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Canon vs. Non Canon


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#21 {IRS}Athos

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Posted 27 May 2009 - 08:49 PM

I personally think that all SW canon should be based off of the Star Wars: Infinites graphic novels, simply because Leia becomes a Sith, Luke dies, and Yoda crashes the Death Justice Star into Coruscant, thus killing everyone there. ;)


:) That's a bit nuts isn't it.... is that even a real series :p :p

Yes it is... graphic novels. Quite entertaining, really. :p


Gosh, you guys are really taking all this Star Wars stuff too seriously. :p I don't know what the hell you're talking about half the time. :p I personally do not think there is really anything that deep in Star Wars. It's just martial arts and kung fu masters (jedi) in space. :p

I concur.
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#22 Annullus The Grey

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Posted 27 May 2009 - 09:27 PM

some aspects of starwars open room for interesting phillisophical debate and as the forum drunk its my duty to debate philosophy
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#23 Jeth Calark

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Posted 27 May 2009 - 09:32 PM

I agree, Nertea. GO stardestroyer.net! :p

and you can never take Star Wars to seriously! :)

Edited by Jeth Calark, 27 May 2009 - 09:33 PM.


#24 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 04:45 PM

Yeah, we've been having this discussion over at the CAH forum and I would say:

Stick to the movies and take some things from the expanded universe if you have too.

Keep it simple, there are many things in the expanded universe most of us have never heard of.
Which brings us back to Lowbacca... of whom Lucas isn't very fond, because he's against Wookiee Jedi.
Here are some links on the matter.

http://www.darkhorse...t...asc&start=0

http://www.comicscom...d...92&expand=1

Then again, if you are gonna stick to what Lucas wants, you'll have to fuse Luke and Leia and call the result Leia Starkiller and you've got to make Han solo black.
Because as long as 20th century fox was funding Lucas he was forbidden to create a story about a heroic woman and her black lover (as with Star Trek, Kirk was intended to be an Afro-American woman)

But then again would you believe a man who announces a fifth Indiana Jones, while there's no part four? (PUN!)

QUOTE (Rob38 @ May 26 2009, 11:13 PM) *
Gosh, you guys are really taking all this Star Wars stuff too seriously. tongue.gif I don't know what the hell you're talking about half the time. tongue.gif I personally do not think there is really anything that deep in Star Wars. It's just martial arts and kung fu masters (jedi) in space. tongue.gif


Yeah about that, I know Lucas said he intended on making a movie series about religion, but...

Fact is he wanted to make a Flash Gordon movie... but they wouldn't let him, but since he already had the sponsors he made STAR WARS.
Which on some points look like a clever copy paste version of Dune and Lord of the rings.

Just look at this:

In the first movie/book both Frodo and Luke leave their homes after receiving an object, that belonged to a relative, from an old man (belonging to an old order) who had know that relative very well.
Later on they both find themselves in a bar in which a rugged man with a secret past (Aragorn being the heir and Han being an imperial officer) helps them escape and on their way.
Just as they're well on there way they encounter trouble (snow fall/planetary debris) and because of that the old man ends up fighting his nemesis and dies at his hands, only to reappear in the next installment of the series.

And them that's only the first movie (in short), check this:

The return of the King
The return of the Jedi

But that ain't all, take the final battles for instance, the battle of the black gate, the battle of Endor:
While frodo/han's strike team struggle behind enemy lines, their friends launch an hopeless attack at the enemies doorstep to divert Saurons/Palpatines attention so that he can be destroyed eventually.

And get a load of this:
What's the difference between the following:

Bene Gesserit - Jedi
Mentats - Protocol droids
Butlerian Jihad - Clone wars

Not to forget I'm keeping my mouth shut about Battlestar Galactica
Starbuck - Starkiller
Apollo - Han Solo
(the concept for BSG is much older than star wars, it dates back to the sixties)

And the rest was done Jones style, and I quote: "I make these things up as I go!"
(I mean Witch-king - Vader!? Darth Vader wasn't intended to be Luke's father in the first place. just a corrupted king.... ehm sorry Jedi.)

Doesn't take away that the Star Wars series is very good and a must see (especially the way the old ones are made) and that they really helped to redefine the word movie.
And then there's always the case of Metroid, Halo.
In which Halo is a very successful game whose story is almost the same as an other really good (but older game) but that's a story for another time, kids.

Edited by Excuse_me_princess, 20 September 2009 - 12:49 AM.

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#25 Ring o' Fate

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 11:40 PM

...A few things.
1: It's called EDITING YOUR POSTS FOOL! NOW YOU DOUBLE POSTED TWICE!!!!
2: George Lucas was BARELY educated. I don't think he could have read the Lord Of The Rings.
3: Wow. Bad connections. I mean, comparing Frodo and Luke when Luke left because his family died as opposed to Frodo that leaves to defeat a great evil? Come the hell on. Most of that is not even right.
4: Bullshit Halo isn't original. It might have taken a bit of inspiration, but seriously? Give me the game with a near identical storyline, and then I'll shut up.
And 5: This pretty much sums up my entire opinion.

There's a whole supermassive debate on this on a Trek vs Wars site somewhere, though I can't be bothered to dig it up. Basically it can be summarized as a cascading system:

1) Prequel Movies
2) Original Trilogy Movies
3) Tie-In Novels
4) Cartoons (eg. Clone Wars)
5) Other EU Novels/Comics
6) Board/Video Games

Where essentially anything in say, item 5 is canon unless contradicted by information in 4, 3, 2 or 1. The reason the prequels are level 1 is becuse he retconned a lot of things mentioned in the OT. These new "visions" of things are technically more canon.


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#26 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 12:47 AM

...A few things.
1: It's called EDITING YOUR POSTS FOOL! NOW YOU DOUBLE POSTED TWICE!!!!
2: George Lucas was BARELY educated. I don't think he could have read the Lord Of The Rings.
3: Wow. Bad connections. I mean, comparing Frodo and Luke when Luke left because his family died as opposed to Frodo that leaves to defeat a great evil? Come the hell on. Most of that is not even right.
4: Bullshit Halo isn't original. It might have taken a bit of inspiration, but seriously? Give me the game with a near identical storyline, and then I'll shut up.
And 5: This pretty much sums up my entire opinion.


Oh dear, him again.

1. sorry, nobody's perfect... big deal anyway and there's no need to call names.
2. Lucas barley educated? Well since you have been able to read it, I think anybody can.
3. I'm just comparing, i'm not saying there 100% similar, only on certain points, the stories connect, I'm not saying it's true perse, but there are some striking similarities.
4. Please read before you comment someones post, it really saves time, I mentioned Metroid and if you want an explanation, okay here we go:

In Metroid:
You play as a bounty hunter named Samus Aran.
Her body has been augmented to work with an advanced power armor.
You fight alongside marines against an alien race who wants to become the dominant species in the universe.
Most of the fighting takes place in old alien ruins and eventually you will encounter a species of parasitic organisms.
And there is an AI who will assist you.

In Halo:
You play as a super soldier named Masterchief petty officer John 117.
His body has been augmented to work with an advanced power armor.
You fight alongside marines against an alien race who wants to become the dominant species in the universe.
Most of the fighting takes place in old alien ruins and eventually you will encounter a species of parasitic organisms.
And there is an AI who will assist you.
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"Is that all there is? ... no challenge? ... no resistance?"

"Fear...fear is the mind killer!"

"Don't see it as an obstacle, see it as an chalange!"

#27 Gfire

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 04:50 AM

Frodo didn't leave to defeat a great evil. He left to keep the shire safe. In his original plan, he was only headed away. Gandalf was to meet him again before he left the shire (probably telling him to go to Rivendel, or something) but of course Gandalf was delayed with that whole Orthanc scene (and his letter wasn't sent.) Frodo started by heading out of the shire (as was his original main plan, to save the other hobbits) through the old forest. Tom Bombadil told him to go to Bree, and then Strider/Aragorn took him to Rivendel. Then at the council of Elrond he decided to set off with the ring. (This was actually done fairly accurately in the film. They didn't make him head to mount doom from the start, as I might have expected.)

Just straightening that out.
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#28 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 12:29 PM

Frodo didn't leave to defeat a great evil. He left to keep the shire safe. In his original plan, he was only headed away. Gandalf was to meet him again before he left the shire (probably telling him to go to Rivendel, or something) but of course Gandalf was delayed with that whole Orthanc scene (and his letter wasn't sent.) Frodo started by heading out of the shire (as was his original main plan, to save the other hobbits) through the old forest. Tom Bombadil told him to go to Bree, and then Strider/Aragorn took him to Rivendel. Then at the council of Elrond he decided to set off with the ring. (This was actually done fairly accurately in the film. They didn't make him head to mount doom from the start, as I might have expected.)

Just straightening that out.


I don't want to discredit you, but you're almost correct, Gandalf was to meet Frodo in Bree, in the prancing pony, after he had sent both Frodo and Sam away.
Between the Party scene and the sending away scene he went to Minas Tirith to confirm whether Bilbo had or had not found the one ring.
Only after finding the answer he returned to the Shire where he sent Frodo to Bree and told him to wait there for him, but he never arrived because of Saruman.
There Strider picked the Hobbits up and leaded them to Rivendel, where Gandalf finally met them after being rescued by the Eagle.
(It's still fresh in my memory since I had a LOTR movie marathon just yesterday... yes, all three the extended editions in a row!)

And I never said Frodo went of to destroy evil... I said he left after Gandalf told him to take care of the ring, just as Obi-wan gave Anakin's lightsaber to Luke.
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#29 Bart

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 01:22 PM

I don't want to discredit you, but you're almost correct, Gandalf was to meet Frodo in Bree, in the prancing pony, after he had sent both Frodo and Sam away.
Between the Party scene and the sending away scene he went to Minas Tirith to confirm whether Bilbo had or had not found the one ring.
Only after finding the answer he returned to the Shire where he sent Frodo to Bree and told him to wait there for him, but he never arrived because of Saruman.
There Strider picked the Hobbits up and leaded them to Rivendel, where Gandalf finally met them after being rescued by the Eagle.
(It's still fresh in my memory since I had a LOTR movie marathon just yesterday... yes, all three the extended editions in a row!)

That's the movie version. Gfire was talking about the book
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#30 Gfire

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 05:02 PM

There was a Starwars marathon on yesterday.
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#31 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 06:51 PM

There was a Starwars marathon on yesterday.


No I held a Lotr Marathon myself at my home, just rounded up some friends and watched all the dvd's... very nice!
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#32 Gfire

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Posted 22 September 2009 - 12:56 AM

No, I mean there was a Starwars Marathon on yesterday. :p It's a statement.
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#33 drogoth232

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Posted 22 September 2009 - 01:52 AM

What! No one told me this! What is this world coming too!
Wait... what?

#34 Gfire

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Posted 22 September 2009 - 02:49 AM

I caught a little of episode six. Not sure if they played all of 'em or just the old ones.
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#35 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 06:05 PM

What net, Sci-fi?
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#36 Devon

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 07:27 PM

They usually run them on HBO, but Idk...

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#37 Excuse_me_princess

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 07:29 PM

They usually run them on HBO, but Idk...


HBO??? Que
Is that an American channel?
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"Is that all there is? ... no challenge? ... no resistance?"

"Fear...fear is the mind killer!"

"Don't see it as an obstacle, see it as an chalange!"




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