2298 replies to this topic

[mrvecz]

 

 

There is still no plausible reason for Foehn NOT TO use a Time-Machine AFTER they defeat Epsilon


Foehn's technology prevents global warming, vastly increases lifespans, provides much better living standards, etc.

They can design the Time-Machine to be only USED ONCE then make a pact to NEVER use Time-Travel again!

There would be just a few hundred million (out of several Billions) people left after Foehn destroys Epsilon. There is no future after that

 

Realism wise, few milions would be more than enough to restore humanity, there were fewer Humans in history than that, looking around the internet throws some numbers at me, but it seems 500 Humans are enough to prevent extinction AND to evade inbreeding problems.

 

So yes, if only Foehn Revolt were to remain, they could still repopulate Earth multiple times over. There would be also a hidden bonus playing to Foehn's cards and that because its composed from survivors from militiaries and the best of the best, this would serve as a seal of quality of its personal that they are likely to be the best of the best in terms of mental and physical health so nobody can taint the DNA integrity of the new humanity with crippling genetical defects. Such crisis will also remove everyone too reliant on health care...quite the cruel natural selection, but Humanity will carry on.

 

 

And no, you can fight me on this but i rather live in a world that still resembles our own, just being desolate and war torn, this wouldnt be anything new to humanity. The solace of low population would also mean there wouldn be any petty wars (maybe ?) and resources would be plentiful so no wars due to oil or uranium would happen for really long time.

 

Living post third tiberium war, once GDI get the TCN towers up...yeah, in that moment it would be better than in Mental Omega universe.... if we ignore the fact that the Scrin are out for revenge and want to eradicate humanity, this time with actual military.

And to remind you, Scrin can create blackholes and wormholes, and the miners were armed with such things. So living in Tiberium universe would carry some...existential dread.

[Moonreaper666]

There is still no plausible reason for Foehn NOT TO use a Time-Machine AFTER they defeat Epsilon


Foehn's technology prevents global warming, vastly increases lifespans, provides much better living standards, etc.

They can design the Time-Machine to be only USED ONCE then make a pact to NEVER use Time-Travel again!

There would be just a few hundred million (out of several Billions) people left after Foehn destroys Epsilon. There is no future after that

Realism wise, few milions would be more than enough to restore humanity, there were fewer Humans in history than that, looking around the internet throws some numbers at me, but it seems 500 Humans are enough to prevent extinction AND to evade inbreeding problems.

So yes, if only Foehn Revolt were to remain, they could still repopulate Earth multiple times over. There would be also a hidden bonus playing to Foehn's cards and that because its composed from survivors from militiaries and the best of the best, this would serve as a seal of quality of its personal that they are likely to be the best of the best in terms of mental and physical health so nobody can taint the DNA integrity of the new humanity with crippling genetical defects. Such crisis will also remove everyone too reliant on health care...quite the cruel natural selection, but Humanity will carry on.


And no, you can fight me on this but i rather live in a world that still resembles our own, just being desolate and war torn, this wouldnt be anything new to humanity. The solace of low population would also mean there wouldn be any petty wars (maybe ?) and resources would be plentiful so no wars due to oil or uranium would happen for really long time.

Living post third tiberium war, once GDI get the TCN towers up...yeah, in that moment it would be better than in Mental Omega universe.... if we ignore the fact that the Scrin are out for revenge and want to eradicate humanity, this time with actual military.
And to remind you, Scrin can create blackholes and wormholes, and the miners were armed with such things. So living in Tiberium universe would carry some...existential dread.

Tiberium Universes still has Billions of people

Diplomacy and MAD would work against the Scrin. That alien race is sort-of-greedy

No, humanity won't recover from WW3. It took DECADES for us to recover from WW2 (which only killed THREE PERCENT of the Population!)

Having over 95% of the population dead would set humanity back OVER SEVERAL MILLENIA

There is no way Foehn WILL NOT use Time-travel to fix things!!!

-If Foehn goes back to before RA1 they can prevent WW2 and WW3 by eliminating Stalin, Mao, Che Guerra, Romanov and Yuri. Foehn technology allows everyone to have great living standards and deincentivize warfare

-If Foehn goes back to 1885 they prevent WW1 and help Colonies gain Independence much earlier as well as promote space colonization

Anyone that says they would want to live in a Post-Epsilon world WITHOUT TIME-TRAVEL is clearly priviledged enough to not understand suffering. Talking about a level of PTSD that not even the toughest Navy Seal can handle for more than a few days

Albert Einstein DID prevent the Holocaust and GREATLY REDUCE the number of people that died in WW2 thanks to Time-Travel in RA1 (From 60 Million to less than 17 Million)

France, Libya, Italy, Norway and Britain spared the horrors of WW2

There should be a cutscene in which Siegfried argues that his mentor's use of Time-travel saved countless lives!

It's not hard to ensure that Foehn won't use Time-travel more than once:

-Have as few scientists as possible work on Foehn's SINGLE-USE Time Machine

-Scientists have a Vow of Silence much more binding that the Catholic/Vatican vows

-Burn Siegfried and Einstein's notes

-Incinerate the Time-Machine after it is used

Foehn would be erased from the Timeline after they helped RA1 Allies and prevent WW3. The RA1 Allies don't make the same mistakes and start colonizing space

[Handepsilon]

In Meta perspective, it's really just something of a slap in the face to the whole storyline. What's the point of everyone's sacrifice if all of that can be undone with but a time machine macguffin? The whole plot will then just amount to nothing. All stakes are no longer valid. Just look at how RA3 undoing all of RA2's storyline.

 

In plot perspective, there's this thing called butterfly effect. Remember how Einstein erased Hitler and thus created an even worse war than actual WW2? And how Cherdenko erased Einstein and created a situation even worse than RA1 and RA2? Yah, no thank you

Edited by Handepsilon, 09 November 2021 - 02:59 AM.

[Moonreaper666]

In Meta perspective, it's really just something of a slap in the face to the whole storyline. What's the point of everyone's sacrifice if all of that can be undone with but a time machine macguffin? The whole plot will then just amount to nothing. All stakes are no longer valid. Just look at how RA3 undoing all of RA2's storyline.

In plot perspective, there's this thing called butterfly effect. Remember how Einstein erased Hitler and thus created an even worse war than actual WW2? And how Cherdenko erased Einstein and created a situation even worse than RA1 and RA2? Yah, no thank you

I thought RA1 was much less bloodier than our WW2? (No Axis Powers and no Holocaust)

RA3 was weird

Have Uragan talk to RA1 or 1885 Einstein. Tell him the truth, pass down all their knowledge and then disappear in front of Einstein

Foehn Revolt is erased from the timeline, they sacrificed their own existence to prevent WW2 AND WW3 (maybe even WW1)

Imagine a young Einstein being told the future and seeing future humans vanishing from time in front of him! He would be Soul-crushed (Uragan, Yunru, Malver and so many others gone as if they never existed)

(Reminds me of a 2000s Justice League episode in which Vandal Savage uses Time-travel. Post-time travel 'Bruce Wayne' tells the unaltered JL to go back and rewrite history, even if it means erasing him from history. This nightmare is so bad this version of Batman wants it to be over)

This version of Einstein uses the knowledge and technology Foehn gives him to avert the many tragedies of the 20th century

Fast-forward several CENTURIES later in another part of the Milky Way Galaxy. Einstein meets a young orphan named Siegfried and adopts him. The End

Edited by Moonreaper666, 09 November 2021 - 05:53 AM.

[Malekron]

In Meta perspective, it's really just something of a slap in the face to the whole storyline. What's the point of everyone's sacrifice if all of that can be undone with but a time machine macguffin? The whole plot will then just amount to nothing. All stakes are no longer valid. Just look at how RA3 undoing all of RA2's storyline.

 

In plot perspective, there's this thing called butterfly effect. Remember how Einstein erased Hitler and thus created an even worse war than actual WW2? And how Cherdenko erased Einstein and created a situation even worse than RA1 and RA2? Yah, no thank you

It would make sense to make the situation worse with each time rewrite. Red Alert's narrative is that time travel is inherently dangerous and unethical even with characters with the "best of intentions".

[Moonreaper666]

In Meta perspective, it's really just something of a slap in the face to the whole storyline. What's the point of everyone's sacrifice if all of that can be undone with but a time machine macguffin? The whole plot will then just amount to nothing. All stakes are no longer valid. Just look at how RA3 undoing all of RA2's storyline.

In plot perspective, there's this thing called butterfly effect. Remember how Einstein erased Hitler and thus created an even worse war than actual WW2? And how Cherdenko erased Einstein and created a situation even worse than RA1 and RA2? Yah, no thank you

It would make sense to make the situation worse with each time rewrite. Red Alert's narrative is that time travel is inherently dangerous and unethical even with characters with the "best of intentions".

How many people died in RA1? It can't be even close to the 60 Million killed in our WW2

RA1 has much more advanced technology than we have in 2021!

Foehn should still use Time-travel but it results in them being erased from the Timeline, in front of RA1 Einstein and Carville's eyes. Siegfried no longer exist due to Butterfly Effect which is another soul-crushing blow for RA1 Einstein

Yunru, Malver, MO Tanya, Morales, Boris, etc also erased

After Foehn uses the Time Machine the Story Ending should be uncertain but hopeful like Gears of War 3 mixed with Space colonization. CENTURIES later, Einstein meets a young child named Siegfried

I wish I can make Foehn Act 3 and Act 4 but I don't have the skills of the MO team. Westwood Studios would be proud of them

[Handepsilon]

Nuclear silo war exists in RA1, didn't it?

[Moonreaper666]

Nuclear silo war exists in RA1, didn't it?

No nukes were used in RA1 compared to Real Life WW2

Plus the death toll of RA1 is much more smaller for several reasons (In our WW2, China lost 10 MILLION alone!!!)

RA2 or RA3 aren't as bloody as Real Life conflicts ongoing in the same time-period

Nigerian Civil War alone (1970s) killed HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of people

It's only MO that has eclipsed Real Life brutality, horror and death toll

[Jay_]

So yes, if only Foehn Revolt were to remain, they could still repopulate Earth multiple times over. There would be also a hidden bonus playing to Foehn's cards and that because its composed from survivors from militiaries and the best of the best, this would serve as a seal of quality of its personal that they are likely to be the best of the best in terms of mental and physical health so nobody can taint the DNA integrity of the new humanity with crippling genetical defects. Such crisis will also remove everyone too reliant on health care...quite the cruel natural selection, but Humanity will carry on.

 

I think the opposite is more accurate, Foehn should be a rather diverse set of different races with different physical prowess as their goal right now is to acquire as many manpower and resources as possible to survive and form a new army, so they couldn't afford to be selective about which soldiers are within their ranks. Their track records of wasting vast amount of manpower despite joining the war much later than other well-established belligerents doesn't bode well with the facts either. Granted most of the incapable elements within their ranks should have been shaved of after the bloodied campaign, but keeping a well-trained but limited army is hardly the way to go considering that the enemy posses a for all intents and purposes unlimited pool of troops, many of them well experienced and all concentrated on one front. 

 

 

-If Foehn goes back to before RA1 they can prevent WW2 and WW3 by eliminating Stalin, Mao, Che Guerra, Romanov and Yuri. Foehn technology allows everyone to have great living standards and deincentivize warfare

 

That to me doesn't necessary correlate. I'm of the similar opinion that wars were and will still be the greatest motivation for rapid expansion of technology development and research effort, but that doesn't translate to an increase in living standard. In war time saw the dramatic rise of military budget at the expense of the government's various civil welfare programs and agencies, thus leaving the people back at home destitute and ironically left to fend for themselves despite supposedly being 'protected' from the ravage of war. The poster child of this phenomenal in contemporary history is the USSR, where it boasted impressive arsenal of military materiel rivals that of the US, but its citizen living standard is less than stellar, with apparent lack of access to high quality food, transports, appliances and entertainments. Their leadership has managed to keep the trainwreck of the economy rolling to the early 90s, despite dwindling growth hampered severely by the Afghan war. But alas every came down when the people became disillusioned by the abysmal future prospect and lack of civil rights. Also the surplus of military equipment brought about many conflicts in the Caucasus and Eastern Europe, with fallout can still be felt today where many region still destabilized due to border and ethnics conflicts and resources. 

 

TLDR; it's a recurring theme in history: too much military is bad. All leaders should peruse history to not walk into the mistakes that their predecessors made which put them in the current position.

Edited by Jay_, 10 November 2021 - 12:11 PM.

[Moonreaper666]

So yes, if only Foehn Revolt were to remain, they could still repopulate Earth multiple times over. There would be also a hidden bonus playing to Foehn's cards and that because its composed from survivors from militiaries and the best of the best, this would serve as a seal of quality of its personal that they are likely to be the best of the best in terms of mental and physical health so nobody can taint the DNA integrity of the new humanity with crippling genetical defects. Such crisis will also remove everyone too reliant on health care...quite the cruel natural selection, but Humanity will carry on.

I think the opposite is more accurate, Foehn should be a rather diverse set of different races with different physical prowess as their goal right now is to acquire as many manpower and resources as possible to survive and form a new army, so they couldn't afford to be selective about which soldiers are within their ranks. Their track records of wasting vast amount of manpower despite joining the war much later than other well-established belligerents doesn't bode well with the facts either. Granted most of the incapable elements within their ranks should have been shaved of after the bloodied campaign, but keeping a well-trained but limited army is hardly the way to go considering that the enemy posses a for all intents and purposes unlimited pool of troops, many of them well experienced and all concentrated on one front.

-If Foehn goes back to before RA1 they can prevent WW2 and WW3 by eliminating Stalin, Mao, Che Guerra, Romanov and Yuri. Foehn technology allows everyone to have great living standards and deincentivize warfare

That to me doesn't necessary correlate. I'm of the similar opinion that wars were and will still be the greatest motivation for rapid expansion of technology development and research effort, but that doesn't translate to an increase in living standard. In war time saw the dramatic rise of military budget at the expense of the government's various civil welfare programs and agencies, thus leaving the people back at home destitute and ironically left to fend for themselves despite supposedly being 'protected' from the ravage of war. The poster child of this phenomenal in contemporary history is the USSR, where it boasted impressive arsenal of military materiel rivals that of the US, but its citizen living standard is less than stellar, with apparent lack of access to high quality food, transports, appliances and entertainments. Their leadership has managed to keep the trainwreck of the economy rolling to the early 90s, despite dwindling growth hampered severely by the Afghan war. But alas every came down when the people became disillusioned by the abysmal future prospect and lack of civil rights. Also the surplus of military equipment brought about many conflicts in the Caucasus and Eastern Europe, with fallout can still be felt today where many region still destabilized due to border and ethnics conflicts and resources.

TLDR; it's a recurring theme in history: too much military is bad. All leaders should peruse history to not walk into the mistakes that their predecessors made which put them in the current position.

There is still no realistic reason Foehn won't use the Time-Machine just once

(Even if it erases Foehn from the Timeline)

If an Epilogue is desired Foehn goes back to 1885 and give their advanced technology and knowledge to a young Albert Einstein. Foehn is erased from the Timeline but ALL THREE WORLD WARS ARE AVERTED!!! Africa and Asia get their Indepence and Prosperity

Act 4 should be Foehn going back either to RA1 or Archetype

-RA1 does more good and easier to assassinate Yuri, Romanov and Mao back then

-Foehn's technology and knowledge of the future allows the RA1 Allies to curbstomp the RA1 Soviets and prevent WW3

-Foehn intervening in Archetype results in both Morales and Boris being captured by the Allies. Not only do Volkov and the Terror Drones stat part of the Allied Arsenal but they also get Foehn tech

-MO Allies can decide to strike right after Archetype or use the 10 years to upgrade their military into Super-Foehn tech

Just have Foehn be erased from the Timeline in exchange for their use of Time-travel. Also have the Mental Omega Heroes not exist due to Butterfly Effect. A small price to pay to save Billions

[Moonreaper666]

Have Act 4 be Foehn going back in time to right before Act 1 and start changing things

As a cost of their use of Time-Travel Foehn is slowly disappearing from the Timeline

First the main Army disappears then the Subfactions then the Foehn Heroes

Main Foehn Army goes to Moscow to capture Romanov and force Russia out of the war (Conqueror Redux)

Last Bastion lead by Uragan should go to China and meet Yunru and the ROC Rebels (Threat of Dread Redux)

Wings of Coronia lead by Eureka should go to Africa to meet Rashid and Scorpion Cell

Hailhead lead by Fin and Alize attack PsiCorps and kill Yuri (Original Mission)

Yunru and Rashid now help the Allies whom have Foehn tech. With Yuri dead and Russia occupied WW3 is going to be an Allied victory

[mrvecz]

You just cannot stop just once, humans are not as good as you think with self control and Foehn isnt exactly composed from morally clean people

1) Rashidi and his merry band of islamic terrorists, Rashidi is an oportunistic man that got burned hard and now he is in Foehn to save his sorry hide from consequences

2) Carwille and rest of USA and Allies, even if they are on the moral high ground in this universe, the temptation of Time machine would corrupt even those who just want to live in a free world, so they can play gods and play history like a flute so THEIR nations are on top and rest can get fucked for being "uncivilized, commies etc...".

3) Yunru could save her parents, stragle Yuri, Proselyte, Soviet Commander, prevent USSR existing and the ball is rolling and it would eventually turn in to fixing wrongs that have nothing to do with China and her, like neutering USA so they dont become a world wide power that profits of wars in the middle east that causes suffering to innocent people, this is a whack a mole and no man or woman on Earth can predict what will happen if they alter reality so much. 

 

Its like with drugs

"Just this once"

And then... you never stop

 

And Time Machine ? Would you personally stop yourself from going back to time to fix wrong doings of yourself, your family or YOUR nation ?

I couldnt

And i have strong doubts anyone could, tough words might come from behind a keyboard, but reality will hit different when its in front of you....

[Handepsilon]

Besides, it's just a big rabbit hole to jump into. It goes too deep and too convoluted. Just look at how Red Alert series turned out. So much messed up plotline because of time machine overuse

[Moonreaper666]

You just cannot stop just once, humans are not as good as you think with self control and Foehn isnt exactly composed from morally clean people
1) Rashidi and his merry band of islamic terrorists, Rashidi is an oportunistic man that got burned hard and now he is in Foehn to save his sorry hide from consequences
2) Carwille and rest of USA and Allies, even if they are on the moral high ground in this universe, the temptation of Time machine would corrupt even those who just want to live in a free world, so they can play gods and play history like a flute so THEIR nations are on top and rest can get fucked for being "uncivilized, commies etc...".
3) Yunru could save her parents, stragle Yuri, Proselyte, Soviet Commander, prevent USSR existing and the ball is rolling and it would eventually turn in to fixing wrongs that have nothing to do with China and her, like neutering USA so they dont become a world wide power that profits of wars in the middle east that causes suffering to innocent people, this is a whack a mole and no man or woman on Earth can predict what will happen if they alter reality so much.

Its like with drugs
"Just this once"
And then... you never stop

And Time Machine ? Would you personally stop yourself from going back to time to fix wrong doings of yourself, your family or YOUR nation ?
I couldnt
And i have strong doubts anyone could, tough words might come from behind a keyboard, but reality will hit different when its in front of you....

Foehn and the Time-Machine could just start disappearing once they are in the past. So they are only available for a few missions then the Allies have to do the rest on their own

[Moonreaper666]

Unless a Holocaust survivor or their disadvantaged descendant or someone else that suffered HORRIFIC EVENTS FOR YEARS ON END says HE/SHE WON'T USE TIME-TRAVEL I can't stop

Gears of War 3 had an uncertain but hopeful ending. Foehn going back in time should be similar

Have Foehn disappear and Time itself change so that Foehn's Time-travel is the last time that it's possible

[Moonreaper666]

Another way is have Einstein secretly build an one-use-only Time-Machine that is incompletely

Wreckage from the Paradox Engine and Mental Omega make it work

Foehn goes back to Act 1 and are slowly disappearing from the Timeline. Time Machine blows up as part of Einstein's fail-safe

Foehn disappears but they help the Allies beat Yuri and the Soviets. Another result of using the Secret Time-Machine is that it prevents future attempts at Time-Travel. Foehn is the last to use Time-Travel

[Moonreaper666]

Another way is to have everyone except the Three Foehn Heroes die at the end of Act 3

Uragan is the last remnant of VOLKNET and sacrifices himself to repair the broken Time-Machine for its LAST USE. Eureka is the only one who repairs the Time-Machine

Eureka maintains her vow of silence so Time-Travel technology is forever lost after Foehn disappears from the Timeline

Act 1 Redux has Allies + Scorpion + Yunru defeat the Soviets and Yuri

[LordDesolator777]

Just a reminder for people critiquing the story of MO and RA1, the whole plot is based around time travel, which is literally impossible. Especially for 1940's tech. The Storyline of RA1 and MO, while cool, is very unrealistic and an alien space bats (ASB) story. I can go into detail if people want. But I think the story is fine as it is. If the devs don't have a plan for Act 3, then fans can make up their own stories. 

[Moonreaper666]

Just a reminder for people critiquing the story of MO and RA1, the whole plot is based around time travel, which is literally impossible. Especially for 1940's tech. The Storyline of RA1 and MO, while cool, is very unrealistic and an alien space bats (ASB) story. I can go into detail if people want. But I think the story is fine as it is. If the devs don't have a plan for Act 3, then fans can make up their own stories.

Act 3 should be divided into two parts:

-First part is Foehn rallying survivors and exterminating Epsilon

-Second part has surviving Foehn go back in time to stop the events of MO. They succeed but Time-travel is forever rendered impossible and Foehn vanishes from the Timeline

The Soviet Commander should have destroyed the Psychic Beacon in awake or alive

[Eggrollz]

I really hope to see an act 3 someday since the game ended with an open ending, I have a feeling that the Foehn is going to end the Epsilon regime one day and restore the free will of the world.

 

Mental Omega is also without any doubt the best mod for YR with a story and missions which are just wow