105 replies to this topic

[Gambit]

All options are open, of course.

 

For now, I am coding for IDH + waiting for further guidance-design suggestions for Kill-Team. Enough with spreading across 100 projects!! Now it is only 2 for me. (And the conclusion of Dark Angles, of course - which I think is done)

 

 

(...If it was for me, I would very much like to create a Space Hulk mod above all else! We have the tyranids, we have Termies of MANY factions, we could set an Multi-Player scenario in a Space Hulk map where we set objectives, and have swarms of Tyranids attacking the players' termi squads! LATER)

 

 

So any new things you want me to code for Kill-Team???

Or you want me to take initiative and go ahead and try some ideas of mine?

Edited by Gambit, 01 September 2018 - 08:09 PM.

[ZmajOgnjeniVuk]

@Gambit

Notice for everyone, take a look at the first post, I have broke down into points what is to be done for Kill Team gameplay mode. Open to suggestions, as always.
 

There are two types of Heavy Infantry, two types of Monsters/Daemons, three types of Infantry, and one type of Commanders.

A total of 8 (armour) types for "soldiers". There are Builders as well, but  the game does not utilise them. Exactly. BUT I have not looked into a specific SCaR function, that loads up the squad. It may only be able to give you the main entity, and one leader - the other 3 leaders may not be accessible... 

 

Would you mind giving it a go. If other 3 leaders are not accessible, can we at least try to do custom created squads with 2 types of members.
 

It is more like TWO versions, just like brother Roderick said. I think it would be best if I were to create the Kill Team first, and the the Last Stand later (as a different Wincondition), based on the first 

 

Ok, I agree.

 

Well, there is also the Space Hulk idea brother Shodar has JUST posted!!

 

I didn't see that but I could do the map for the purpose of the Space Hulk. Can you link me with the original suggestion by brother Shodar, is it at Discord?
 

So let's short this out. I will post the BIG plan, but note that it is only a SUGGESTION!!!

1] We make the Kill-Team win condition. And PERFECT it. Then...

2] We proceed with Last Stand. This is MUCH more complex. Within our skills of course. But probably.. "Without" our free time!

3] We proceed with the DoWDOTA and Space Hulk Win Conditions.

NOTE: Last Stand, DoWDOTA, Space Hulk will require SPECIFIC maps! They will be Map-Based, like Survival Mode. Kill-Team can perfectly use the existing Skirmish maps of the game.

 

 

So, for now,... ONLY STEP 1!!!!!

Keep your ideas catalogued/archived for the other stepa, and we discuss them in due time (if that chance occurs).

 

I agree with you brother completely. Lets do one thing at a time. Regarding maps, like I said I am willing to make them, or at least give it a go, after we brainstorm a bit what the maps should actually look like.

 

(...If it was for me, I would very much like to create a Space Hulk mod above all else! We have the tyranids, we have Termies of MANY factions, we could set an Multi-Player scenario in a Space Hulk map where we set objectives, and have swarms of Tyranids attacking the players' termi squads! LATER)

 

I have some idea for this map. I would go with a map size 512x512, or maybe even 1024x1024. Maybe we could go with a competition mod where players dont go after each other with their termie squads but who can take more ground or slay more enemies (maybe within certain time period). We could introduce more Tyranid types, not just Genestealers, Gaunts as well, Warriors and the rest. Maybe set up some kind of system where as player(s) progress swarm waves get harder. 
A win condition just came to mind. Lets call it "Converge and Defense" where after map is loaded, AI designates a certain random point on the map where all termie squads should converge and fight through enemies. Once they converge there, they are supposed to hold that point for certain number of waves.
 

So any new things you want me to code for Kill-Team???

Or you want me to take initiative and go ahead and try some ideas of mine?

 

Check out the first post but by all means, try out your ideas as well I would like to see what you came up with. 

@Roderick & Kekoulis

 

Ok, call it a far shot, but what about doing a similar game but with tanks? 

 

To be honest, I am not really a fan of this idea, but if we go with it, I would try to do my part. Who knows, might be interesting. My first issue is the severe disbalance between Land Raider and Predator, for example but I guess more on this at some future point. 

@Fuggles

 

You should totally include my scar maps in unification if you want game modes.
Would be fun to make ogre in this engine. 

 

Thanks for the permission fuggles I appreciate your support for this idea.
 

Edited by ZmajOgnjeniVuk, 01 September 2018 - 09:16 PM.

[Kekoulis]

 

To be honest, I am not really a fan of this idea, but if we go with it, I would try to do my part. Who knows, might be interesting. My first issue is the severe disbalance between Land Raider and Predator, for example but I guess more on this at some future point.

No need for it man.I prefer the Kill-Team to be perfected firstly,just as we discussed before.

[fuggles]

You know you could just use the space hulk mod...

[Gambit]

Would you mind giving it a go. If other 3 leaders are not accessible, can we at least try to do custom created squads with 2 types of members.

OK, 99% they ARE accessible, I have just found the function (but not tested it - it MUST be working) It is the:

 Squad_AddLeaderAtIndex( squadID, leaderIndex )

I think we are OK

 

 

I didn't see that but I could do the map for the purpose of the Space Hulk. Can you link me with the original suggestion by brother Shodar, is it at Discord?

No, nothing on discord, just a reference here.

Now, a Space Hulk Map would definitely be Interesting!

 

 

Regarding maps, like I said I am willing to make them, or at least give it a go, after we brainstorm a bit what the maps should actually look like.

Perfect!

For Kill-Team we will not need maps of course, this mode will be using the Skirmish maps.

 

 

Space Hulk

I have some idea for this map. I would go with a map size 512x512, or maybe even 1024x1024.

DEFINITELY GO 1024x1024!

In Space Hulk matches, there will be just a few squads spawned at a time, and only one AI enemy player, so it will be VERY light, the engine with the 1024 size map will actually feel conformable!

Maybe we could go with a competition mod where players dont go after each other with their termie squads but who can take more ground or slay more enemies (maybe within certain time period). We could introduce more Tyranid types, not just Genestealers, Gaunts as well, Warriors and the rest. Maybe set up some kind of system where as player(s) progress swarm waves get harder.

THAT is what I had in mind! Players will have a kill count, of course. It will be a COOP, but also a mildly competitive experience (the player with the most kills will be the "victor"). But we can start the squads at DIFFERENT positions, and have them join forces for large Tyranid Monsters. We could also set a time limit, where the players must clear the infestation. THERE ARE HUNDREDS of scenarios!

A win condition just came to mind. Lets call it "Converge and Defense" where after map is loaded, AI designates a certain random point on the map where all termie squads should converge and fight through enemies. Once they converge there, they are supposed to hold that point for certain number of waves.

GOOD idea as well!

 

 

You know you could just use the space hulk mod...

Is there any released version??? And I have missed it???

I will have a look right now!!

But first, let me see the first post here.

 

 

MARVELLOUS ideas brothers.

But let's not get too excited.

Kill-Team will take time to finish! And we decided we will start with this.

... Although I could finish a Space Hulk coop mission (given that I have the map and all needed markers)... within a week

[Gambit]

OK, I have just seen the 1st post, and it is ...

Just some remarks:

 

 

4. SP, CL and Relics are capped instantaneously (AGREED)

I will code it, but I think a x5 speed is better. We need sometime to get them, so that NOT to get weapon upgrades IMMEDIATELY!
 

6. Squad will have 10 members max (AGREED)

I would say max 9, for visual consistency

[fuggles]

Seriously, there is an awesome space hulk mod. The UI is weird in soulstorm and noone can find patch 2, but you are reinventing the wheel.

[Gambit]

Well, no need to reinvent it. Only revamp it and make it AWESOME!

But man, I had a similar experience in Survival. I started using the original code... Only to RE-WRITE THE WHOLE THING FROM SCRATCH, eventually.

Nah, no need to do that. I can code a basic AND MODULAR Space Hulk condition within a day. To modify an exiting one... A month!

[Roderick]

With the Kill-team overwriting of the scar, the Blood Angels give me error.

 

Win conditions: destroy HQ, AiMapdb, race specific themes, timer

 *ALERT: Building with name blood_angel_turret_bolter_no_limit does not exist
  Lua             Player.scar                    Ln  393 (Player_RestrictBuildingList)
  Lua             SoulStorm_Survival_Init.SCAR   Ln  135 (SurvivalFix_OnInit)
FATAL Scar Error! - Execution has been paused.  Error calling init function 9 : SurvivalFix_OnInit.
 *ALERT: Building with name blood_angel_turret_bolter_no_limit does not exist
  Lua             Player.scar                    Ln  393 (Player_RestrictBuildingList)
  Lua             SoulStorm_Survival_Init.SCAR   Ln  135 (SurvivalFix_OnInit)
FATAL Scar Error! - Execution has been paused.  Error calling init function 9 : SurvivalFix_OnInit.

 

Edit: let me apply the patch, I thought it was just for UM

Edited by Roderick, 02 September 2018 - 10:20 AM.

[Leemanruss]

Seriously, there is an awesome space hulk mod. The UI is weird in soulstorm and noone can find patch 2, but you are reinventing the wheel.

there is space hulk mod merged with bloodline mod many many maps playable it seems other factions also supported (if merged with unification mod another treasure would be added along with survival and strongholds)  

 

Edited by Leemanruss, 02 September 2018 - 12:52 PM.

[gnomodog]

in bloodline mod I liked the last innovation in the space Hulk, it's the bosses really fit into the gameplay and what reminds campaign Dow 2

[fuggles]

Yet it seems to have ditched ammunition, jamming and the custom terminators in favour of silly numbers of squads. It looks half assed tbh as a space hulk mod and is just Dow on a specific map. The bosses in dow2 were awful!

[ZmajOgnjeniVuk]

@ Gambit
 

OK, 99% they ARE accessible, I have just found the function (but not tested it - it MUST be working) It is the:

 Squad_AddLeaderAtIndex( squadID, leaderIndex )

I think we are OK

 

 

 

 

Glad to hear that brother I just hope the idea will prove the be worth all the hassle Im making you go through

 

Space Hulk
DEFINITELY GO 1024x1024!

In Space Hulk matches, there will be just a few squads spawned at a time, and only one AI enemy player, so it will be VERY light, the engine with the 1024 size map will actually feel conformable!

 

 

 

1024x1024 it is then. This will be fun 3:)
 

THAT is what I had in mind! Players will have a kill count, of course. It will be a COOP, but also a mildly competitive experience (the player with the most kills will be the "victor"). But we can start the squads at DIFFERENT positions, and have them join forces for large Tyranid Monsters. We could also set a time limit, where the players must clear the infestation. THERE ARE HUNDREDS of scenarios! 

 

I agree, there is bunch of stuff we could add. Lot of potential in Space Hulk gameplay mode.
 

OK, I have just seen the 1st post, and it is ... 

Just some remarks:

 

I will code it, but I think a x5 speed is better. We need sometime to get them, so that NOT to get weapon upgrades IMMEDIATELY!

Ok, I agree, lets try it with 5x. I presume the capping speed from the first version you sent us is the standard capping time?
 

I would say max 9, for visual consistency 

How do you mean for visual consistency? I mean, if we go with custom squads, number of squad members doesn't really play any role, we could go with 9 or 10. Am I missing something?

[Gambit]

OK, before anything else, see your PM box.

I have uploaded V2 of the Kill Team win conditions.

There are MANY updates.

ONLY SPACE MARINES for now. But expect much new strategic magic!

 

Ok, I agree, lets try it with 5x. I presume the capping speed from the first version you sent us is the standard capping time?

Yes, the first version has x1.

Version 2 I have just uploaded is x8! It is VERY good.

 

How do you mean for visual consistency? I mean, if we go with custom squads, number of squad members doesn't really play any role, we could go with 9 or 10. Am I missing something?

NO!!!

It was a stupid notion of mine (I was thinking formations).

Forget it, we can have ANY limit we want.

 

 

But read the PM...

We have a MAJOR problem in MP games

I will re-post it here:

 

I wrote in PM:

There is a SERIOUS PROBLEM in MP.

So far UNSOLVABLE.

In short: We cannot PASS INFORMATION FROM ONE PLAYER TO AN OTHER

So, let's say that you choose the Tactical Marines by pressing the appropriate button.

THE OTHER PLAYERS CANNOT KNOW WHAT/WHEN you chose

 

So only Single Player support for now.

 

Two solutions:

1] I try and find an EXOTIC method to pass info.

2] We do not use buttons but pre-spawn entities that you destroy (with [Delete] button).

 

I will try to achieve 1].

But I failed, when tried in Survival to pass the selected difficulty in MP games

 

@Coders: Any ideas?

I am sure if I create (not spawn) a dummy entity, will break the entity game index, so ... Desyncing. Any method to pass info?

[fuggles]

If I understand you, then potentially yes. See my risk map, or my tabletop battle map, let me know. It's not pretty, but it works.

Or use souls again, each squad gives a different amount of souls/faith/orkpop. Check each player's resources to calculated what they have got. Or hq hitpoints would work if you are despawning it anyway.

[Gambit]

See my risk map, or my tabletop battle map, let me know. It's not pretty, but it works.

Well I will.

In fact the alternative 2] I said above is not bad, but it will make any future Last Stand win condition impossible (no commander customisation screen...)

 

Or use souls again, each squad gives a different amount of souls/faith/orkpop. Check each player's resources to calculated what they have got.

Won't work

Because at the time a player selects a squad (and have the code giving him say +1 souls), for the other players the code will NOT.

So, desyncing...

 

The only way to do it is for the player to choose something GLOBAL and not local.

Because whatever choice the player makes locally, it will NOT get "transferred" to other players.

 

Now, spawning ALL 2 selections from start (for all players), and have the delete [Del] the two they discard, WILL work.

But as I said, bye-bye Last Stand...

[fuggles]

I miss what you are trying to do. I thought you built a squad from the hq (make it a Valkyrie, termite, thunderhawk)?

Equally last stand, you build a hero you buy wargear ala ua. What's the problem?
Make a scar finishing line, whichever unit crosses it first is the one you picked. Deploy to map markers, if one is empty that unit can presume to have moved.

Edited by fuggles, 03 September 2018 - 10:01 AM.

[Gambit]

Well, you do not choose your squad from any HQ!!!

The Kill-Team game starts with NOTHING. You only have UI 3 icons - your units choices.

So you press a SCaR button to chose one.

Something, the other players CANNOT know, until AFTER your squad is spawned...

 

I have just added you to the place where I have uploaded V2 of the Kill-Team win condition.

Have a look if you want, at this point it is VERY interesting. But it does not support MultiPlayer, although hit IS coded to support it.

The only thing missing for MP, is to see how a SCaR button click of one player, will translate to ANYTHING that can be communicated with the other players. Like deleting a squad (but this is UI functinality, not a SCaR command...)

[fuggles]

I don't get why you don't just spawn them from the button?

[Gambit]

I DO spawn a SCaR button.

The boolean function IsPressed, is only processed locally -> Desync.