93 replies to this topic

[Mathijs]

I think using the Ent as a base could really work out well here. Their animations (especially the punching ones) strongly resemble the Stone Giants. Their anatomy does too.

What Renny means is that this model is too smooth. Weta's concept is more angular (which could save you a LOT of polies), has less of a recognizable face, and is also less mossy. You might also want to try importing BFME tree models once this model is in max, downsizing them, and placing them on certain bits of the model to suggest a larger scale.

[Nazgûl]

- I don't have or know how to operate Max.

 

- I know what the issue with the shape/contours/anatomy is. I just don't know what Renny means with alpha brush though, as the alhpa brush in ZBrush does not sculpt per se. It only ads 3d texture to the mesh. For instance jagged uneven surfaces. I did use some of that for looks but It won't transfer to the low poly version off course...

 

- I used the concept in the weta book in post #1, not the movies. The book version is not as jagged as the movie version.

 

But I agree, for a closer resemblance to the in movie version, it would be better to base the giant on the ents, even though it would be somewhat of a "waste" to scrap the EA giant anims (which are good and polished in SEE using forward collapse). But perhaps we can use those for another creature like a troll or so...
 

Edited by Nazgûl, 26 June 2014 - 11:13 PM.

[njm1983]

You could always use both giant models, using the different animations. Your existing model just need to be tweaked to look better.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

By that I mean use Alphas to sharpen and distort the smoothness on a Drag Brush. As below:

 

[Nazgûl]

As did I. That's what I did, for the "scruffy looking" effect on the surface of the stones. But it's only seen on the high poly original. It won't transfer to the low poly version, unless I add hundereds of polies per stone  

Edited by Nazgûl, 26 June 2014 - 09:10 PM.

[Nazgûl]

How's this? Better? 

 

[MattTheLegoman]

This one looks better, still not as sharp as jagged rocks.

Can you make the extra detail that is lost in the topology into a bump map? A bump map can be converted into a heightmap and applied to the texture in photoshop, which could add all the detailed shading you want.

Also, I won't be able to get you the ent models until after I've finished teaching today.

[Nazgûl]

Like I said.. ZBrush is not very friendly towards hard surface modeling as all brushes are shaped like perfectly round balls. I dont know why they dont offer square and rectangular shapes which would make it a lot easier to sculpt hard surfaces without hassle.

Anyways, this is based on a pre made box (with a bump map) and I think I can make this attempt closer to the movie version. Espescially when doing topology. If needed, a strong bump map could be added via photoshop also even though I only have CS1, but maybe someone could help with that.

Going to work now so I wont be home until evening anyways ao the ent models are no rush

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

They do make hard-surface ones. Just use the Clay or Flatten brushes with a little bit of Pinch brush for refinement. And yeah, that's much better, but I'm still looking for more sharp protrusions.

 

ie.

 

[Nazgûl]

I do know how ZBrush works, but you don't understand my point ;p. 

 

ALL brushes in Zb is shaped like a BALL. That means you can't get flat surfaces without hassle. By hassle, I mean instead of just drawing with a sharp shape yo uhave to use workarounds. For instace, when I made the blades for the Azog mace, I had to isert a cylinder in the base blade, from which I extracted the affected mesh, which created a hole. I do use a number of brushes when I sculp, just like the ones you mentioned. Flatten (and similar ones) can obvioulsly flatten surfaces to some extecnt. But not as easy as if the brush would have been flat to begin with. The pinch is often used to create sharp(er) edges etc and raising details. The Clay tool is one of many used to crate basic form. But none of these can make hard surfaces as easy as you sculpt for instance a humanoid face for an orc etc...

 

if you google "ZBrush hard surface modeling" you'll see what I mean that this is an issue with this client (which I assume is less of an issue in clients that are not based on this type of manual modeling).

 

Now, did you mke that face or is it a random pic from the net? It looks good, but the majority of the effect is obtained with the projected photo texture as far as I can see. I will do the same this time, and skip the painting and go for texture projection instead.

Edited by Nazgûl, 27 June 2014 - 02:35 PM.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

Yeah, I made it. It doesn't take that long when you get the hang of it, to simply lay texture heavily on in different directions. It's not got a projected photo, I simply painted the texture on with a scatter brush and tablet. That took... fifteen, twenty minutes?

 

To use sharp cutting tools have a look online for so-called 'mech' brushes. They can draw sharp fissures without blurring the edges.

[Nazgûl]

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

Better. If that's low-poly it's very good. (If that's high poly I'd expect more detail, but that's just semantics).

[MattTheLegoman]

Irene's looks like it could be named Coral. =D

Nazgul - it is looking better. Closer to the actual design.

[Nazgûl]

Yeah, I agree... I'm glad you guys pushed me to try the other version. This is way better. And FYI, I'm content with the shape now, even though you might not be  When I slap a high res texture (photo) on this, it will be all set to go. Ent anims is gonna rock (!) for this guy 

 

Question for any experienced modeler/animator that might see this: Should I keep the stones as separate objects, or should I merge it all into one body/mesh? I think for anims, it will look way better with separate objects, no? Should give less streching etc..?

 

Edited by Nazgûl, 28 June 2014 - 11:47 PM.

[MattTheLegoman]

I think that you should take into account that the giant in the movie image is not standing straight up and is posed to be throwing the rock. =p He body is angled a bit awkwardly.

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

You wanna keep that as one object, except for maybe death anims (you might wanna split the mesh at that point for the giant to fall into pieces).

[Nazgûl]

- I know he's in a pose. But I think that straight positioned stones will look stiff and too human...
- Why one object? it's bound to strech the body in every joint?

[Irenë Hawnetyne]

Yeah, it will, but it'll be so much easier to manipulate with bones. Separation of the objects won't do you any favours.

[Lauri]

Yeah, one object is the way to go. There's ways to "fake" the stretch issue.