then you HAVE to manually modify the Unification New Races .module file, as I told you.

Just look therein for instructions.

Ok, I'll look for the instructions and do it

 

 

As for me, I NEVER install games in a System folder!! Only apps.

Games come and go and I need full unrestricted access....

As I said and as you understood my knowledge about informatic in gerenal is very limited, but I'm learning ^^
So where do you install the games ?
Could it be installed any where ?
What if I uninstall Dawn of War and re-install it to another place, will the unification config work ?
 

 

 

 

More than a month, less than two, I guess...

For the moment that's the more exciting thing I heard in 2020

 

 

Ok, I'll PM if I have issues, thanks for your help and may the emperor guide you in your modding !

Edited by KebaxKapak, 13 July 2020 - 07:11 AM.

[KebaxKapak]

An idea for the realistix mod

 

I intend to establish rules for the melee that one could estimate it's injustified complexity but I thought it was necessary in my mod.
SO

The idea is that each unit would have it's own "Strenght", accuracy and "reload time" values put on paper. Those ones will only serve as a base to then calculate each weapons exact attribs.
Example : Guard : - Strenght : 10 - 50    (that would be the minimum and the maximum damage the unit would make without weapon (or without it's natural weapons if it's Tyranid))

                              - Accuracy : 0.4         (That would be a way to make a general "melee ability" difference between units)
                              - Reload T : 1            (It would be the equivalent of the "attack" value attached to each unit in the board game codex but re-estimated, it wouldn't be the same values)

     Space Marine : - Srenght : 50 - 300
                              - Accuracy : 0.75
                              - Reload T : 0.6

 

then, each weapon would have it's own attribs that would be added to the unit attrib wich they are attached to or multiply them
Example :     Knife :   - Accuracy : +0      (this value is also affected by the weapon range, a sword or a spear would have this value a bit increased compared to a knife)
                                  - Relaod T : +0
                                  - Damage min : 10 + (Unit min strenght)

                                  - Damage max : 100 + (Unit max strenght) 
 

            Power Fist :  - Accuracy : +0
                                 - Reload T : +0.25
                                 - Damage min : 150 + (Unit min strenght)
                                 - Damage max : 2500 + 2x(Unit max strenght)

 

             Chain Axe :  - Accuracy : +0.025 (related to the range of an axe compared to a knife or a simple fist, even if the fist is energetic)

                                 - Reload T : +0.05  (Heavier than knife but not as heavy as a power fist)
                                 - Damage min : 100 + 2x(Unit min strenght)
                                 - Damage max : 1500 + 2x(Unit max strenght)

 

 

I know t's more complex than what the "normal" moding requires but I think that it would add something to the realistic feeling I'm looking for.
It'll just take me some time to put all that on paper and then to change all the attrib values of the melee weapons.

I'll make a post where I resume all there is to know about the mod I'm doing, and about the rules and "methods" I think of to make it realistic

Edited by KebaxKapak, 13 July 2020 - 08:18 AM.

[Gambit]

So where do you install the games ?

In a different partition, in a folder I call GAMES

Could it be installed any where ?

Of course, you can use different disks, it is even better.

 

What if I uninstall Dawn of War and re-install it to another place, will the unification config work ?

Uninstalling would probably DELETE the other files, including Unification...

If not, then YES, you CAN copy everything in your NEW installation place.

What I do, is copy all new races (folder and .module files) elsewhere, and then paste them in my new installation folder.

[KebaxKapak]

Uninstalling would probably DELETE the other files, including Unification...

If not, then YES, you CAN copy everything in your NEW installation place.

What I do, is copy all new races (folder and .module files) elsewhere, and then paste them in my new installation folder.

 

Yeah that's what I planed to do
But I'm hesitating to uninstall every thing
As I said in private Unification mod is now working thanks to your tuto in the module and your help ; and the last time I downloaded and installed Corsix I had big issues, so now it's installed and everything seems working, I think i'm not going to touch or change anything ^^

Thanks for your help, now I'm going to download all the supported race mods and start moding

A question is comming now :
If I mod some attrib files from, let say, the deamons mod, will it be possible to just copy them in the unification compacted mod you intend to release ?
If it's not compatible I will wait for your new release to be.. released ^^


I'm really impressed by some deamons models ! great work, and the menus are so cool !

[Gambit]

If I mod some attrib files from, let say, the deamons mod, will it be possible to just copy them in the unification compacted mod you intend to release ?

Well, Race modifications go to Race Mods.

In Unification, there are the Vanilla race fixes and the additions.

We keep everything, at its place, as much as possible

 

Now, if you have some Chaos Daemons suggestions, go ahead, I will see them, and see if they should be in, and then.. Put them in, is so!

By the way, this is what it means to be the "Leader" of a project!

[Moreartillery]

Gambit, can you write a script or macro to copy lines from a .ucs file to google translate and back again? Google translate has a limit of 5000 letters at once and it takes hours to do manually.

[KebaxKapak]

 

 

Now, if you have some Chaos Daemons suggestions, go ahead, I will see them, and see if they should be in, and then.. Put them in, is so!

 

 

 

Well I don't really have deamons suggestions, they seem really well done to me !

Juggernauths are awesome !

I just had a suggestion about the space marines 3D models, because I saw really beautiful ones in the M42 mod for dark crusade and I think it would be too bad not to have them in the mod, also in the same mod there is a beautiful 3D model of Eldar wraithlord, and More Artillery have beautiful wraithguards in his Cinematic Battle mod, there is also beautiful Chaos Marines models in the M42 (dark crusade).

In fact the vanilla factions are really well upgraded in the Dark Crusade Cinematic Battle mod, there are many models of land raiders, leman russ etc I think this would be a great add to the Unification mod
Well these are only suggestions based on what I saw in a few other mods, maybe you have others plans, and I'm sure you already know what I said but well it's said.
If I knew how to manage about 3D models I could do that and replace the vanilla models by those I have told, but I have no clue about it

 

 

Well, Race modifications go to Race Mods.

In Unification, there are the Vanilla race fixes and the additions.

We keep everything, at its place, as much as possible 

 

Yes I saw it, but I thought it would be different in the compact version you plan to release, so I was wondering if the mods I'll make now on the different race mods will be compatible with what you plan to release.
But what I'm understanding now is, when you say compact version you only talk about the unification part, the race mods will stil be appart. Am I wrong ?
Anyway, I just hope I'm not modding to redo everything on the future release because it might be the Xth time I redo all my mod for many reasons and issues ^^

[Gambit]

Gambit, can you write a script or macro to copy lines from a .ucs file to google translate and back again?

I do not know how to use the batch commands of windows on text files.

And lua cannot directly apply to UCS, at least as I know so far.

But... Google Translate??? It will do an AWFUL job translating lines from the mods. The English used therein ... HIGH specialisation, with difficult terms.

 

@Brother KebaxKapak

Man, there will be a HUGE update in the vanilla races as well!!

For now, we have updated Chaos Marines, Spaces Marines follow.

So yeah, ALL the models will have a great HD boost, SAME balance, and of course splendid campaign cinematics.

 

Yes I saw it, but I thought it would be different in the compact version you plan to release, so I was wondering if the mods I'll make now on the different race mods will be compatible with what you plan to release.

Most pars will remain the same, but yeah, if you make any modifications, they will most possibly NOT work.

If you modify UNIFICATION files, that is,

But what I'm understanding now is, when you say compact version you only talk about the unification part, the race mods will stil be appart. Am I wrong ?

Yes. Race mods will STILL be separate.

[KebaxKapak]

 

Man, there will be a HUGE update in the vanilla races as well!!

For now, we have updated Chaos Marines, Spaces Marines follow.

So yeah, ALL the models will have a great HD boost, SAME balance, and of course splendid campaign cinematics.

 

 

 

Oh that's really great, I'm more a skirmish player but I'm curious about those cinematics
 

 

Most pars will remain the same, but yeah, if you make any modifications, they will most possibly NOT work.

If you modify UNIFICATION files, that is,

Allright, so I won't start modding now.
In fact I started working on a rule book, to make a rational realistic attrib system, wich would be applied to the whole Unification package (I mean the vanilla and all the optional races).

It would contain all the attribs, weapons, sbps etc and will be a base to then make a balance with the production possibilities or ressources.
I wonder if I will create a new ''topic'', more adapted to the actual project. Is it possible to delete a topic ?
 

 

 

 

Yes. Race mods will STILL be separate.

 

Allright, good to know, so I could start modding them

[KebaxKapak]

The more I'm downloading new races mods (I have a bad connexion, it takes a lot of time), the more I'm impressed, after the deamons with those perfect animations, the witch hunters are amazingly well done, the attention gave to details is astonishing ! Pretorians are perfect too, a lot of style!

[Kekoulis]

The more I'm downloading new races mods (I have a bad connexion, it takes a lot of time), the more I'm impressed, after the deamons with those perfect animations, the witch hunters are amazingly well done, the attention gave to details is astonishing ! Pretorians are perfect too, a lot of style!

Daemons are perfect?

If you really think that mod is perfect,wait to see the actual race mods those models come from.

 

WH_AS

Edited by Kekoulis, 14 July 2020 - 10:14 PM.

[KebaxKapak]

Daemons are perfect?

If you really think that mod is perfect,wait to see the actual race mods those models come from.

 

 

Man I can't wait !
and yeah I'm really impressed by some actual released models

BTW I have intallation issues about the unification mod.
It's about Black Templars, Steel Legion, Tyranids and the RAGE mod.
I don't know wich files to download, there are patches and stuff I don't understand.
Tyranids, it's said in the guide that the v0.05b2 is not supported, but I can't find another version
and steel legion it's about the objective point mod in it, should I delete the one I have already from the unification mod before instaling the steel legion mod ?

[KebaxKapak]

Hey guys,

here is the beggining of a new project that is, in fact, something that, I though, was needed to reach my goal of a realistic and coherent simulation of the warhammer universe battles through Dawn of War.

This is just the very begining of it but I have tons of ideas for the following
https://drive.google...iew?usp=sharing
If anyone feel like it's intresting, let me know and if anyone have time and is willing to help he will be welcome !

 

the file should be open with word or libreoffice because there are number tables in it with unit stats

 

some would say it's complex for nothing, but, in my sens it would be a huge simplification to have an objective rule book to unify all the factions stats in something that wouldn't be estimations.
Well, in an absolute perspective it would still be arbitrary estimations, but, each stat would then have a relative objectivity if you compare them to each other.
I don't know if I'm clear.

Well, thank you if you read this begining rule book,waiting for returns

[Kasrkin]

I got some suggestion

First, if the imperial guard are gone die in a few hits so i suggest add a cooldown capacity who creates a light cover who give a lv1 bonus of defense to a squad, the ultimate apocalypse mods do that and if you can add it toyour mods i think it would be a logical and realistic little help for them.

 

Second All the faction shall have a based units with the same time of production to not create a disadvantage for capture strategical point at the begining.

[Gambit]

BTW I have intallation issues about the unification mod.
It's about Black Templars, Steel Legion, Tyranids and the RAGE mod.

For Black Templars, download the LATEST version, and the fix.

The same for Steel Legion.
Tyranids, ... You will have to wait for the Tyranids team. Only the members of our team have access to the latest mod.

And RAGE, is just about to get a public release!

For objective points, ALWAYS use the latest version. Same with FreeUI. Delete the old ones, and use the new ones.
 

...here is the beggining of a new project that is, in fact, something that, I though, was needed to reach my goal of a realistic and coherent simulation of the warhammer universe battles through Dawn of War. This is just the very begining of it but I have tons of ideas for the following...

Man, just a suggestion here.

There is A LOT of design in your notes, and this will TAKE TIME to create and balance!! Not the work of one man, as I see it.

But at this point, the community cannot offer any help - there are only a few members, and ALL are preoccupied with their own mods.

Even in my team, we have just a couple of AE coders active (one being me)... And the rest of the team can only work on their own agendas!

 

Not want to dissapoint you, just to tell you how things are.

[KebaxKapak]

I got some suggestion

First, if the imperial guard are gone die in a few hits so i suggest add a cooldown capacity who creates a light cover who give a lv1 bonus of defense to a squad, the ultimate apocalypse mods do that and if you can add it toyour mods i think it would be a logical and realistic little help for them.

 

 

Well, I think this is normal if they die in a few hits, that's wanted, even in one hit. In the fluff imperial guards are mean't to be sent to death. They, in fact, have more like tyranid or ork strategy than an astartes strategy. Their role is to overcome the ennemy defense strategy and protect the vehicles wich are the ones who make real damages. So their force will be their number.
But, that being said, what do you call a cooldown capacity ? Because I have to admit I don't know exactly what you mean and if it really adds realism why not.
In all cases I'd like a guard squad shot by a heavy bolter not to survive more than 5 seconds you see, that wouldn't be fair for heavy bolters bearers who expect some infantry slaughter ^^

If a lonely guard had to face a lonely space marine, I wouldn't like the guard to be able to survive to any bolter shot.

 

 

 

 

Second All the faction shall have a based units with the same time of production to not create a disadvantage for capture strategical point at the begining.

 

Well that's an intresting point, I keep that in consideration. That wasn't really the plan because I like asymetrical gameplay, and I think each faction and unit should have its specificity. Maybe some factions would capture objective points faster but will have really more difficulties to defend them (like orks that should be able to capture a lot of strategic points at the same time because of their number, but wouldn't be able to really defend them, or to defend more than one or to at a time; or Eldars, because they are fast and have rangers, but would have limited defense capacities).

 

I know this is a bit disturbing, maybe every one would not like that, but, the first step is really to make things real like, implementing the laws of physic in the game without thinking about balancing it, and then, once that is done, the balance will be done, just like it's done in the table top game, by the number of units available in your army on the battlfield (so it will be done with production limitation and time/ressource cost of each unit).
I know you couldn't have test it because I was dumb and made my whole previous mod ""not as administrator" so the files are lost, but the previous mods I made were pretty much balanced despite the fact that rangers would capture strategic points in less than 2 seconds,the balance was made by other ways.

But the fact is, the game would be made to play with annihilation win condition. It wouldn't be balanced if the win condition was about capturing strategic points, that's true.

And I really like the time cost system made by More Artillery in the Cinematic Battle mod, so, I'm still thinking of it. Anyway, that's really not part of the first step of my plan. For now I'm just establishing the more realistic attribs that I can according to my fluff knowledge. Then I'll be thinking of balancing the whole and about unit production.

I will downloard and try Ultimate Apocalypse, so I'll have an idea about what your saying.

 

 

 

 

That's good to see you back man, welcome again !
If you want to have an idea of the sensations I'm looking for in the game I posted a ''pre-preview'' version of the Dark Crusade mod in a previous post. Try play to guards against Chaos or the contrary, you can play space marines and Eldars too or against a few ork AIs. The game is really not balanced at all and I just changed hitpoints and weapon damages in an aproximative way but it gives an idea of the brutality and te dificulty of the game I'm looking for. The better is to play it in slow or super slow speed (in the win conditions options), because things go fast in the fight. Imperial guards are the more advanced in modding in that pre-preview version.
 

Edited by KebaxKapak, 15 July 2020 - 12:02 PM.