5129 replies to this topic

[Damfoos]

Thing with increased prices: Soviet Terror Drones (which cost what, $375 after IP?) reliably kill all your precious 'banes, especially in conjunction with Iron Curtain, while other factions have no such tools of quick and guaranteed infantry killing. So while the price increase for Foehn infantry will somewhat help other factions, it will make Foehn much weaker vs Soviets.

Edited by Damfoos, 15 January 2017 - 07:33 AM.

[Nicholas Chau]

just nerf the stats of foehn units; nerfing their prices won't weaken them much.

Edited by Nicholas Chau, 15 January 2017 - 07:48 AM.

[FELITH]

as Foehn

1.build barrack (-$600)

2.sell barrack(+$300)

3.got 1 Knightframe($400)

profit $100 lol

 

edit: nerf their price will nerf their build speed too it's a good idea. but I think they need only build speed nerf not their price, If it's possible to make. their price are expensive enough.

Edited by FELITH, 15 January 2017 - 08:20 AM.

[X1Destroy]

Nope, you can't separate build time and cost because it's coded that way. The more expensive something the longer it will take to get it out of the barrack.

Having mass produce infantry that cost the same amount as a hero will just clog up the infantry training queue which should be reserved for more than just tier 3 infantry. If I want expensive units that take forever to train I would turn them into tanks instead of infantry.

Unless Giantsbane become a WF unit instead of coming from a barrack I won't support a price increase. With 1400$ you need the same amount of time to build an Abrams. Anymore and it will be better to ignore it and spam Knightframes and Lancers instead.

Edited by X1Destroy, 15 January 2017 - 08:42 AM.

[Tyhednus]

Well, yesterday I saw an army of gods, giantsbanes and mastodons take a nuke to the face and NOT ONE of them died. Amazing.

Probably need a little hp nerf.

Edited by Tyhednus, 15 January 2017 - 08:52 AM.

[Admiral_Pit]

*late reply here*

I don't mind if the Giants are bulky, or even more bulky than Volkov, but I don't think that 1050 HP at $1400 a piece is a good ratio.  Personally I'd prefer if they just had less HP and cost $1500 to make em more reasonable, say try around 900 HP at $1500, where Gods will still have 850.  The only problem is the entry of the Giants that states that they have the fame of being the toughest soldier on the battlefield that even exceeds that of the finest Soviet cyborgs.  All we need to do is find a way to create a balance between its the Giants bulk, price, and a suitable nerf to Reprocessors.  Another thing to consider is that building more Barracks doesn't cost much, and so as long as the Foehn has money (*glares at Reprocessor*), LB can produce these troops fairly quick, and for their bulk, that's quite difficult to stupid, with perhaps the only other way to win is break the base while being away from the massive army, or somehow try to kill em, while feeding them more money if they still have that Reprocessor.

 

 

As for the Godsbanes, ever feel their power is a bit too much?  They seem to surpass that of the Seitaads, despite the latter being a Stolen Tech.  They both use the same weapon via nanofiber threads (not counting the Seitaad's EMP), but it still seems like Godsbanes are superior to them in almost every aspect, even being immune to EMP.

 

And when I tried to snap them apart with Curtained Terrors, I think Nanocharged Mastodons actually push Terrors out if they went after the tanks, and that can waste time.  I still need to do more research on this.  All in all, when reviewing the balance, we need to figure out how to counter things, and if each of the 4 factions have a way to counter em, but that's not to say that some (sub)factions shouldn't have harder times against a particular threat, but it shouldn't be near unbeatable.

 

Edited by Admiral_Pit, 15 January 2017 - 10:39 AM.

[Divine]

Price increase will also increase build time which is highly counter productive for infantry. I rather have nerfed stats instead.

Still better nerf the reprocessor than touching the units. The problem is that they are too easy to spam, not that they are too strong too beat.

With the current stats Giantsbane and Godsbane are still vulnerable to things like Viruses. They can be countered, it's just that there are way too many of them at once.

Really, Viruses? Because the last time I checked, Godsbanes just shrugged off the Virus' attacks with minimal damage. Well, only until some Huntresses YOLO-rushed in and killed my Viruses, because they can run ridiculously fast, for some reason. Like seriously, just why are they so fast? A mere 900$ for an infantry-chewing combat medic -hijacker that can outrun most stuff is just insane. Alternatively, Deviatresses can just turn Viruses against you, causing the devastation of your own forces.

 

Nope, you can't separate build time and cost because it's coded that way. The more expensive something the longer it will take to get it out of the barrack.

Having mass produce infantry that cost the same amount as a hero will just clog up the infantry training queue which should be reserved for more than just tier 3 infantry. If I want expensive units that take forever to train I would turn them into tanks instead of infantry.

Unless Giantsbane become a WF unit instead of coming from a barrack I won't support a price increase. With 1400$ you need the same amount of time to build an Abrams. Anymore and it will be better to ignore it and spam Knightframes and Lancers instead.

IIRC Ares has a key that can modify the building time of specific units or buildings, regardless of their actual cost. 

Edited by Divine, 15 January 2017 - 11:46 AM.

[CLAlstar]

as Foehn

1.build barrack (-$600)

2.sell barrack(+$300)

3.got 1 Knightframe($400)

profit $100 lol

 

edit: nerf their price will nerf their build speed too it's a good idea. but I think they need only build speed nerf not their price, If it's possible to make. their price are expensive enough.

Wasting time from your building BO to save 100$ is not a super good exchange you know?

[Solais]

Maybe the Banes have good HP but too strong attacks. Last Bastion is the tank faction, so the banes could be tanks themselves too. Not doing a lot of dps, but still keeping everything at bay.

 

Actually, would be an interesting mechanic, if there was a way for a unit to force enemy units to fire on them, even when explicit command is given to those units to not do that.

[Nicholas Chau]

Maybe the Banes have good HP but too strong attacks. Last Bastion is the tank faction, so the banes could be tanks themselves too. Not doing a lot of dps, but still keeping everything at bay.

 

Actually, would be an interesting mechanic, if there was a way for a unit to force enemy units to fire on them, even when explicit command is given to those units to not do that.

like make the banes similar to the bison tank in how compared to other MBTs, it has a lot of defense but crappy firepower??

maybe it could work but their hp values for tier 3 infantry are a bit too absurd already for such a specific defense role.

[FELITH]

As I said earlier about those Banes.

 

I think anti tank weapons should be affect with Giant&Godbane.

 

 

For now anti-infantry weapon affect to them more than anti-tank weapons..  It should switch IMO.

Edited by FELITH, 15 January 2017 - 01:53 PM.

[Divine]

Actually, would be an interesting mechanic, if there was a way for a unit to force enemy units to fire on them, even when explicit command is given to those units to not do that.

Plase, no. We already have mind control, confusion weapons, and the generic retarded behaviour of certain units that makes it next to impossible to control them (AA units and dogs, specifically) + support powers that capitalize on the said retarded behaviour, such as the Smoke Bomber or the Black Widow. The last thing the game needs is even more shit to take away our ability to actually control our own units.

[X1Destroy]

Really, Viruses? Because the last time I checked, Godsbanes just shrugged off the Virus' attacks with minimal damage. Well, only until some Huntresses YOLO-rushed in and killed my Viruses, because they can run ridiculously fast, for some reason. Like seriously, just why are they so fast? A mere 900$ for an infantry-chewing combat medic -hijacker that can outrun most stuff is just insane. Alternatively, Deviatresses can just turn Viruses against you, causing the devastation of your own forces.

You don't use the direct damage to deal with them. Use the gas. Spread it by killing other targets like Knightframes or Huntreseses. Giantsbane or not, they're not gonna live long when the toxic clouds just keep spreading around. Unless the Foehn player capped a Hospital, he would have to retreat the Banes to alternate position or they will become wasted money.
Huntresses are also counted as Hijackers as they can steal vehicles, so I guess that's why they have such fast speed. That is still a problem however, as they are already strong vs infantry.
 

 

I think anti tank weapons should be affect with Giant&Godbane.

Because after all it still uses infantry armor, not vehicle armor. Might as well remove it and turn it into a tank if you wanna make it vulnerable to cannons.
 

 

IIRC Ares has a key that can modify the building time of specific units or buildings, regardless of their actual cost.

Haven't seen that used for anything in the mod, so I didn't know about it. It would solve alots of problems we're having.
 

Plase, no. We already have mind control, confusion weapons, and the generic retarded behaviour of certain units that makes it next to impossible to control them (AA units and dogs, specifically) + support powers that capitalize on the said retarded behaviour, such as the Smoke Bomber or the Black Widow. The last thing the game needs is even more shit to take away our ability to actually control our own units.

Theme for 5th faction anyone? Powers and weapons that make the enemy unable to control his unit and turn them into neutral Abilities that disrupt targeting of any kind, forbidding force fire mode and stuffs........

"I can't use your stuffs, so no one can."

Edited by X1Destroy, 15 January 2017 - 02:10 PM.

[Divine]

It would make sense if heavy infantry such as the Knightframe and Giants/Godsbane were vulnerable to anti-tank guns. The in-universe reason why normal infantry can withstand them is that these guns are inherently inaccurate, and  (at least in earlier C&C games) infantry always ducked when they came under fire. So basically, AT guns could not hit them. Exo-suit equipped infantry on the other hand, can't really use cover, and provide a nice, big target. It would make sense if the armor of these infantries behaved more like the normal tank armor of the game, only a bit lighter.

[X1Destroy]

So........you want flak trooper to be the ultimate anti-foehn unit?

Please no. Infantry have resistance against tank gun for a reason. And it's completely stupid to have light tank as basic infantry.

Edited by X1Destroy, 15 January 2017 - 02:18 PM.

[Solais]

Theme for 5th faction anyone? Powers and weapons that make the enemy unable to control his unit and turn them into neutral Abilities that disrupt targeting of any kind, forbidding force fire mode and stuffs........

"I can't use your stuffs, so no one can."

 

 

Their superweapon causes your windows to BSOD, but still have the game running long enough to declare your enemy as the winner.

 

(Note: the quote system of this forum is retarded)

Edited by Solais, 15 January 2017 - 03:01 PM.

[Damfoos]

It would make sense if heavy infantry such as the Knightframe and Giants/Godsbane were vulnerable to anti-tank guns. The in-universe reason why normal infantry can withstand them is that these guns are inherently inaccurate, and  (at least in earlier C&C games) infantry always ducked when they came under fire. So basically, AT guns could not hit them. Exo-suit equipped infantry on the other hand, can't really use cover, and provide a nice, big target. It would make sense if the armor of these infantries behaved more like the normal tank armor of the game, only a bit lighter.

 

There are exceptions from the "can hit units but can't hit infantry because infantry is too small and dodges" rule already. Archers can hit a jet fighter passing by high in the sky with just an arrow (even if it has some homing capabilities) and a crossbow, but can't pierce a head of some dude which is standing nearby? And their description says they have increased perception... Marauder's gun has some AoE and seems to reach the target instantly, yet they lack against infantry and only do considerable damage to tanks, even though such thermal weapon (why Flamethrowers suck against tanks then?) would clearly do more damage to infantry than to armor. 

[Shadow86]

Just started playing Mental Omega 3.3 today, played a couple of skirmishes and... I can't seem to have the Stormchild attack enemy aircraft. Isn't it supposed to be an air superiority fighter? As the US, I've had to mass other anti-air units (Patriots, Strykers, Aeroblazes) just to get some measure of air defense against single jets. Those pesky Dustdevils took a while to go down, and seemed harder to destroy than Kirovs. Seems off.

Edited by Shadow86, 15 January 2017 - 09:49 PM.

[CLAlstar]

They used to attack air units. In mission A03 during 3.0 release. Now even there they lost that ability.

[Shadow86]

They used to attack air units. In mission A03 during 3.0 release. Now even there they lost that ability.

 

They need to amend the description then, since it no longer qualifies as an air superiority fighter.

 

And it's plain weird to have the US devoid of air-to-air aircraft, given how it's traditionally one of the leading air superiority factions in strategy games.