5129 replies to this topic

[Divine]

 

So Zorbfloater became a tanker (and lifting units) without any capability of killing.

 

Why bother with them at all then? Lifting units is a cool feature but it is difficult to utilize (and you can accidentally drop a unit on your own infantry), and is not as dangerous as decimating infantry blobs with ease. You try to kill tankers because they pose a threat, not because they have a lot of HP, and ability to lift vehicles is not that much of a threat.

 

Lifting a unit effectively takes it out of combat, if only temporarily. With enough floaters and some micro, you can disable the bulk of an enemy tank force. There's a reason this feature was removed from the Magnetron (this, and that it's even more OP with mind control). Occasionally dropping the enemy vehicle in water or on top of another enemy is just the top of the iceberg.

[CLAlstar]

You are forgetting the fact that beside that Magnetron was a siege unit and the range for which it could lift units was way bigger than zorbfloaters.

 

Im still wondering why people are not complaining about viruses, which basicly do the same and are way more accessable.

[Damfoos]

Viruses are much slower and can't outheal a shitton of damage, while their own damage is lower and not instant. They also have slower rate of fire and require additional building to be available. I'd rather compare Zorbs with Riot Troopers, but those are slower and don't have rapid self-healing either.

[X1Destroy]

Lifted masterminds, terror drones accidentally dropped close to floaters......

There goes 5000 bucks.

[Bernadiroe]

Hmm... is it possible to redirect any damage that would otherwise inflicted on friendly infantry/units onto one unit?

 

If possible, then my idea of making Zorbfloater a tank could be useful if they have this kind of power.

They will have a radius around them (like FinAlize) in which any units/infantries inside it will have their received damage negated and redirected to the Zorbfloater.

 

Of course, if there are multiple Zorbfloaters overlapping their own radius, they all will get damaged equally (as if the damage source become multiplied).

And overlapped Zorbfloaters won't be counted for re-redirected damage from other Zorbfloaters.

 

Ex:

 

3 Zorbfloaters overlapped each other, Floater A covers infantries X Y Z, Floater B covers infantries W X Y Z, Floater C covers infantries Y Z and units K L M N.

Infantry X Y Z being attacked by conscripts, Infantry Y Z being attacked by mantis tanks, units M N being attacked by abrams tanks, Floater B being attacked by a GGI.

 

Floater A will take 3*conscript damage + 2*mantis tank damage

Floater B will take 2*mantis tank damage + 1*GGI damage + 3*conscript damage

Floater C will take 2*mantis tank damage + 2*abrams tank damage + 2*conscript damage

 

Also instantaneous death like from chrono weapons will also be redirected, so the Zorbfloater will got chronoshifted instead.

Edited by Bernadiroe, 15 March 2017 - 04:54 PM.

[yunru the gundealer]

just a fast idea, why don't we have more colors to play as? i mean, the colors are clearly there and heck, would be kinda nice for making fancy screenshots

[TeslaCruiser]

You are forgetting the fact that beside that Magnetron was a siege unit and the range for which it could lift units was way bigger than zorbfloaters.

 

Im still wondering why people are not complaining about viruses, which basicly do the same and are way more accessable.

I think viruses power only become evident in an epsilon mirror since epsilon relies on infantry much more than soviets or allies, and foehn infantry is strong enough to take viruses shots. Zorbfloater regeneration ability, on the other hand, means you will not be able to use infantry to fight those coronian planes.

 

 

Edit was talking the whole time about Zorbfloater xD

Also on their description, it is said they can lift lighter vehicles but they can lift a Nuwa Cannon o_o

Edited by TeslaCruiser, 15 March 2017 - 05:16 PM.

[Bernadiroe]

just a fast idea, why don't we have more colors to play as? i mean, the colors are clearly there and heck, would be kinda nice for making fancy screenshots

 

How about a color wheel to freely choose any color?

[yunru the gundealer]

 

just a fast idea, why don't we have more colors to play as? i mean, the colors are clearly there and heck, would be kinda nice for making fancy screenshots

 

How about a color wheel to freely choose any color?

 

that would be a lot harder to pull off (at least from what little i know of modding) but i do know at least adding new colors work, maybe the client could add the colors to wherever the colors go? but that could be a pain to code *shrug*

[siegelad]

 

 

just a fast idea, why don't we have more colors to play as? i mean, the colors are clearly there and heck, would be kinda nice for making fancy screenshots

 

How about a color wheel to freely choose any color?

 

that would be a lot harder to pull off (at least from what little i know of modding) but i do know at least adding new colors work, maybe the client could add the colors to wherever the colors go? but that could be a pain to code *shrug*

 

A color wheel sounds nice, as long as there's an option to have a HSV <-> RGB values, but just like Speeder said, there's a problem with a few colors since you can't see the superweapons timer text with them.

[jackomatt]

Sorry for the late response, I didn't notice your reply., but...

 

Repair crane needs a big nerf. They can repair literally anything except infantries: tanks, walkers, choppers, blimps and even planes! They are breaking the balance in the airforce! Both the repair vehicles and the new backwarp can't be repair planes but why repair cranes can?

Because it's a crane..? It surely can reach airborne units to do repairs.

 

Not really need nerf... And it's not like your Foxtrots not auto-heal when docking. I myself never even actually build Repair Crane.

And seems so far only you brought up a complain about Repair Crane..? (Which means the majority of other players don't feel the same way)

 

Because they haven't yet discover this functionality or they underestimated its potential. The problem becomes sever when allies and soviets are in the same team. Consider this situation: A previous barracuda raid demolished enemy ConYard, yet their Airforce HQ and War Factory is still online. In order to fully neturalize the enemy, you may want to order a subsequent attack on WF or airbase. However, enemy AA defense left your barracuda all red/yellow health, which take really a long time to repair, leaving your enemy enough time to build a MCV. Your bombers won't reach their targets before they are shot down. However, if your ally supply you a repair crane, the bombers will be fully repaired even before their first missile finished loading, thus you can commence bombardment right when they are fully reloaded, most possibly winning the game.

[Bernadiroe]

Because they haven't yet discover this functionality or they underestimated its potential. The problem becomes sever when allies and soviets are in the same team. Consider this situation: A previous barracuda raid demolished enemy ConYard, yet their Airforce HQ and War Factory is still online. In order to fully neturalize the enemy, you may want to order a subsequent attack on WF or airbase. However, enemy AA defense left your barracuda all red/yellow health, which take really a long time to repair, leaving your enemy enough time to build a MCV. Your bombers won't reach their targets before they are shot down. However, if your ally supply you a repair crane, the bombers will be fully repaired even before their first missile finished loading, thus you can commence bombardment right when they are fully reloaded, most possibly winning the game.

 

If by that scenario the victim don't attack back the bombers with support power or another bombers, or even letting your enemy to create that many bombers which can just bypass your AA defenses, then that's the victim's fault I think. For not paying attention to the enemy air armada. You can (if checked on the option) convert the CY to MCV to prevent CY annihilation.

If CY is not the target, you can just sell away the important building (forcing the bombers to go idle for a moment, making them target for your AA defenses)

 

Bombers cost alot of money and they have paper-thin armor. Not sure if a base would go building alot of bombers and neglecting ground forces to counter land assaults.

If a base has good enough AA defenses, enemy sending bombers can lose alot of them in one go, and ore patches never regrow that fast to recover the loss.

 

Anyway, now that the secret (according to you) is out, let's see if many players will abuse this or not. And if there're more complaints regarding this.

Edited by Bernadiroe, 16 March 2017 - 01:24 PM.

[Battle Bee]

Sorry for the late response, I didn't notice your reply., but...

 

Repair crane needs a big nerf. They can repair literally anything except infantries: tanks, walkers, choppers, blimps and even planes! They are breaking the balance in the airforce! Both the repair vehicles and the new backwarp can't be repair planes but why repair cranes can?

Because it's a crane..? It surely can reach airborne units to do repairs.

 

Not really need nerf... And it's not like your Foxtrots not auto-heal when docking. I myself never even actually build Repair Crane.

And seems so far only you brought up a complain about Repair Crane..? (Which means the majority of other players don't feel the same way)

 

Because they haven't yet discover this functionality or they underestimated its potential. The problem becomes sever when allies and soviets are in the same team. Consider this situation: A previous barracuda raid demolished enemy ConYard, yet their Airforce HQ and War Factory is still online. In order to fully neturalize the enemy, you may want to order a subsequent attack on WF or airbase. However, enemy AA defense left your barracuda all red/yellow health, which take really a long time to repair, leaving your enemy enough time to build a MCV. Your bombers won't reach their targets before they are shot down. However, if your ally supply you a repair crane, the bombers will be fully repaired even before their first missile finished loading, thus you can commence bombardment right when they are fully reloaded, most possibly winning the game.

That's not overpowered. That's just a good play.

[jackomatt]

TL;DR: The underlined part below.
 

If by that scenario the victim don't attack back the bombers with support power or another bombers, or even letting your enemy to create that many bombers which can just bypass your AA defenses, then that's the victim's fault I think. For not paying attention to the enemy air armada. You can (if checked on the option) convert the CY to MCV to prevent CY annihilation.
If CY is not the target, you can just sell away the important building (forcing the bombers to go idle for a moment, making them target for your AA defenses)
 
Bombers cost alot of money and they have paper-thin armor. Not sure if a base would go building alot of bombers and neglecting ground forces to counter land assaults.
If a base has good enough AA defenses, enemy sending bombers can lose alot of them in one go, and ore patches never regrow that fast to recover the loss.
 
Anyway, now that the secret (according to you) is out, let's see if many players will abuse this or not. And if there're more complaints regarding this.

They could just turtle and let their ally help defend and distract (hard to do and need some coordination though). In the case I listed above, the victim was chatting with his teammate, and was unaware of the sudden airstrike at all and the airbase is under gap generator. While this seems somewhat ridiculous and unreplicatable, distract by ground assult is absolutely possible.
 
BTW, I don't mean that only when soviet and allies are in the same team is this trick effective. Dust devil, which is barely used, is often more than severly damaged when firing on Archer blobs, rendering them single use smoke bomber, unless the player decide to wait quite a long time to do another smoke bombing run. It should also be mentioned that foxtrot may also have such problem. Generally, cranes make it possible to engage enemy where there are light to medium AA around, which is something players (at least me and my friends) would rather avoid, should there be no crane.

 

If you still think my words doesn't sound good, just ask yourself this: If one day mentalmeisters allow repair veichicles to repair air planes, are you going to build one dedicated to repair planes? (A repair crane worth only 33% more expensive than a repair IFV.)

 

 
EDIT: After thinking twice, I found the repair crane a bit more balanced than I thought. It's T3 technology and can't be deployed early when the enemy has light to medium AA around, unless the opponent play as allies. As the game proceed, the chance of crane becoming useful continues to drop, unless it's 3v3 or 4v4.

Edited by jackomatt, 16 March 2017 - 03:23 PM.

[Lasombra]

If by that scenario the victim don't attack back the bombers with support power or another bombers, or even letting your enemy to create that many bombers which can just bypass your AA defenses, then that's the victim's fault I think. For not paying attention to the enemy air armada. You can (if checked on the option) convert the CY to MCV to prevent CY annihilation.
If CY is not the target, you can just sell away the important building (forcing the bombers to go idle for a moment, making them target for your AA defenses)

Bombers cost alot of money and they have paper-thin armor. Not sure if a base would go building alot of bombers and neglecting ground forces to counter land assaults.
If a base has good enough AA defenses, enemy sending bombers can lose alot of them in one go, and ore patches never regrow that fast to recover the loss.

Anyway, now that the secret (according to you) is out, let's see if many players will abuse this or not. And if there're more complaints regarding this.

What about Repair Drones/IFVs/whatever? Can they repair docked aircraft? If they do, the entire complaint about the Crane becomes pointless, since these units are available much earlier.

[SPCell]

I have a following suggestion for the game: how about making a "Soviet PsiCorps" feature which players can tick in skirmish and multiplayer? This feature will give Soviet factions an access to PsiCorps technologies (PsiCorps trooper, Giant Squid and other units and buildings from RA2 which Soviets lost in YR) just like in vanilla RA2.

[Wayward Winds]

 

If by that scenario the victim don't attack back the bombers with support power or another bombers, or even letting your enemy to create that many bombers which can just bypass your AA defenses, then that's the victim's fault I think. For not paying attention to the enemy air armada. You can (if checked on the option) convert the CY to MCV to prevent CY annihilation.
If CY is not the target, you can just sell away the important building (forcing the bombers to go idle for a moment, making them target for your AA defenses)

Bombers cost alot of money and they have paper-thin armor. Not sure if a base would go building alot of bombers and neglecting ground forces to counter land assaults.
If a base has good enough AA defenses, enemy sending bombers can lose alot of them in one go, and ore patches never regrow that fast to recover the loss.

Anyway, now that the secret (according to you) is out, let's see if many players will abuse this or not. And if there're more complaints regarding this.

What about Repair Drones/IFVs/whatever? Can they repair docked aircraft? If they do, the entire complaint about the Crane becomes pointless, since these units are available much earlier.

 

 

Nope, can't touch 'em.  You can't order them to, nor will they do any auto repairs if you order them next to the airstrip.

[Bernadiroe]

They could just turtle and let their ally help defend and distract (hard to do and need some coordination though). In the case I listed above, the victim was chatting with his teammate, and was unaware of the sudden airstrike at all and the airbase is under gap generator. While this seems somewhat ridiculous and unreplicatable, distract by ground assult is absolutely possible.

 
BTW, I don't mean that only when soviet and allies are in the same team is this trick effective. Dust devil, which is barely used, is often more than severly damaged when firing on Archer blobs, rendering them single use smoke bomber, unless the player decide to wait quite a long time to do another smoke bombing run. It should also be mentioned that foxtrot may also have such problem. Generally, cranes make it possible to engage enemy where there are light to medium AA around, which is something players (at least me and my friends) would rather avoid, should there be no crane.

 

If you still think my words doesn't sound good, just ask yourself this: If one day mentalmeisters allow repair veichicles to repair air planes, are you going to build one dedicated to repair planes? (A repair crane worth only 33% more expensive than a repair IFV.)

 

 
EDIT: After thinking twice, I found the repair crane a bit more balanced than I thought. It's T3 technology and can't be deployed early when the enemy has light to medium AA around, unless the opponent play as allies. As the game proceed, the chance of crane becoming useful continues to drop, unless it's 3v3 or 4v4.

 

1. "victim was chatting", victim's fault, not their enemy. They're in the middle of battle. (it's as if someone with obesity blaming the fatty foods for making them obese)

2. "under gap generator", good play on the enemy.

3. "turtle and let ally help defend", the ally will have a hard time micromanaging (unless it's Alstar) defending both base and thus can't fully defend against full assault on both base.

 

If one day mentalmeister allow repair IFV/drone/stinger/minermite to repair docked planes, then of course I would put one or two if I do built air units.

But if this turned out to be imbalanced in the majority of multiplayer games, then they would change it again.

 

For now, your complain about the crane is still in minority, and thus not really require balancing. Unless every player experiencing same kind of tech abuse, then it won't be patched I presume.

Ex: The foxtrot problem was major, and thus got patched.

[jackomatt]

3. "turtle and let ally help defend", the ally will have a hard time micromanaging (unless it's Alstar) defending both base and thus can't fully defend against full assault on both base.

Just mentioning, in some map there are only 2 attack routes, unless the player is focusing on air attack, thus defending is purely not that hard.

For now, your complain about the crane is still in minority, and thus not really require balancing. Unless every player experiencing same kind of tech abuse, then it won't be patched I presume.

Ex: The foxtrot problem was major, and thus got patched.

Yeah, let's wait and see if anyone else come to complain. (I bet there will be none)

[Magma1Lord]

A suggestion for the Tank bunker. Make it possible that your allies can use them.