463 replies to this topic

[Solais]

Well, what I personally think is that there should be more difficulty settings, if possible. I don't want to get rid of the challenge when it is clear that plenty of people are into that, so I think it's better if at least two more difficulties are implemented that are easier than the current Easy. (The new easy being about as easy as original RA2/YR Normal.) This would give a lot more choice to the players and increase the work's overall accessibility. (I hope it is possible. If yes, maybe an even harder difficulty could be also added, like the Impervious difficulty lovasmidas was joking around in the other thread. )

 

Btw, sorry, but if a mission is done by the designer to be played -exactly- like they would play it, then it is faulty by design, because there are as many playing styles as there are people out there. It is something I learned as a level designer myself (but for another game series).

 

But yeah, I feel just like Gameaddict, I love this mod, it is incredible all around, it was made by a super talented team, its lore and story is very interesting, it is fun to play in multiplayer (even Skirmish, at least I can sorta survive Easy AI), but I just can't enjoy the campaign, which is the main course for me. But, beta is beta, so I hope that there'll be fixes thanks to feedback.

[Martinoz]

 

I'm playing on Easy. That means it should be that. Not too easy, but easy enough for the player to not lose the will to play this mod. Which I just did after getting stuck in all the campaigns. I'll try them again and again later, but so far, these campaigns have been anything but fun (with the exception of a few missions).

MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY.
The mod itself looks awesome. The lore is amazing and really interesting and I want to get through the storyline. But the current difficulty "curve" (read: infinitely rising line starting at about ten feet above the line between "impossible and a turn-off from the mod" (top) and "challenging but fun" (bottom)) of the missions makes that impossible.
There may as well not even BE difficulty levels with the way these missions are currently designed, it might as well be just "Mental".
The mission designers themselves, i.e. Speeder, Lovalmidas, RP, Cesare, should provide a walkthrough, showing how THEY would do it, if their missions are as oh so "easy" as some would claim.
Also, a separate "noob edition" download would be nice; like, the mission difficulty is actually "easy", more like the original RA2 and YR.

 

I'm not sure that's even possible to make some missions on Easy even more easier. Probably except Epsilon campaign that is hard by default and requires proper micromanagement with a low error margin. Allied and Soviet campaigns are affordable to complete on the Easy difficulty for sure, you only must learn which surprises were made by the mission developer and when. However changes to the game were made a lot during the beta tests, so missions might be not the same for the mission designer anymore (Hint hint RP).

[delulytric]

Thanks all for the S10-S12 tips. Now I'm lamenting over Epsilon side lol. Human Shield is a bltch especially, gonna give up that mission till the save button comes in (even more luck based than HtF)

[Plasma_Wolf]

 

 

[something about the campaign]

[something about the campaign]

I'm not sure that's even possible to make some missions on Easy even more easier. Probably except Epsilon campaign that is hard by default and requires proper micromanagement with a low error margin. Allied and Soviet campaigns are affordable to complete on the Easy difficulty for sure, you only must learn which surprises were made by the mission developer and when. However changes to the game were made a lot during the beta tests, so missions might be not the same for the mission designer anymore (Hint hint RP).

 

While it is true that some missions are really not material to make even easier - like for instance missions A2 (although the Tesla Coil at the start is nasty), A3 and I would imagine A1 (I quit it when there were still no soviet forces after a minute), some other missions are designed in such a way that they are perhaps not too hard but too annoying and tedious to fit the name "easy" - Mission A10 springs to mind.

 

The big thing about a campaign is that the challenge must of course be included, but you also don't want new or casual players to be discouraged because a mission has to be done in the exact way that the mission author has designed it. If you do the latter, casual players will give up on it.

 

Something else about the campaign: how many missions do we have in which there is no base at all? I always thought of the GDI C&C 1 campaign to be pretty balanced between the missions with and without a base. I have no idea on how it is here because I haven't finished all missions of a single faction (so I don't know if there are any other missions where you have to work your way towards a base - apart from A11), so I'm just wondering. I think the balance between base and baseless missions should be like in the GDI C&C 1 campaign (also in each faction, not just overall).

[Solais]

Actually I wonder how the difficulty settings work in RA2 in general. Does it only affect the AI and specific triggers and flags on the maps, or does it affect stats? Because if stats are affected, that could be balanced that the player's units have more health and better damage, while the enemies are weaker.

 

Also, I think many missions could be made easier using the same method that is already in the game, like removing/adding buildings, units and crates. For instance, I'd add health, armor and speed crates to A04 on Easy, and remove about half of the Tzivils.

 

But I still say that there should be more than 3 difficulties in campaign, IF it is possible to do.

[alexthecat]

Hey, the mission briefings (while inside the mission) need some revisions. There are some errors in the text (missing punctuation and strange '?' marks) 

[lovalmidas]

Something else about the campaign: how many missions do we have in which there is no base at all? I always thought of the GDI C&C 1 campaign to be pretty balanced between the missions with and without a base. I have no idea on how it is here because I haven't finished all missions of a single faction (so I don't know if there are any other missions where you have to work your way towards a base - apart from A11), so I'm just wondering. I think the balance between base and baseless missions should be like in the GDI C&C 1 campaign (also in each faction, not just overall).

 

Here's a long list...

Purely Base-building missions (you start with a base, a single production facility will count as a 'base'):
 
A02: Eagles Fly Free
A03: Road Trippin'
A08: Wrong Side
A12: Sunlight
S04: Side Effect
S09: Road to Nowhere 
S12: Dragonstorm
E04: Shipwrecked

 

Coop A02: Impersonal War

Coop S03: Repentance

Coop S04: Lights Out

Coop S05: Thunder God

Coop E02: Retaliation

Coop E06: Rush Tactics

------
Taskforce to Base-building missions (you start with a taskforce, but will get a base):
 
A01: Red Dawn Rising
A04: Heaven and Hell
A05: Bad Apple
A06: Beautiful Mind
A11: Panic Cycle
S01: Bleed Red
S03: Happy Birthday
S05: Peace Treaty
S07: Idle Gossip
S08: Death from Above
E02: Accelerant

E03: Scrapyard

E07: Think Different

 

Coop A03: Enforcers

Coop A06: Mad Monster

------
Taskforce to Base-building (optional) missions (you start with a taskforce, but can obtain a base. Your choice.):
 
S02: Golden Gate
S11: Unshakeable

E08: Warranty Void
E12: Moonlight (don't try without base though...)

------
Taskforce only missions (you don't expect to get a base):
 
A07: Hammer to Fall
A09: Zero Signal
A10: The Gardener
S06: Recharger
S10: The Lunatic
E01: Peacekeeper
E05: Human Shield

E06: Landlocked
E09: Killing Fields
E10: Focus Shift
E11: Singularity

 

Coop A01: Good Old Times

Coop A05: Butt Royale

Coop S01: Burned Alive

Coop S02: Role Reversal

Coop S06: Ego Ergo Hax

Coop E01: Television Lies

Coop E03: Cornered

Coop E04: Rainmaker

Coop E06: Brain Reset

 

[WhiteDragon25]

To whoever designed the Soviet mission "Unshakeable": FUCK YOU. That goddamn 'mission' is impossible. Let me brake it down:

 

1: First off - that fucking goddamn dog. When trying to accomplish the first objective of infiltrating the Tech Center, I was continually aggravated by that goddamn Attack Dog guarding the Tech Center - which I couldn't see since there was a fucking Gap Generator in the way! After multiple attempts to get around that fucking dog by using the Hijacker as bait (why the hell do have him anyways? Why not just give me two Saboteurs instead of just one?) - which, by the way, took multiple tries - I finally managed to infiltrate that damn Tech Center.

 

2: That goddamn sniper on the cliff. Fucking annoying as hell when I realized that sniper was there picking off my advancing landing forces. But, as annoying as it is, I dealt with it. Doesn't make me feel that much better, though.

 

3: You know what the worst part is? The goddamn objectives changing every five minutes! Before I can even grind my way up to the Allied base, it turns out, the fucking Chinese control the area! So now I have to turn around and grab more reinforcements, and deal with not Japanese, but Chinese forces! Fucking Nuwa Cannons are pain in the ass when you weren't even expecting them there! But, once again, before I could even work my way up to that Allied base again, the objectives change once again, and now I have to deal with a huge-ass "Seismic Stabilizer" piece of crap which is keeping the entire region from erupting into earthquakes! Not even five fucking minutes after completing the first objective, I get three changes in objectives in rapid succession! That's not even enough time to get situated on what the hell is going on! What the fuck!?

 

4: The bullshit with the Siesmic Stabilizer. Goddamn, what a load of bullshit. Seriously, this huge-ass device is keeping the entire area from undergoing instant rock-massage (which isn't how earthquakes work, goddamnit!), but the Chinese are in control of it and set it off to self-destruct, intending to blow up the entire lab complex and me with it. Question: How the fuck am I supposed to fix it when I am a) barely situated with my meager forces in the Allied base, b) the device is surrounded by the fucking Chinese so I can't touch it, and c) the fucking thing's health is counting down like a time bomb with its clock going fast!? Oh, that's not even half of it: when I get a chance to paradrop an Engineer to repair it (on the second third paradrop attempt, since the first two were killed by either Skyray or Terror Drone), the fucking Chinese decide to say "fuck it, let's just blow it up ourselves!", and start attacking it! I can't do a thing about it since I'm still stuck at the Allied base getting my bearings! This is bullshit of the highest order.

 

5: That fucking anonymous informant. Yeah, great help you were. So you knew about the Chinese and the Siesmic Stabilizer, but warned me too late before they set it off to self-destruct. Couldn't you have told my intelligence operatives before we started this whole damn operation!? That would've been real fucking nice to know beforehand! Hell, that parking lot full of Future Tanks that you so kindly pointed out? Why couldn't have you told me about those first, asshole!?

 

Goddamn, this mission was an utter clusterfuck. An agonizingly annoying start-off, three goddamn plot-twists up the wazoo before we even settle in properly, and a giant fucking time bomb which comes out of fucking nowhere which can't be stopped. Who the fuck designed this mission!?

[delulytric]

Unshakable is one of the annoying missions, but nowhere annoying as Singularity and Moonlight. 

 

1. There's only one attack dog. It's a do or die moment, send in your Saboteur into the PF battle lab ASAP. Don't be indecisive and pause and wait for the dog. It usually never bodes well for you.

 

2. The initial landing force should head DOWN instead of towards the Allied base. There's just way too much crap to deal there with your initial landing force. Take down the few units present there and get into the base by swarming enemy and killing them (they have gap generators still, so you can't really wait and lay off one by one when there's an implicit timer)

 

3. Second landing force to reinforce the first. By the 10 minutes mark you should be already building a base around the Seismic Stabilizer. 

 

This requires a little practice, but you could complete these three steps within an hour or so. 

 

Now it's my turn to ask about Singularity. How the hell am I supposed to progress when the barrels doesn't even destroy the Tesla Coil when the elite PsiCorp Trooper makes his debut? Everywhere is just Tesla, Tesla. 

[Asylum]

Actually WhiteDragon25, putting Rashidi in the Stinger should give you a repair vehicle.

Mentioning their importance in the objectives list might be a good idea though.

 

Confirmed... Rashidi in Stinger apparently does not act as a repair unit, it's just a normal Stinger weapon.  (I'm on normal difficulty, though I assume it shouldn't make a difference).  

[WhiteDragon25]

Tried Unshakeable again... and nope still impossible. This time I managed to get to the Stabilizer through the southern path (which was apparently guarded by Zephyrs on the cliff. WTF?), but bum-rushing the defenders is just plain stupid and suicidal. My forces have to fight their way through Terror Drones, Prism Towers, and Qilin Tanks, and my Wolfhounds were taken out by Sentinels, so no air support either.

 

By the time I managed to gain a toehold near the Construction Yard, I'm already down to just my infantry and a few tanks, all of which were heavily damaged by that point. Morales helped a little to get rid of the defenses, such as that annoying Tech Artillery stationed on the cliff above the Future Tank Depot, but I barely got anything done with my newly placed Barracks before the fucking Chinese reinforcements got there. Norio coming to help (which came completely out of nowhere, by the way) did little to actually help things. That Tech Statellite Hack Center I captured earlier ended up destroyed (thus ruining my only real advantage), and I got swarmed by an army of Qilin Tanks and Conscripts, and my Barracks captured by a fucking Engineer.

 

In the end, I only had Norio left to witness his homeland turned to dust while the Chinese blew up the Stabilizer... again.

 

And may I remind you, this is supposed to be on Easy difficulty. Fuck you, Mentalmeisters, you've ruined your own goddamn campaign because you couldn't resist making too goddamn hard for anyone but those as elite and skilled as you are. Goddamn, I think I've lost a year or two of my lifespan thanks to sheer stress because of this...

 

Ugh, maybe I'm being too harsh here, but motherfuck, I don't want to feel like this about Mental Omega. Tone down the goddamn difficulty, please.

[RP.]

You might want to tone down your attitude, WhiteDragon.

[Martinoz]

Tried Unshakeable again... and nope still impossible. This time I managed to get to the Stabilizer through the southern path (which was apparently guarded by Zephyrs on the cliff. WTF?), but bum-rushing the defenders is just plain stupid and suicidal. My forces have to fight their way through Terror Drones, Prism Towers, and Qilin Tanks, and my Wolfhounds were taken out by Sentinels, so no air support either.

 

By the time I managed to gain a toehold near the Construction Yard, I'm already down to just my infantry and a few tanks, all of which were heavily damaged by that point. Morales helped a little to get rid of the defenses, such as that annoying Tech Artillery stationed on the cliff above the Future Tank Depot, but I barely got anything done with my newly placed Barracks before the fucking Chinese reinforcements got there. Norio coming to help (which came completely out of nowhere, by the way) did little to actually help things. That Tech Statellite Hack Center I captured earlier ended up destroyed (thus ruining my only real advantage), and I got swarmed by an army of Qilin Tanks and Conscripts, and my Barracks captured by a fucking Engineer.

 

In the end, I only had Norio left to witness his homeland turned to dust while the Chinese blew up the Stabilizer... again.

 

And may I remind you, this is supposed to be on Easy difficulty. Fuck you, Mentalmeisters, you've ruined your own goddamn campaign because you couldn't resist making too goddamn hard for anyone but those as elite and skilled as you are. Goddamn, I think I've lost a year or two of my lifespan thanks to sheer stress because of this...

 

Ugh, maybe I'm being too harsh here, but motherfuck, I don't want to feel like this about Mental Omega. Tone down the goddamn difficulty, please.

Jesus, your attitude and whining skill suck so much...

[WhiteDragon25]

You might want to tone down your attitude, WhiteDragon.

 

Jesus, your attitude and whining skill suck so much...

 

Argh, I apologize. Sheer rage and frustration does that to me. Having to repeat a level over and over again while never getting farther on it, only to fail miserably at the end of it, and all of it supposedly on Easy mode, it just grinds at my patience badly. Plus I was already having a crappy day, so that just made things worse. I do not take repeated failure well.

 

I apologize for the insulting tone I've given off during that rant. Especially the last part. You guys have made a great mod, and the campaign, despite its grueling cruelty in its difficulty, is certainly logically and thematically more coherent than the original RA2 & YR campaigns were (though they were still fun).

[Zenothist]

The campaigns have always been made with players who have previously played the original Red Alert 2 and Yuri's Revenge in mind. This of course means that the missions will be more challenging in general because we already assume you have a basic understanding of how the game works. 

 

Personally, I may not be the most skilled player when it comes to online, but I find the missions challenging, but winnable, at least on Easy. It is indeed frustrating that you have to start all over again when you screw up, but I'd say that it will be a thing of the past when saving and loading is re-enabled.

 

If you're really having trouble with the missions, I'd suggest checking out sandbox mode. Ares allows players to play on a skirmish map without other players or AI. An understanding of which units work best in which situations can really help out in missions and multiplayer.

 

Otherwise, several people are recording their runs of the missions, such as Martinoz and UprisingJC. Perhaps they will give you some new insights.

 

If all else fails, we still have plans for a more in-depth tutorial knocking around. 

[Martinoz]

If all else fails, we still have plans for a more in-depth tutorial knocking around. 

Or wait for a new beta revision, some missions will be tweaked for sure - especially those bugged like Heaven & Hell or Side Effect. Some will be even more changed in a drastic way I hope.

Edited by Martinoz, 12 December 2013 - 09:54 AM.

[Zenothist]

Yes, a new patch will be available next year.

[X1Destroy]

And yet people who played the original YR campaign on Brutal difficulty many times before still can't beat some of the missions here on easy.

Too much shitty commando missions. Some of them would have probably beatable, if we have map hack from the start. But I doubt this would ever happen.

So far, the missions I enjoy the most was always A1, A3, A12 S4. Those are the real fun, challenging missions with lots of potential.

Everything else is either a freaking micro, hotkeying fest or a rush with time limits. Ridiculous one like Panic Cycle and the where you have to escort the Battlefortress while being swarmed by a huge army of tanks and desolators is one of the worst ever.

Call that a skirmish with pre-built base maps boring or anything as you want, but it's always better than those path-finding ones.

Edited by X1Destroy, 12 December 2013 - 11:03 AM.

[Martinoz]

And yet people who played the original YR campaign on Brutal difficulty many times before still can't beat some of the missions here on easy.

Too much shitty commando missions. Some of them would have probably beatable, if we have map hack from the start. But I doubt this would ever happen.

So far, the missions I enjoy the most was always A1, A3, A12 S4. Those are the real fun, challenging missions with lots of potential.

Everything else is either a freaking micro, hotkeying fest or a rush with time limits. Ridiculous one like Panic Cycle and the where you have to escort the Battlefortress while being swarmed by a huge army of tanks and desolators is one of the worst ever.

Call that a skirmish with pre-built base maps boring or anything as you want, but it's always better than those path-finding ones.

Convoy part of Panic Cycle is now really easy, can't imagine how it's "hard" - it's only hard for those who can't group and use units properly.

[X1Destroy]

Sometimes, the BF just go away by itself while my force are busy fighting and got blasted by a buch of paradrop tesla troopers.

If only it was controllable.

Edited by X1Destroy, 12 December 2013 - 11:44 AM.