882 replies to this topic

[Myrdin]

well, to start with this post......

ok soo 1st - I reacted the way i reacted, becouse you writen a post that was intimidating not the idea of awatar, nor anything others, you point was clear offence, by full forced sarcasm, you were making fun of us ( for the post was not served only to me ) trying to get some constructive ideas, which got me boiled and redy....

now after i read this post, i think you didnt mean a direct offense, soo yes you are right, calling you names was a bit overreacted from me, for after reading your last post, i kinda understood something, i wont tell you what for it would make awkward feelling ( but its nothing bad, nor hostile ). Just to say this - I myself have got many times into problems just becouse im honest with my feeling, and the way i present, if i dont like you, i tell you directly, and wont do conspiracis behind your bakcs. The way you put out your post out there, was kinda honest too, soo i can well understand, that you didnt mean any harm, but the direct words were sharp enough to do dmg.
But as i said, i can wery well understand this.
You said you wont apologize and that is good soo, for i wouldnt accept any apologyze FOR THERE IS NOTHING TO BE APOLOGIZING FOR.

Now let us speak about this no more, for there is nothing more to say to this matter.

Instead i must admit . . . . . i LOVE the IDEA of that Storm cloud shooting lightning, which you proposed, it sound damn good for my ears.

but i still think that mega buff doesnt suit a 25pp ( only if you would make it do " TO WAAAAR !!! " sound after activated )

instead you gave me good idea, for the 25 pp summon

ok, as some of you announced, the summon mustnt be just creature ( MotE, will most propably, at least i think soo recieve huge sandstorm ), and i love the idea of strom cloud

soo generally : 25pp - Natures furry, or Thunder Wrath
It would summon a Huge Storm cloud, that wouuld send lightning to the ground ( each lighntning bolt would be strong as the one shooting from Wizard Tower, but this lignintgs would have much wider AoE, soo they would deal nice arrea dmg, and there would be 2 more than Wizards Towers ), and when the spell would end its near, the strom cloud would " explode " into small awalanche, releasing tons of snow down on the enemies.
now for details:
the whole thing mentioned up here was the animations
-The cloud would be able to move, slowly, but move, like Tornade spell
-During his whole existence, he would shot the lightning bolts down to ground, only to the ground at which is he directly above, but they would strike randomly under him, not just into one point
( thats why the AoE dmg should be for each, for striking such huge area deals small dmg, to one target, becouse its not concentrated like W.T., and the AoE cowers for it soo basically small dmg, - each could kill any normal unit - not troll bats. or trolls, giants and such super powerfull creature. Soo there would be like 20 bolts, each dealing dmg 500, into random area udner the stromcloud, with AoE )
-Just before the spell drops off, and the strom cloud will disappear, he will explode into awalanche of snow, that deals high dmg ( not soo high like angmar awalanche, but only a bit weaker ) onto the direct area under which was the cloud before he exploded ( soo not randomly strikes like lightning )

this spell would be wery good, for it could be used 2 warriants - Army killer, thx the disrupted lightning strikes it could serve as army killer, for it would cower, wide random areay ( like rain of fire )
- Building destrer, though it would be in smaller area than normal Awalanche, and weaker too, it could doo nice dmg to buildings directly under the cloud ( only at the death sequence, after time runs out ), it would be smaller weaker wersion of awalanche, but still pretty thoug.
and dont forget the lighning dmg building too, just randomly, soo you newer know if it hits it or not, you need to micro the Strom Cloud well, to be able to make full potencial of both phases of the power.

well i think this is Isengard like ( for it has the Caradrass Awalanche, and the strom with lighting that started it ) at the same time i think, it would be a nice show too

[Devon]

I really like the idea of mapwide buff...no one else has anything like it except leaders of the alliance in the good campaign. I think it would really add to the uniqueness of isengard.

[Myrdin]

hmm but would it be permanent or just temporally ?

coz if permanent it cold be some medium buff like 100% dmg and armor, 200% exp rate and non combat regeneration ( after it IS 25pp, soo ....) - though all other lesser leadership would have to stuck with it, or they would become uselless

if temporally soo it could be like 250% dmg and armor bonus, movement speed doubled, attack rate increased, exp 300% rate
for like 2 minutes ( darkness last around 8 minutes, and it gives pretty nice buff too, but its just 15, soo this would take 2 minutes but give damn hell huge buff, for the units must be buffed soo they could take down even a balrog if the enemy summons him )

[dojob]

Yeah that's pretty much what I had in mind, though I originally thought of it as a lvl10 power for Saruman but it could go either way, i suppose.

Edit: I meant the storm cloud idea.

About the buff idea, it should be temporary imo and yeah a mapwide thing would be great.

Edited by dojob, 05 April 2008 - 09:17 PM.

[Devon]

They don't necesarily have to take down a balrog....I'd say permanent power that gives them like double damage and/or armor.

[dojob]

Sounds good. It would be strong because it's permanent for the effected units (or would it be permanent for all of your units?)

Edited by dojob, 05 April 2008 - 09:23 PM.

[Devon]

Hmmm...I was intending it to be the whole map...but that makes me think. It could be something like only for normal uruks, or pikes, or that each type of units gets a different kind of buff. Uruks-armor, Pikes-damage or something

[Scryer]

Hmmm...I was intending it to be the whole map...but that makes me think. It could be something like only for normal uruks, or pikes, or that each type of units gets a different kind of buff. Uruks-armor, Pikes-damage or something

I have always been assuming that your buff idea was map-wide. I would rather have this power a passive one just because it would be different. So far, there are no 25pp powers that are passive (or so I remember) so it would be nice to see this kind of a change for once.

I am all for the thundercloud idea instead of a regular Avalanche. To me, a regular Avalanche for Isengard seemed a little boring for me. But I like this idea ten times more. I can imagine it now: Using that power plus Saruman's new level 10 lightning spell (assuming that you're using that) on my enemy's army..... So much lightning, so little time .

[Devon]

I'd just rather have avalanch I think since it almost never gets used by angmar players (honestly, who would pick it over shade of wold) and I think isen has enough lightning already, but whatever

[Scryer]

I'd just rather have avalanch I think since it almost never gets used by angmar players (honestly, who would pick it over shade of wold) and I think isen has enough lightning already, but whatever

Hahaha, I just want a good seizure while I'm playing.

I'm for either idea, to be honest.

[Funbomb]

Like Dojob said, you can have a 1 strike before hand that deals no damage and then the avalanche comes. While that's happening there could be a cloud of smoke above it.

Otherwise I like the idea of world-wide buff and I would love it to be permanent.

If that doesn't work I also like Myrdin's idea with lightning cloud.

[Myrdin]

nice to hear that,

as yoda said - if it would be permanent, each unit could get " all Isen " buff and " my own buff " soo to call it. Soo here s what im thiking off

:
All Isengard units buff ( if its permanent )
+100% dmg
+100% armor
+150% experience rate gaining

does stuck with, heroes Leadership, for theyr leadership is weaker, and at the point you gain 25pp - this, then your heros leadership is uselless, soo it should stack ( dont forget, hereos L. has limitad range, this is worldwide, soo it wouldnt be OP )

and now for the buffs each unit would gain as " my own "
- Uruk Hai Warriors -- shield formation armor increased by 20% wihtout further movement penalization
- Uruk Crossbows -- ( if possible ) 15% chance of knocback - you can see that at helms deep siege, the arrows knock the elfs down the wall , ( or if not possible ) range increased by ( dunno how big range they got now, soo lets say, just by 120 )
- Uruk Hai Pikeman -- armor increased by additional 50%, movement speed increased slightly, by 25%
- Berserker -- for zerkers i go two ideas :
A) Berserker gains abilitiy Berserker Rage ( the name suits him good, doesnt need to be chanced ), of the power lvl 1 (CaH)
B) Berserker get +50% movement speed, +25% attack speed, +70% bonus dmg, and his AoE is slightly increased ( one more unit in a row, soo just a little better )
- Mini hero horde -- yeh right m.h.h. coz we dont still know what will happen here to the DBS ( if they ll become O. Guard ) or what, BUT even soo there s good thing that can be used for them ( for if you read Robs. post about m.h.hs you know how theyll be ), if you get this 25pp power, the Isengard m.h.h. would be able to purchase Heavy armor, and Forged Blades upgrade ( not banners )
- Barbarians of Dunland -- they can pillage more resources ( +1, soo togathers its 3 i think )
- Dunland Axetrhover -- no further range ( though you might think soo ) but can purchase forged blades, and attack rate halved, soo if they get in range, there will be a LOT of axes
- Riderless Wargs -- if this unit stays by Isen, than these guys would get theyr Howl ability buffed ( 2x more dmg, same coldown ), and 50%movement bonus
- Warg Riders -- (if possible) the number in each batallion increases by 2 ( there were pretty many of them in the movie ) and they get slight bonus to armor, dmg and movement speed ( 25%.25%.30%)
- Battering ram -- slightly increased movement speed by 25%, and hp by 400 ( no further dmg, from " my own " buff, and i think siege engines cant recieve leadership, soo it would get any buff from " All Isengard units " either
- Balista -- increased line of sight ( soo you can finally see as far as you can shot ) ,and maybe - can recieve forged blades upgrde ( for the arrow, is from metal too )
- Explosive Mine -- just more hp +300, and movement speed increased by 25%

soo this is all buffs that the units could get as " my own " and with " All Isengard Units " it would be pretty cool. Coz its permanent i tried not to doo it too rigged, but after all its 25pp soo i couldnt make it too weak either.

as for the siege engines, i wrote, they cant recieve leadership, normal way. Soo they wont be rigged, becouse all they get is only " my own " bonuses, not the " All Isengard units " ( which is meant for " units " )

soo this is the full list of buffs for all, and for each personally i think Isengard units could benefit from, after, they choose to get this 25pp, either then the explosive mines summon ( and i hope, with a zerker to fire them up, or at least such animation and explosion automatical )

hope oyu like it

Edited by Myrdin, 06 April 2008 - 09:14 AM.

[Uruk King]

Like it?
It rocks like hell!!!
Call it the "Rise of a New Power"

[Devon]

Yeah, that's pretty much exactly what I was suggesting, maybe with some slight changes to the different bonuses. You sand the isen buff and individual buf...you mean both? I think that might be op.

[Funbomb]

Agreed with Yoda.
If it was together, that would be op. Unless it was temporally it can be together in my thought.
Otherwise if it's permanent, it should be one or the other.

[Myrdin]

it was ment togather but my ownf buffs + all unit buffs might be kinda too much even for 25 ( though i tried to do the units buff not too strong )

soo what about this

All unit buff
50% dmg
50% armor
75% exp rate

thast half of what wass before, and 50, isnt that much, if it stuck with hero leadership, that its good, but this way its weaker then i suggested before, and thx this the unit might keep their " my buff " without further nerging
i tried to give each unit the kind of buff in which are the units used most ( for example, the uruk warriors, are good as meat shields for the great shield formation, soo after this they would get it a little stronger, as mentioned before )

after the main part was nerfed, its no more op, even if it would be permanent, 50% aint really that much and its 25pp after all
for example, i love the idea, of m.h.h. being able to get HA and FB, after you get this power ( 5+10+15+25=55 power points needed, and thats not soo easely to get, and remember there will be other powers too ), that would make them unique as hell, well i the main part was nerfed, soo i think its acceptable now
" To WAAAR !!! "

for the main part is what is most used, becouse you wont have all units at the same time in the game, soo all get good bonus, but each of them gets a bonus on their own, which is not owning, you need to combine even more than before to make use of the new + to the units, for example, the riderless wargs would be much usefull, for they would get small leadership from all buff, and twice as strong howl ability, soo they could live longer, and be more of servance to the player )

Edited by Myrdin, 06 April 2008 - 03:19 PM.

[Devon]

I think it should be different based on what type of unit you have, not just general. For instance:

Uruks fight for 10 seconds after death, health+20%, shield wall 20% more effective and 10% less speed taken away.
Pikemen are harder to crush and have more crush revenge, attack +75%
Crossbows are more accurate if rob adds accuracy to archers, change of knockback like rhun archers have, more damage
Zerkers have more damage armor and AoE, get crazy strong when below 20% health
Warg pack gets crush (I don't think they have it now?) and more health
Warg Riders get the effects of howl doubled, faster movement and attack speed, bit more crush.
Dunland pillage is +2, torches do more damage.
Axe throwers get more damage, better armor, better melee attack.
Ram has more armor, faster movement
Ballista has better accuracy, slightly higher range
Mine is faster, harder to kill with arrows, and bigger explosion radius.



Also, I hope DBs will be replaced with the giant shield uruks. If so, they could get much better armor and give bigger armor bonus to rams theyre protecting.

[Myrdin]

i dont really think that balista needs more range, it needs more wision, right now it has bigger range that it can see.
also i think it needs forged blades upgrade.

its not i dont like your points here, but thats TOO weak for 25pp, even though its permanent, its just not enough. We are speaking about ulti power here, and ulti power needs to be ass kicking.

[Devon]

It is a bit on the weak side...but we can always change it if its too weak. The thing is, if you make it too strong, the game would be over really quick. Yes its a lvl 25 pp, but still, you cant really compare it to the balrog because it affects all your units for the rest of the game. Isengard already has the best infantry...and now if you have a FU full cp army itll be nearly unstoppable without the enemy using some spell as well. But yeah, its a bit on the weak side. Thats just the basis for what I think it should be.

[Myrdin]

i dont if isen unist are best infantry in game, really not

they are wersatile, yeh, but the cost is too high.

And i would love the idea - that after i get ulti i might upgrade my m.h.h. with FB and HA. that sounds damn good ( and if they gonna be some heavy armored shield uruks - model, with huge armor, than it would make sense they could get it upgraded )

btw, i dont think that Warg Sentrie suits Isengard, the model ( bone fence ) suits more to Goblins.

I think if we want to keep the type of building ( the biulding that sends units on the nearby enemies ), we could call it like Pikeman barracks, and 2 or 3 respanable uruk pikeman would be coming out against the enemies, instead the ( not even fully functional ) Warg Sentry. The model just doesnt suit Isen