2298 replies to this topic

[Moonreaper666]

Can we all agree that it was beyond stupid for China to not share its Cyborg tech with Russia and LC AFTER SIGNING A TREATY? That by sharing that tech the Soviets, Allies and Foehn would all be in a better position?

Preventing Morales' death alone would have screwed Yuri big-time. His continued existence would force Yuri to commit more forces against the Soviets...

...which means less troops to stop the Allies going south. Noriko doesn't need to be part of the rearguard but instead joins Tanya and Siegfried as the Trifecta Speartips. Allied rearguard is much larger as they've suffered much fewer casualties

All three Soviet Factions have more Cyborgs and turn some of their Conscripts into Knightframes. They can attack all of Epsilon's bases much earlier and with more ferocity

Another effect is that Foehn can sneak more of their forces outside China and Japan causing less bloodshed between them and China (Epsilon is forced to send more troops to stop Foehn) as well as having more Cyborgs and Knightframes

TL:DR - Had China not been so stupid and greedy the Soviets and Allies would have forced Yuri to accelerate his timetable or fail

Edited by Moonreaper666, 02 November 2021 - 12:17 AM.

[Flandre]

Can we all agree that it was beyond stupid for China to not share its Cyborg tech with Russia and LC AFTER SIGNING A TREATY? That by sharing that tech the Soviets, Allies and Foehn would all be in a better position?

Preventing Morales' death alone would have screwed Yuri big-time. His continued existence would force Yuri to commit more forces against the Soviets...

...which means less troops to stop the Allies going south. Noriko doesn't need to be part of the rearguard but instead joins Tanya and Siegfried as the Trifecta Speartips. Allied rearguard is much larger as they've suffered much fewer casualties

All three Soviet Factions have more Cyborgs and turn some of their Conscripts into Knightframes. They can attack all of Epsilon's bases much earlier and with more ferocity

Another effect is that Foehn can sneak more of their forces outside China and Japan causing less bloodshed between them and China (Epsilon is forced to send more troops to stop Foehn) as well as having more Cyborgs and Knightframes

TL:DR - Had China not been so stupid and greedy the Soviets and Allies would have forced Yuri to accelerate his timetable or fail

Well that was talked again in the Soviet Campaign that the Chinese are hiding something "again", but the paranoia between the two made the things to screw things up. Yunru did warn the CN command, but instead of following they just "cool, a plan just to stab Russia in case Yuri goes bye-bye" yeah, kinda don't understand how dumb-dumb they go.

 

Anyway I do need help in some sort of problem during the Mission: Babel

 

There is this sort of bug, where my infiltrators cannot enter the gate where it is guarded by two Charon Tanks. There was no explanation why either.

[Moonreaper666]

[/quote]

Well that was talked again in the Soviet Campaign that the Chinese are hiding something "again", but the paranoia between the two made the things to screw things up. Yunru did warn the CN command, but instead of following they just "cool, a plan just to stab Russia in case Yuri goes bye-bye" yeah, kinda don't understand how dumb-dumb they go.
 
[/quote]

The Soviet Commander should have just defected to the Allies to prevent a lot of headaches. Volkov and most of the Russian forces in the US and Siberia would follow him.

China would contact PF so they can join the Allies as well in exchange for tech-sharing. Latin Confederation also joins out of survival instincts

Allies get data on Cloning, Cyborg and Psychic techs while the Russian Rebels, LC and China get access to Allied tech they want

Yuri bails on Romanov as well. Epsilon absorbs the ROC rebels and starts their attack on the South Pole. Romanov's death ends the Russian Civil War. Allies and Soviets focus on Epsilon. Scorpion Cell bails on Yuri and joins Yunru

With most of China's forces in the Antartica, Foehn stages a coup in China and reveals PF's shady dealings with the PRC to everyone else

Yuri and his forces die in the South Pole. Russia and LC forced to make peace concessions to Allies-Foehn. WW3 ends

[Flandre]

Problem is the Soviet General is the possibly "last" among the Soviet High Command who can unite the soviets against Yuri, too bad they're blind to see the big picture.

[Moonreaper666]

Problem is the Soviet General is the possibly "last" among the Soviet High Command who can unite the soviets against Yuri, too bad they're blind to see the big picture.

Imagine if Noriko sneakily stole data about the Cloning Vats, Terror Drones and Psychic Beacon from the Russians while they were fighting together in Japan

The Euro Alliance can upgrade the GLADIUS to block Mind-control as well

Cloning and Terror Drones would greatly help the Allies as they have fewer troops than the Soviets. Allows then to attack more often, take and hold territory as well as successfully defending what they have

The Allies would be desperate enough to mass-clone Tanya, Siegfried and Noriko

[Handepsilon]

 

AFTER SIGNING A TREATY?

 

Uh.... in case you weren't aware. There was a change in that part. Here's the aftermath of Juggernaut as of 3.3.5

 

 

 

I am sorry to ruin your recent victory against Yuri in Singapore, Comrade, but despite your best efforts we have failed to reach an agreement with the Chinese. To make matters worse, Reznov and Krukov have found out something worrisome.

[Moonreaper666]

AFTER SIGNING A TREATY?

Uh.... in case you weren't aware. There was a change in that part. Here's the aftermath of Juggernaut as of 3.3.5

I am sorry to ruin your recent victory against Yuri in Singapore, Comrade, but despite your best efforts we have failed to reach an agreement with the Chinese. To make matters worse, Reznov and Krukov have found out something worrisome.

The Soviet Commander really should have defected to the Allies before Beautiful Mind. Screw Romanov and screw the Chinese

Volkov and the majority of Russian forces in the US would be loyal to him. Allies would have Cloning Vats and data on the Psychic Beacon. Allies would then have access to Terror Drones to reduce casualties to their troops

The Psychic Beacon and Amplifier in Chicago are reprogrammed to protect the Allies and mind-control Romanov's loyalist, Chinese and LC troops

Gladius network is upgraded to block Yuri's mind-control

The SC's defection means the MIDAS in Chicago is now with the Allies. The Allies start researching Cyborgs (secretly aided by Foehn giving them data)

IF the Allies are winning the war then China would secretly contact PF so they convince the Allies to let a defecting China join them. If that happens, the Latin Confederation is forced to join the Allies. IF ALL OF THAT HAPPENS, Yuri is forced to build MO asap resulting in him losing

(I'm surprised Yunru did not secretly clone Boris, Morales, Noriko and Tanya before Foehn revolts against China. Clones of those 4 Heroes would have very much helped Foehn and indirectly the Soviets/Allies)

(I'm also surprised that the Soviet Commander did not relocate the St. Louis Psychic Beacon to Washington as it would prevent Yuri from using mind-control)

(When Romanov dies the SC should have made peace with the Allies. Both sides would have more forces to throw at Epsilon which could have made a difference in Act 2)

[Flandre]

 

 

AFTER SIGNING A TREATY?

 

Uh.... in case you weren't aware. There was a change in that part. Here's the aftermath of Juggernaut as of 3.3.5

 

 

 

I am sorry to ruin your recent victory against Yuri in Singapore, Comrade, but despite your best efforts we have failed to reach an agreement with the Chinese. To make matters worse, Reznov and Krukov have found out something worrisome.

 

 

Well ain't that surprising. Although that didn't explains The Soviet General getting complete access to the Chinese arsenal unless they took it by force.

[Handepsilon]

They definitely took it by force. The intel in Power Hunger and whatever's left in Kashmir might've been enough for them

[Moonreaper666]

I do have a few questions/thoughts:

-Why didn't the Soviet Commander transfer the St. Louis Psychic Beacon to Stalington so it can protect his main base from mind control? Why didn't he used two Iron Curtains to protect the relocated Psychic Beacon?

-Why didn't the SC unofficialy made peace with the US Rebels once Yuri backstabbed the Soviets in Mission 12?

-Why didn't China and Foehn secretly made copies of the Cloning Vat design? Why didn't Yunru secretly clone Boris and Tanya? (Yunru should secretly give her data on Cloning Vats to the Allies during Act 1)

-Why didn't the Allies Psychic Beacon in Sicily protect the newly freed Soviets? Why didn't the newly freed Soviets join the Allies even if its just for that mission only? (Allies start off and can build more Terror Drones in future missions. Very useful since they have much less troops than Epsilon or the Soviets)

-Yunru should have secretly contacted the SC and his two Enforcers (Reznov/Krukov) right before Heartwork. She uses her code to reprogram the Cyborgs, half leave the map to join her while the other half stay and join Russia. She also gives the two data on Cloning Vats and the Proto-Knightframes (Some of the Proto-Knightframes in the mission aren't hostile as they are loyal to Yunru. They give Reznor/Krukov intel then leave)

-Threat of Dread should be protecting Yunru for a certain time limit against both China and Epsilon in exchange for her giving A LOT of Upgraded Terror Drones/Repair Drones and Foehn schematics to the Soviet Commander. Mission ends when you destroy the Epsilon bases (China finally joins back to the Soviet-fold so the SC tells Yunru that he can no longer help her)

(Yunru threatens to launch a MIDAS which causes the Soviets to back off. She uses it anyways but at Epsilon-occupied Moscow, Morales lives to fight for later Soviet missions. Foehn and Soviets are much more stronger)

-In all Foehn Missions, you have one clone of Boris, Tanya AND Yunru. They don't die when defeated and have upgraded stats. Also have Cyborg Vanguards, Upgraded Terror Drones and Knightframes

-In Foehn 1, there should be ROC rebels prisoners to recruit. A few of the Chinese forces defect to Foehn

-Foehn 2, destroying the Psychic Beacon causes some of the freed Chinese to join Foehn. A small wave of Chinese reinforcements appear from off-the map to defect to Yunru as well

-Foehn 3, the PF bases have secretly build Foehn Cloning Vats. A small group of Russian soldiers (left behind by the SC during Unshakable) defect to Foehn

-Foehn 4, it should be possible to free some of the Russians from mind-control by destroying a Psychic Beacon and for them to join Foehn

-There should be a Foehn Covert Ops mission in the Arctic. Allied and Soviet Remnants use a Psychic Amplifier to protect themselves from mind-control until the Paradox Engine de-syncs them. They become Hailhead

[Handepsilon]

-Why didn't the Soviet Commander transfer the St. Louis Psychic Beacon to Stalington so it can protect his main base from mind control? Why didn't he used two Iron Curtains to protect the relocated Psychic Beacon?

That implies he knows how to do it. All data about psychic were lost after brain-reset. It also implies the Beacon was still standing there somehow. That, and it's too risky to use a tech from a traitor who might be able to just sabotage it.
 

-Why didn't the SC unofficialy made peace with the US Rebels once Yuri backstabbed the Soviets in Mission 12?

You mean in Mission 13? He did get Allied units in Mission 14, if you try to go on the top and free them.
 

-Why didn't China and Foehn secretly made copies of the Cloning Vat design? Why didn't Yunru secretly clone Boris and Tanya? (Yunru should secretly give her data on Cloning Vats to the Allies during Act 1)

Tech and moral issues. Plus Huehuecoyotl should be a lesson for anyone trying to use Cloning Vats.

 

-Why didn't the Allies Psychic Beacon in Sicily protect the newly freed Soviets? Why didn't the newly freed Soviets join the Allies even if its just for that mission only? (Allies start off and can build more Terror Drones in future missions. Very useful since they have much less troops than Epsilon or the Soviets)

Allied and Soviet nations hate each others guts completely, barring ideological differences. Let's not forget how Soviet MIDAS'd Allied twice now.
 

-Yunru should have secretly contacted the SC and his two Enforcers (Reznov/Krukov) right before Heartwork. She uses her code to reprogram the Cyborgs, half leave the map to join her while the other half stay and join Russia. She also gives the two data on Cloning Vats and the Proto-Knightframes (Some of the Proto-Knightframes in the mission aren't hostile as they are loyal to Yunru. They give Reznor/Krukov intel then leave)

Mainly because Yunru probably sees them as she sees the China leaders : Greedy and power hungry. It's very apparent that the Soviets want the technology for themselves and themselves only. Politics make things quite complicated here, and Russia really wants to keep their position in power on the top. Because really that's their whole goal in Act 2 : Kill Yuri, and still be on top of the world.

(Yunru threatens to launch a MIDAS which causes the Soviets to back off. She uses it anyways but at Epsilon-occupied Moscow, Morales lives to fight for later Soviet missions. Foehn and Soviets are much more stronger)

Russians will definitely take GREAT offense in that. Moscow is not just a mere city. It's the heart of their nation

Edited by Handepsilon, 04 November 2021 - 03:25 AM.

[Moonreaper666]

Didn't the LC and China (and therefore Foehn) have Cloning Vats until Dragonstorm? What 'moral' problems?

(China and LC have no morals and Foehn has a manpower shortage)

The Soviet Commander should have made peace with the Allies (at least the US) before Mission 13 as both China and Yuri are now hostile to the Russians (Give the Allies Terror Drones and Repair Drones in exchange for Russia and LC getting Robot Tanks)

(The Allies would have made it to MO much earlier and with more forces as well as done more damage to Epsilon. They would have destroyed MO before Libra kills Noriko. Allies and Foehn then take out Epsilon and Soviets)

The Soviet Commander should have made a secret deal with the Allies regarding Tanya:

-Tanya is in Moscow OFFICIALLY as Romanov's bodyguard when Yuri launches his coup. UNOFFICIALLY the SC convinces Tanya to prevent the MIDAS missiles from falling into Epsilon hands. In exchange, HALF of the MIDAS are given to the Allies

The Latin Confederation should have made Clones of Morales, Boris and Tanya for as long as they held the Cloning Vats. Forcing Epsilon to send their Armies to destroy the Cloning Vats and suffering VERY HEAVY casualties in the first place!

[Handepsilon]

Didn't the LC and China (and therefore Foehn) have Cloning Vats until Dragonstorm? What 'moral' problems?

(China and LC have no morals and Foehn has a manpower shortage)

The Soviet Commander should have made peace with the Allies (at least the US) before Mission 13 as both China and Yuri are now hostile to the Russians (Give the Allies Terror Drones and Repair Drones in exchange for Russia and LC getting Robot Tanks)

(The Allies would have made it to MO much earlier and with more forces as well as done more damage to Epsilon. They would have destroyed MO before Libra kills Noriko. Allies and Foehn then take out Epsilon and Soviets)

The Soviet Commander should have made a secret deal with the Allies regarding Tanya:

-Tanya is in Moscow OFFICIALLY as Romanov's bodyguard when Yuri launches his coup. UNOFFICIALLY the SC convinces Tanya to prevent the MIDAS missiles from falling into Epsilon hands. In exchange, HALF of the MIDAS are given to the Allies

The Latin Confederation should have made Clones of Morales, Boris and Tanya for as long as they held the Cloning Vats. Forcing Epsilon to send their Armies to destroy the Cloning Vats and suffering VERY HEAVY casualties in the first place!

Time Capsule/Foehn spoiler.

Spoiler

China and Yunru don't see eye-to-eye, especially not after Time Capsule's flashback. She surely won't see eye to eye with the rest of the Soviets after she was practically sold out by General Wu.

More than anything, the Soviet's struggle of power would cause Yunru to see the soviet as completely a lost cause. They care more for power. Yuri's betrayal to Russia was seen by Chinese as an opportunity to strike Russia. There was no reason for Yunru to believe that the Soviet Commander and the rest of the Soviet Union to be any different.

 
 Yuri's technically not a de-facto enemy because he was feeding Russian enemies false info about MIDAS being in production again. There was no point on opposing Yuri, who at the point of time, was seen more as a nuisance and somewhat-helpful than anything. Openly stating that Yuri had defected would do more harm to Russians than it helped.

 

And again,  ideological issues are a problem. Russia vs. China are pretty much the issue of 'who is the seat of power among communism'. It's a soviet problem and I'm certain Russia would like it to stay Soviet. Allying with US would just render their cause null, because US is clearly the opposite of Communism.
 
Also, that's not how cloning vats work. If it does, Yuri would've made an army of Rahn, Malver and Libra himself. Libra clones had proven that the cloning process aren't always perfect. Besides, Latins had clearly lost their Vats tech, and they surely won't try to use it again, not after Huehuecoyotl happened.

Edited by Handepsilon, 04 November 2021 - 07:10 AM.

[Flandre]

Sorry for bumping this question as not sure if it's a bug or I missed something.

 

In the Babel Mission, where one of the task is sabotaging the Paradox Conductors, in the 2nd one where it is behind a gate guarded by 2 Charon Tanks. my units cannot pass it for some reason.

[Moonreaper666]

It's strange the PF didn't have Cloning Vats, China should have given them the data (secretly) to make their own. Yunru should have analyzed the Cloning Vats Yuri gave to China (so she still have access to CVs even after Yuri cut the Soviets off. Same with the Pacific Front)

(Assuming all Soviet subfactions use Cloning Vats until Yuri cut them off in that Covert Ops mission)

Find it strange the Soviet Commander UNOFFICIALLY make a ceasefire with the US Rebels after Dragonstorm. Also order his scientists (and those he captured from the Allies) to find a way to protect his soldiers from mind-control. Recover as much data about the Psychic Beacon as a starting point

Soviet Commander SECRETLY transfers Tanya to Moscow. His agent gives Tanya his gear back as well as give her a Friendly marker so the Russians don't attack her. Her FREEDOM and blueprints of the Terror Drone in exchange for recovering the MIDAS missiles. SC doesn't care about Romanov's death

This allows Siegfried to go on his solo mission as the First Chrono Legionnaire. His mission is now against Epsilon

The Soviet Commander should cooperate with Yunru in Heartwork and Threat of Dread UNTIL China relents and returns to the Soviet-fold. Then the Soviet Commander tells Yunru the deal's off. Yunru tells the Soviets to back off because she has a MIDAS which they comply

Foehn then grabs the ROC Rebels and heads to Japan. She uses the MIDAS against the Epsilon forces in Antartica. This allows her to get her PF forces off Japan without a fight with the Chinese. Soviets and Foehn have more forces

There is no way Epsilon can rebuild and replace all of its bases/defenders in Antartica before the Allies arrive, now having Terror Drones. Mental Omega is destroyed

I wish I can make a Foehn Epilogue Campaign set after Foehn destroys Epsilon. Foehn builds a SINGLE-USE Time Machine to go back to RA1 and stop all the bad events even if it means being erased from the Timeline

[Moonreaper666]

There is still no plausible reason for Foehn NOT TO use a Time-Machine AFTER they defeat Epsilon

-They go back to 1880 to prevent the World Wars and pass down their technology to Albert Einstein. Space colonization in 1890 would change human society for the better

-If you want Epilogue missions then Foehn goes back two years BEFORE RA1 to prepare the RA1 Allies and eliminate Yuri. The RA1 Allies curbstomp the Soviets and prevent WW3

Even if it erases Foehn from history, they would SAVE THE LIVES OF BILLIONS

Considering how the US still makes 9/11 a 'big deal' (killed only 5k) the American elements within Foehn would definitely go for Time-travel

Scorpion Cell elements would support it as Africa and India would be Independent in 1880s and be much more prosperous (Somalia with Foehn technology would be better off than our Modern Scandinavia)

Chinese, Russian, Latin Confederation and Pacific remnants want to prevent the rise of corrupt governments in Russia, China, Japan and Latin America

Euro Alliance remnants want to prevent the death toll they suffer in WW2!!!

Foehn's technology prevents global warming, vastly increases lifespans, provides much better living standards, etc.

They can design the Time-Machine to be only USED ONCE then make a pact to NEVER use Time-Travel again!

[mrvecz]

There is still no plausible reason for Foehn NOT TO use a Time-Machine AFTER they defeat Epsilon


Foehn's technology prevents global warming, vastly increases lifespans, provides much better living standards, etc.

They can design the Time-Machine to be only USED ONCE then make a pact to NEVER use Time-Travel again!

The thing is, nobody knows how to make it, the only two humans on Earth that know how to do it are dead and i am pretty sure Siegfried made sure that time travel is never, ever used again given it pretty much started all of this and the... unexpected consequences could easily kickstart something else..... cue RA3 intro..

 

Or worse, it could create a reality where Tiberium lands on Earth and what follows would make the Mental Omega war look like a walk in the park in comparison to 1/2/3 Tiberium wars, most of humanity at brink of extinction, Earth almost inhabitable and also first contact with extra terrestials that are genocidal freaks with tech beyond even Foehns understanding.

 

Yunru and Rashidi probably dont even know about it existing, let alone that time travel is even possible and has been done without creating paradox. The extend of space time manipulation they know is from Paradox Engine, whatever has been left in Siegfrieds notes and Chronosphere tech in general.

 

Even if they could make it, it would be impossible to just use it once, people are just not that idealistic and would wage war over the time machine tech given anyone could use it to make their nation dominant. Even the ideologically good parts of the Revolt would devolve in to power grabs.

 

And the main reason, it would invalidate everything and would be extremely insulting to the player that all that they have done was for fuckall in the end...

[Moonreaper666]

There is still no plausible reason for Foehn NOT TO use a Time-Machine AFTER they defeat Epsilon


Foehn's technology prevents global warming, vastly increases lifespans, provides much better living standards, etc.

They can design the Time-Machine to be only USED ONCE then make a pact to NEVER use Time-Travel again!

The thing is, nobody knows how to make it, the only two humans on Earth that know how to do it are dead and i am pretty sure Siegfried made sure that time travel is never, ever used again given it pretty much started all of this and the... unexpected consequences could easily kickstart something else..... cue RA3 intro..

Or worse, it could create a reality where Tiberium lands on Earth and what follows would make the Mental Omega war look like a walk in the park in comparison to 1/2/3 Tiberium wars, most of humanity at brink of extinction, Earth almost inhabitable and also first contact with extra terrestials that are genocidal freaks with tech beyond even Foehns understanding.

Yunru and Rashidi probably dont even know about it existing, let alone that time travel is even possible and has been done without creating paradox. The extend of space time manipulation they know is from Paradox Engine, whatever has been left in Siegfrieds notes and Chronosphere tech in general.

Even if they could make it, it would be impossible to just use it once, people are just not that idealistic and would wage war over the time machine tech given anyone could use it to make their nation dominant. Even the ideologically good parts of the Revolt would devolve in to power grabs.

And the main reason, it would invalidate everything and would be extremely insulting to the player that all that they have done was for fuckall in the end...

There would be just a few hundred million (out of several Billions) people left after Foehn destroys Epsilon. There is no future after that

Urban centers all ruined. Resources drained. No government. PTSD galore. No recovering

Anything is better that this. RA2, RA3 or the Tiberium series are much better Earths to live in than Mental Omega by a mile

Does Einstein remember using the Time-Machine to kill Hitler? If so he should have pass down the knowledge to Siegfried

[Handepsilon]

 

Does Einstein remember using the Time-Machine to kill Hitler?

He does and from the briefing stories, he seems to regret that decision so deeply

[Speeder]

Einstein of Red Alert is not the one who removed him though. That Einstein returned to his original timeline without experiencing any changes.