873 replies to this topic

[Nazgûl]

Hey man, i've just starting reading through the huge PDF of this mod, and i can truthfully i am very impressed and excited about trying it out, but before i do i have a few questions.

Will you be adding any new buildings/units/heroes etc to the WOTR gamemode? because if not, then that would be a suggestion i have for BETA V.
> WOTR is lowest of all low priorities, simply cause
1) I don't like WOTR
2) It's "hard coded" compared to normal game (at least for me)
3) We have a million other things to finish first, like a streamlined SEE campaign

And how big is the balrog, is he really huge now? Or the same size?
> Since I never saw the Balrog as small, he's the same size. Do you find him huge in the movie? I think the size in game is pretty much accurate. =)

Thanks in advance, once i play it through i'll provide some more ideas, im good with ideas lol =D

Can u see my above post? If not i'll re do it.
> I can see it, as you can see

In addtion to that suggestion, i was looking over all the stuff ur on the "to do" list thread and some things i dont understand your doing:

Adapt "Scenery Maps" commandsets to the mod (Rivendell, Helm's Deep, Minas Tirith...)

what does this mean? Does it mean your going to make it so walls and stuff are able to be built in fortress maps? Because thats something i reckon would be awesome! i've always wanted for that.
> It means that in Beta IV you can't play Scenery maps with SEE functions (like additional units and whatnot) since those maps uses commandsets of their own. These have now been adjusted to include things like The Grond even at Minas Tirith (where it really should be)

And what will the "library" do, are you going to add any more buildings?
> I beleive you can find all info on those in the Library thread Additional buildings are accounted for somewhere too, but I understand it's a bit much to take in at once (and also find info on). Short summary: Hobbit House (Elves), Dale Barracks (Dwarves), Dwarven Mine (Dwarves, off course), Dunland Tent (Isengard), Rohan Golden Hall + Stables + Archery Range + Armory + Statue + Well + Towers (MotW), Moria Warg Cave (Goblins)... those are all I can remember atm =p

And for the the CAH, any plans to make the cosmetic changes of armour and weapons etc have an actual effect on the hero, each with it's own advantages and disadvantages? I reckon that would be cool.
> It would be cool indeed, but if we did that... first of all it would be painstaking work... and worst of all - it would mean that we would have to do it for ALL weapon models in the whole game. Our Gorgoroth Orcs have several different weapons for instance and that's something that would have to be adjusted too in that case, for consistancy. If I do something, I wanna go all the way, or no way at all. And that way is just faaar too long, sorry :/ I guess you understand =) What I can tell you though is that the cosmetic part is most likely going to be developed and extended by a "team" of the best modders from T3A, including Nertea. Letäs hope they make it, and that mods like SEE can benefit from it

Finally since i'm fairly new to the game, can you unlock more stuff to put on your CAH heros in the normal BFME2 game or not?
> More stuff? Compared to...? I guess you mean if SEE have new CaH stuff? Model-wise we don't, but Coding-wise SEE plays CaH much better that original game...
1) CaH Trolls have kockback. They don't in retail version which just looks stupid.
2) CaH are more balanced, and no longer SUPER heroes that can kill 250 enemies alone.
Concerning models and details for CaH, see previous answer ^ =)

Thanks in advance, and brilliant mod!
> Thank you, and welcome to the forums

[†TYRANICK†™]

Thanks for replying =]

So no plans to make walls and fortess's buildable in fortress maps (isengard, rivendail and other base maps? would be so cool *hint* lol)

Also what i mean is for CAH, you know you have about, 4 different helmets to choose from? Or 4 different shields to choose from? What i was wondering is in the normal game (bfme2, not ur mod) can you get any more of these, to customize your charater more? Or are the ones you get, the only ones you get, as in there are no other additions you can unlock for CAH?

Btw i aint actually seen balrog in the game yet so i dunno yet lol xD.

=O!! good and evil campaign mode fully useable with SEE?! WOW...cant wait for that, it will be so awesome, i can imagine it now...endless enemy armys with insanely large fortified bases of evil (and good) swamping you with endless, relentless waves of units hehe, and all tied around through the story...nice! i hope you get that sorted good

(On a side note...can you have brutal mode for campaign? that would be cool for some of us elite players hehe)

As for WOTR, I aint played it properly yet so i cant really agree or disagree with you yet lol, i'll try it laterz

Oh and your welcome

[Sûlherokhh]

When you see the AI use the Balrog in 4.5 (and you will), you'll wish you hadn't asked.

I noticed something about Aragorn as well. What is that leadership he has at 10? Is that like 50% armor to damage to Heroes cloest to him? But That's cool that he has that though, I never actually would of thought of that, but good addition to him.

Read the Button Description when you get him to level 10.

[Gothmog14]

Okay some more suggestions from me, hopefully not so time consuming ones this time around:

- Make the Mûmakil Pen bigger, it looks kind of weird now (plus it would make sense to have more important buildings take up more space which could of been used for smaller, less important buildings... sort of).

- The Watcher right now is useless except for the summoning. You should make it (him?) do some serious damage to buildings (so he actually has a purpose) and one hit all units (because when the get knocked back you can just bring them away and kill it with of archers, so you don't even loose any units).

- Increase the range of the final fortress upgrade powers. Don't know why, I just thought something like the Mighty Catapult should be used to assault enemy buildings, and it kind of hard hitting enemy units with them since there always on the move.

And I would like to ask a question about one of my previous suggestions (I don't really want to make a new topic, and this should be very simple for one of you modders), couldn't I just move the folder with the 2D Palantir art from my BFME1 game into BFMEII and have the still frame type Palantir images for whatever units/buidlings/heroes have been brought over? Sorry if it is rude asking this here, hope these suggestions aren't as time consumingly difficult to implement as my others ones.

[Nazgûl]

Okay some more suggestions from me, hopefully not so time consuming ones this time around:

- Make the Mûmakil Pen bigger, it looks kind of weird now (plus it would make sense to have more important buildings take up more space which could of been used for smaller, less important buildings... sort of).
> It will be bigger, for Beta V.

- The Watcher right now is useless except for the summoning. You should make it (him?) do some serious damage to buildings (so he actually has a purpose) and one hit all units (because when the get knocked back you can just bring them away and kill it with of archers, so you don't even loose any units).
> I agree... the Watcher needs to be worked over for Beta V.

- Increase the range of the final fortress upgrade powers. Don't know why, I just thought something like the Mighty Catapult should be used to assault enemy buildings, and it kind of hard hitting enemy units with them since there always on the move.
> Nah... This has been up before, and I don't wanna turn this game into a matter of who reaches fortress weapon status first. Those are for massive defence, not base attacking. Besides, it would be insanely unfair to the factions that don't have a fortress weapon. =p

And I would like to ask a question about one of my previous suggestions (I don't really want to make a new topic, and this should be very simple for one of you modders), couldn't I just move the folder with the 2D Palantir art from my BFME1 game into BFMEII and have the still frame type Palantir images for whatever units/buidlings/heroes have been brought over? Sorry if it is rude asking this here, hope these suggestions aren't as time consumingly difficult to implement as my others ones.
> No you can't, sorry. The names are different and most are unique to this mod alone (all added units for instance that are not in original game or BFME1 either for that matter). You could spend some days replacing them by hand, using all the modding tools we use, and update the asset and everything, but: 1) It will make your SEE version not playable online and 3) We won't give support for any modded versions of SEE what so ever... =p

[†TYRANICK†™]

Sorry for the length in advance lol


Just played a game with mordor yesturday and a fortress map (w00t walls!!!) and wow was it awesome, great fun building up ur army then swamping them (havent tried the base powers in ur mod yet since fortress maps dont av them)

Some things i noticed and had ideas for while playing:

--1st of the mordor gates animation, lol very interesting the way it interflips opposite sides to open, i take it thats gonna be fixed hehe

--How about some mordor wall powers (as well as some for other races) for example maybe...doesnt really fit with the film but...a big hammer to scatter infantry with? or something like that, or some kind of upgrade for the walls, for example barbed wire or something, melee attacks againt the walls cause some damage to the unit attacking + increases health/armor of wall segments

**there seems to be a large health different in the hubs and the segments, maybe tone down or up?**

Or somthing like that.

--Maybe increase the build time of units a little bit more, maybe cut by 10-15 seconds or so on "lower tech" units etc

--And maybe something very hard or impossible to do, but dam it would be cool...ok the fireball attack for the fortress on mordor...how about an upgrade for it to a meteor!! (costly obviously, long recharge, and long buy time) ok basically it will act like the fire ball, except as the eye lights up on the fortress, it goes straight up into the air (to simulate a "calling" for it?) as its happening, a little circular shadow will appear as where you summoned it, and grow in size and width (to simulate it getting closer to the ground) and as it comes in, to save work i guess you could make it so it spawns the fireball just so you can see it on ur screen but drops vary fast to simulate the speed obviously, and as it hits the radius is maybe 5x that of the fireball blast damage, causing a massive screen shake, a "fear" effect that stretches across 8x the radius (from the centre, as u would be shit scared lol) maybe a small earthquake effect, with maybe a temporary crator? (or permanent, is it possible to morph terrian in game?) and maybe a trail of dust/fire simulated to look like its fallen from above (dissapears after a while to avoid lag) and finally massively scorches the area (so best used in forest like area?) and of couse a kick ass sound effect lol.

LOL ok that ^ probably sounds ludicrously hard, ive tried to explain it simply and to make it seem possible but after all i guess it's down to ur teams abilities, but from the looks of it it doesnt seem to hard, added effects, added coordinates, and maybe some small modification of the existing fireball code. (only useable once for balance maybe)

On a side note it sound massively over powerfull doesnt it? So on second though i wa thinking of making it replace the fireball (next to balrog) in the "powers" menu, maybe making it cost 40 or 50 points, and can only be used once, as it could probably level 95% of a large base an seriously cripple a fortress (not destroy obviously) but the down side to that is you could do it anywhere...at least if it was a fortress power it would have a limited range maybe. (but i guess you would need to add fortress powers or a "points" power as i call it, of similar effect to other races.

Sorry for the length, but in my eyes it would be fantastic eye candy =D

[Nazgûl]

- Gate anims are just as non-finished as the walls in general... We will have fully functional original EA Modor walls though, donated from Robnkarla of the RJ-RotWK mod for Beta 4.5. These will have all the standard upgrades that comes with them (arrow towers + catapults) and as overall upgrade, they will carry Morgul glow =) Hopefully the gate anim will be fixed as well. Hubs are much more powerful than walls due to their thickness.

- The meteor thing would be too similar to other attacks such as Rain of Fire and Barrage and the Mordor Fortress Weapon AND it would be too powerful.

[†TYRANICK†™]

*removed quote* You don't have to quote something that is directly above your reply. It just makes your posts longer... /Naz

Thats why i was saying to replace 1 of those, or as an upgrade.

I just find in games that have meteor like attacks, they arent very visually impressive, you dont get the feeling of them impacting the ground as you would expect the word "meteor", to be a big ass rock from the heavens lol

Ok i admit it would be to powerful, so maybe just a modification to the fireball to make it more "impressive looking", it wouldnt really be similar, it would be unique because its just 1 big huge rock lol.

But meh, as u said its your mod =P

So what about upgrades for wall segments for all sides?

Edited by Nazgûl, 18 September 2007 - 05:39 PM.

[Nazgûl]

- Have you really watched the FX from the Rain of Fire? I find it pretty awesome enough...

- As far as upgrades go, I just told you that we'll have Arrow Towers, Catapults and Morgul Glow for Mordor? =p Elves might get Arrow Towers for later versions but Moria will stay fence only - maybe with a strenghtening upgrade though...

[thedrizzle]

*moved here from Gameplay Discussions & Tactics* /Naz

first of all this mod is great.

i agree that although unit build times are slow for a reason i still think mordors build times are way to slow and should be sped up (if even a fraction) to give more realism to mass quantities of orcs.
Also i was wondering if it was possible to put shields on easterlings, towerguard, and goblin warriors to make the units look more complete. (+ goblins have awesome sheilds).

I think mordor should be given a calvary unit. for instance easterling riders. (it gives easterlings a bit more reason to even be part of mordor.)

Lastly i think dwarven bezerkers should be taken out and replaced with khazad guards. it will give dwarves that uber equiped unit and feels more like dwarves than bezerkers do.

Edited by Nazgûl, 19 September 2007 - 02:20 AM.

[Rhodin]

Easterlings will not be a part of Mordor for long. The plan is to add a new faction, that will contain all things Harad, Rhûn and Khand. A new beta is on it's way, and the Evil Men faction is planned for the beta after that!

Edited by Rhodin, 19 September 2007 - 12:19 AM.

[Nazgûl]

What Rhodin said =) + this:

first of all this mod is great.
> Thank you!

i agree that although unit build times are slow for a reason i still think mordors build times are way to slow and should be sped up (if even a fraction) to give more realism to mass quantities of orcs.
< Mordors units have same speed as other factions... 120 secs for each horde, unless it's a "spam" horde or elite horde. Those could be shorter or longer... But, for Beta 4.5 (next rel) we have added the BFME1 spell "Call the Horde", where black magic causes the orcs to rush out with 0 buildtime for a while

Also i was wondering if it was possible to put shields on easterlings, towerguard, and goblin warriors to make the units look more complete. (+ goblins have awesome sheilds).
> Hehe, when EvilMen faction is added for Beta V (5) the Rhûn units (Easterlings) will have units with and without shields. Goblin Warriors have shields added in Beta 4.5, and yes they are awesome "TowerGuards" have been renamed into their proper name "Fountain Guards" and they don't have shields in the movies, so they won't have shields in SEE either

I think mordor should be given a calvary unit. for instance easterling riders. (it gives easterlings a bit more reason to even be part of mordor.)
> We will have Rhûn Cavalry for EvilMen - a heavy cavalry unit that will be almost as strong as Gondor Knights, but slightly faster =) Mordor won't have any cavalry though, which will make their strenght focus on other things such as numbers and sheer power

Lastly i think dwarven bezerkers should be taken out and replaced with khazad guards. it will give dwarves that uber equiped unit and feels more like dwarves than bezerkers do.
> Dwarven Berserkers will stay, but might be renamed into veterans. The Khazad Guard is already added and using deleicious skins by our freelance-skinner, mr Eldarion

[HanSolo]

I asked about this earlier but I think it got buried by something more important, but would it take much to be able to connect a wall expansion to an ally's wall hub? Naz you said you spent a lot of time on the walls so I am not trying to create a lot of work I am just wondering if it's feasible. That is the one thing all of my friends which play have asked me about, cause it's kind of annoying to have a hole if you build walls out to each other and can't connect to the wall hub. I can't believe EA didn't do that in the first place.

One more thing, I think it was discussed that you wanted to get some new maps made too. Is that still the plan? That would be cool to have some new maps available at the 4.5 launch I would offer to make some if someone helped me with the worldbuilder, I have made them for Warcraft III but it is very confusing for BFMEII

[†TYRANICK†™]

=O!

The topics have name changes, i got confused when i saw 4.5 instead of 5, i thought it came out while i was a sleep lol.

I like the wall ally link up ideas btw =]

Oh and no, i aint seen the rain of fire attack yet, once i do i'll let ya know lol

Edited by †TYRANICK†™, 19 September 2007 - 09:37 AM.

[Sûlherokhh]

I asked about this earlier but I think it got buried by something more important, but would it take much to be able to connect a wall expansion to an ally's wall hub? Naz you said you spent a lot of time on the walls so I am not trying to create a lot of work I am just wondering if it's feasible. That is the one thing all of my friends which play have asked me about, cause it's kind of annoying to have a hole if you build walls out to each other and can't connect to the wall hub. I can't believe EA didn't do that in the first place.
...

As far as i know, you can't do anything with objects you don't own. It might be possible to 'steal' a structure, like saruman/wormtongue can convert enemies. It should be possible with allies as well, also with units other than troops. But you would then not only own the hub (which your friend would not be able to use anymore) but also the whole wallstretch that leads to the hub in the first place.

I don't think i will experiment on that anytime soon. Sorry.

[Harad King]

Are Stats going to be removed in Beta V?

[Nazgûl]

Uhm, why would we remove the stats? Stats are one of the reasons that I feel crippled when it comes to adding factions (since BFME2 only supports statsa for 6 factions). And I like stats, since they tell you how the game/match went...

[†TYRANICK†™]

I'm sure i remember you saying somewhere that the enemy would not approach your base for at least 15 minutes or something, but i've find this to not be the case, regardless of difficulty i'm still pretty much getting attacked after about sub 5 mins.

[Nazgûl]

We've changed the AI so many times now that I can't recall when I said that, but I know I did. These days the AI atacks after about 7-10 mins though, depending on faction, and that's all cause with all the trimmings of the AI it's hard to keep the attack rate long... unfortionately. They're just too good now... and trying to slow them down might get tricky. But that will always be an important factor of SEE, so I'll see what I can do before we relae 4.5.

[Sûlherokhh]

If i increase the buildtime of farms, you could have any time you want.