873 replies to this topic

[Athem]

Only one question: What is that Library System?

[Sûlherokhh]

Check out this thread: Link to [Libraries for S.E.E + other new structures!?]

[clonecommand]

To sum up so you don't have to read that...

You can buy magical hero powers for 800 at a new building.

[Garrison Nomad]

wow...very original idea.

I still think it'd be cool if you did something like WarCraft 3 for the Inn, so you could hire heroes...that would be cool...but i mean, does it really take ALL the fun out if you stole the idea?

[Blendor]

Boromir new skin: level 10 Gondorian dresses (is transformed automatically)

Eowyn: delete spear throw. new ability: Witch-King bane and Merry sits down on his horse

Treebeard: new ability: level 10: battle song: the ally ents get +100% attack, +50% armour and immune fire arrows. (30 seconds)

(picture from Boromir new skin)

[GorGorgood]

Hi SEE people,

Very nice mod!!! Great to build the Dol Guldur walls and the Goblin abatis (chevaux-de-frise, fence obstacles, whatever). Great ideas!!!

I know you are following the movie theme but the movie theme followed Tolkien about maybe 85% give or take. Jackson or WETA Studios mentions in the production clips that they pictured the Orcs a using scavenged armor, but there would not be enough scavenageble armor to equip all those Orcs, and the movie does show many Orcs with the same mass produced helmet types, chain mail, weapons, etc. but in a great variety of mix and match with many independent items of a one of a kind type in the mix.

According to Tolkien the Orcs were fine metal workers and produced enough iron and other metals to make much good although much cruder than Elvish and Mannish armor. Hence, the movie does portray this very well, as does SEE and the vanilla games and other mods.

No fully enclosed great helms such as started to be worn middle Medieval times were used in Middle-earth, and only the Dwarves used enclosing face guards. Dol Amroth Knights with great helms is not good and i don't think that if they were portryed in the movie that they would have had great helms but rather have had helmets similar to the Gondorians soldiery.

Tolkien compared the late 3rd Age as a time of decline for the West, similar to the Dark Ages and early Medieval Age in Europe. The Rohirrim are based on the Visigoths and/or mounted Anglo-Saxon-Norse Housecarls. Some of the Rohirrim names are direct copies of Visgothic and other Gemanic names. Few greaves and breast plates were used during the Dark Ages and Early Medieval Age. Most of you may know this.

The movie shows only Uruk-hai from Isengard with pikes, and no other troops use them, hence the vanilla game strays from the movie by having pike armed Dwarves and Men.

In the game the Tower or Citadel Guard unit of Gondor is depicted visually as the Fountain Guard. Tolkien clearly describes the uniform of the Tower Guard and it is not like that portrayed in the vanilla game with white winged helms etc., which is the uniform of the Fountain Guard. The Fountain Guard is briefly shown in the movie unifromed as EA's Tower Guards in the game, and that is really messed-up. They also have what could be termed as long spears or short pike type weapons in the movie, but certainly not 14-foot plus pikes as the vanilla game has them and the Dwarves and Rohan Peasants armed with.

The Fountain guard guarded the 7th level of Minas Tirith, at least the tree and fountain, while the Citadel Guard guarded the rest of City and Citadel of Minas Tirith and campaigned in the field, and the Rangers of Ithilien were actually Citadel Guards if I remember correctly. I believe this is correct, and correct me if it is not, but I too have all of JRR and Christopher Tolkien's published works etc.

So, what I am getting at is that perhaps one unit of Fountain guards could be allowed for Gondor and no more than say 2 to 3 maximum battalions of Tower Guard should be allowed in the game at one time, and the Citadel Guard could either be Gondor Spearmen thatare stronger than Uruk Pikes, and that the Gondor Sworsmen unt would represent the regular melee troops, the men-at-arms, of the Gondorian army. Rangers of ithilien could also be limited to say 4 units max.

Same could be done for Trolls and Mumakil and Half=trolls. I'd through the Spiderlings and Spider Riders out completely as others also have suggested, and just give the Gobbos a Spear Unit and a Goblin King's Guard unit which itself could simply be a Troll Marauder unit with swords with a new skin or differnt colored/textured skin odr simply shield, say a red or a reddish-slightly-greenish-goldish copper or bronze colored shield.

Same for Rohan Peasants and Dwarves with pikes, just shorten their pikes by about 20% and they would look better and they could still have the same stats they have now. replace all Pikes in the game with long spears that are 7 to 12-feet long. Gobbos and Dwarves use the 7 to 8-footers and Men use 9 to 12-foot spears. Would make the units look very good IMHO.

To balance the game I think all uber units should have a limit on them as to how many should be able to be in the game or being built at one time. This would balance the game, make it more realistic, and force the use of siege equipment, good tactics, and conservation of your forces. Also, to make the game harder and even more realistic, I'd limit the amount of siege engines to only a few per side, forcing a concentration of fire and assault at one point on an enemy's walls with maybe a secondary attack and/or feint elsewhere, and this is fairly typical of actual Ancient and Siege warfare although in some instances several major assaults would be launched simultaneously as occurred at Jerusalem during the 1st Crusade.

Overall, the way you have SEE running now is much better than the original game and i appreciate it. i don't do graphics and am just starting to fiddle with BIG files and read tutorials, but I have modded Medieval Total War and talonSoft's Battlegound ACW and Nappy Wars series, Legion, Great Battles of Alexander, Hannibal, and Caesar in the past and have a very good home library of military books (a couple or few hundred). I modded data files, that is unit stats including sprite spacing and height, speed, weapon and armor values, etc. so realize all this is a lot of work and time and appreciate SEE and the many other mods here.

Anyway, great mod I see SEE is.

Thanx for your time and effort, Chris

PS: #3 of "The Sky has Fallen"

[clonecommand]

The Sky has Fallen?

There is some good stuff in there. I like the idea of the shortening pikes. To bad Nazgul is out for a bit...

Uber units are already shortened to having less than 4. No more than that. In the case of Uruks of the Orthnac and Black Uruks, only two are allowed.

If there was a limit on siege equipement, we would never finish the game. You need a lot (depending on the faction) of siege equp to destroy walls, for Heavan's sake

P.S. I like your username

[Garrison Nomad]

Production is already limited. Massively. Limit it anymore and the game will be impossibly long. Most changes are going to be determined and finalized once the mod producer gets back, particularly for the goblins.

[Uruk King]

Boromir new skin: level 10 Gondorian dresses (is transformed automatically)

Eowyn: delete spear throw. new ability: Witch-King bane and Merry sits down on his horse

Treebeard: new ability: level 10: battle song: the ally ents get +100% attack, +50% armour and immune fire arrows. (30 seconds)

(picture from Boromir new skin)

Those are some pretty good ideas. particularly the Gondor armour for Boromir. But don't take away the Spear throw from Eowyn, remember the Battle of Pelenor Fields with the Mumakil, Eowyn threw a spear in a Mumak's hamstring.

Edited by Uruk King, 21 June 2007 - 03:49 PM.

[clonecommand]

I don't like Eowyn, anyways (so much so, that I don't buy her) so I don't care what happens to her, but I like it. And the Gondor armor stuff.

I also like how we blabber on about something, then Blendor intterupts with beautiful ideas, that are short, sweet, and to the point.

[Downfall]

Eowyn was a important part in the Battle of Pelenor Fields.
How could you not like the one who slayed the Lord of the Nazgul (her and Merry).

[LOTRguy]

One thing I always noticed in the game when I play is that the maps seem very boring and empty (EA's fault of course ) And I always wondered if there were new ways to make the maps like a living world. Here are some examples.

Make places like (Erebor, Shire, Minas Tirith, etc) Act like a city with civilians and new buildings. There are tons of unused buildings and models to create stuff like this. Make the people act like individuals as a normal city would.

If under attack they scream and run for shelter (like minas tirith) or if in peace they shop at marketplaces or go back to homes or garden the crop fields for food and brings money to your ecenomy (like the shire etc) The dwarves would mine for mithril or diamonds or gold (remember the intro movie in BFME2) and that would be extra money for your ecenomy.

For fortress maps have the soldiers standing guard at the gates and doors and have soldiers open the gates themselves (like Minas Tirith and Helms deep). Instead of the gate magically opening by itself.

Just think of the Shire and Minas Tirith and Helms Deep this is a movie mod and if that were added this would be one of the most popular mods ever.

But this would be serious work but it would be worth it .

[Uruk King]

Well that's a pertty good idea but the idea is that it's a battlefield any civilians stupid enough to stay would perish. It's meant to be empty save for trees, the wind, the animals and the birds.

[Servant of Sauron]

How can you not like Eowyn!!?

The major thing I would like to see done would be a better voice. Currently every imitation voice is better than her's. It sounds nothing like the movie rendition.

[Lotrfan2]

One thing I always noticed in the game when I play is that the maps seem very boring and empty (EA's fault of course ) And I always wondered if there were new ways to make the maps like a living world. Here are some examples.

Make places like (Erebor, Shire, Minas Tirith, etc) Act like a city with civilians and new buildings. There are tons of unused buildings and models to create stuff like this. Make the people act like individuals as a normal city would.

If under attack they scream and run for shelter (like minas tirith) or if in peace they shop at marketplaces or go back to homes or garden the crop fields for food and brings money to your ecenomy (like the shire etc) The dwarves would mine for mithril or diamonds or gold (remember the intro movie in BFME2) and that would be extra money for your ecenomy.

For fortress maps have the soldiers standing guard at the gates and doors and have soldiers open the gates themselves (like Minas Tirith and Helms deep). Instead of the gate magically opening by itself.

Just think of the Shire and Minas Tirith and Helms Deep this is a movie mod and if that were added this would be one of the most popular mods ever.

But this would be serious work but it would be worth it .

good idea, but that would be too much work

[clonecommand]

I really like that idea...But that is work for the "professional" mappers, not the SEE mod. We have no mappers.

I can easily not like Eowyn! She is useless! Dies quickly, has a low attack, everything that makes her like a single unit in a battlion of normal foot soldiers! For heavans sake, she's a normal girl from medival times that happens to know a thing or two about sword fighting!


*waits to be hit in the face by a flying projectile coming through the window, then hear a car drive away*

[Mordor Slayer]

Nothing is too much for us ! I really like that idea, and if we get a map editor, that will be implemented, I'm sure (since Naz will like this).

[adummy]

none of you know how to use Eowyn right, do you?

[LOTRguy]

Well that's a pertty good idea but the idea is that it's a battlefield any civilians stupid enough to stay would perish. It's meant to be empty save for trees, the wind, the animals and the birds.

This idea I thought of would only go for maps which were shown in the movie. For instance the shire would never be empty because the shire was mainly in peace (except for the attacks on it by goblins) and there were shirrifs (guards) to guard the borders of Buckland, Hobbiton and many orther parts of the Shire from wolves, orcs and orther enemies. So if there was an enemy approaching the bell would ring and civilians would hide and the shirrifs would go and form a party and attack the enemy. (This goes for the Shire map only)



Now I wish I could delete this post .

Edited by LOTRguy, 21 June 2007 - 09:07 PM.

[Lauri]

*throws a flying projectile through the window, and it flows infront of CC's nose and hit's SoS, then it hits Downfall, then I beat it in a car*

*apparantly, I have to hit adummy too.... *throws another one* good hit*

Edited by Lauri, 21 June 2007 - 09:05 PM.