1109 replies to this topic

[Wanderer∞]

Lets not completely abandon the idea of sorcerers. To stay true to lore, the sorcerers could be single units that are much weaker versions of the 5 wizards heroes. Once they are built, the player could choose to upgrade them with a single magic power like a fireball, lightning, teleport, etc. The model of the servants to the original sorcerers could be used as the new sorcerer, but it would be given a staff.
Tolkien stated that it was unknown how many istari came over to middle-earth, all that were mentioned were the 5 chief wizards.

[{IRS}Athos]

Why does everyone misspell Gundabad? It has no H...

[{IP} Aridor]

That there were more Istari is unlikely. If their was they would be unlikely to help out Angmar.

[mike_]

Yeah. It took almost two thousand years for Saruman to fall. And it's unlikely anymore were sent; Curunir was the Chief of the Five.


EDIT: Hear that, LotRO?

Edited by mike_, 27 January 2009 - 01:06 AM.

[{IP} Aridor]

Yes the Valar woudn't have sent a lot of Maiar to interfere.

[Wanderer∞]

And yet Gandalf was the only one of the known Istari to follow the orders they were all given. Saruman could have corrupted the other istari. And is anything, there could always be a istari unit in arnor as well.

[Uruk King]

Technically what becomes of the other three Istari is unknown, other than that Saruman didn't corrupt any more wizards, perhaps the blue Wizards perished in the Far East, joined the easterlings, who knows. Radagast on the other hand hardly halped the free peoples, tending to the ways of the birds and beasts, was not allowed back across the sea.

[Hasfusel]

Saruman was busted by Wormtoungue, and then his soul dispersed or something.
Gandalf went off to the Undying Lands for his mighty deeds.
Radagast did bugger all during the war of the Ring, and elected to stay in Middle-Earth anyhow.
Alatar and Palando (I hate those names, Tolkein must have been on WoW; the worst drug of all) went off to Rhún and Harad respectively. Tolkein mentioned they could have started evil magic cults (mortal sorcerers). However, he did also say they were crucial to victory in the WotR. One guesses that they stopped the East unleashing its true might on the West.

I don't remember reading about other Istari... But I reckon evil sorcerers wouldn't be too far off the lore. They're like ordinary men who wield the force driving the Vampires and the Nazgul and are corrupted. It would be possible. Technically Aragorn or Boromir could have done magic using the Ring, anyway.
I reckon Morgomir should look like a normal Nazgul, but with the same croaky voice as EA gave. However, by the War of the Ring, he and the WitchKing are so far into corruption they can barely speak, just a kind of breathy hiss.
I'd give Morgomir's current model/skin to the Vampire units in man form.

[{IP} Aridor]

Alatar and Pallando are perfectly good elvish names. You're right that Radagast wasn't evil just forgot to do his job. The Nazgul would be totally wraithed by the time of Angmar. Heck they were wrathed by the time of the Last Alliance. They talked fine during the WotR. Just wraithy.

[Vithar-133]

Off topic: Firstly, I don't think that WoW would exist without Tolkein's work. Secondly, Alatar and Palando don't seem Tolkein-esque to me; but they don't seem to WoW-esque either. (No don't have that game. Doubt I'll ever play it, either. Can't stand online games..) RJ-RotWK doesn't use those names anyways; it uses Romestamo and Morinehtar. Both of which have a meaning in Elvish.


Anyways, I don't think that some sort of cultist type unit would be lore demolishing. I mean, look at the Noledhil. They aren't truly lore following, but they are fitting because they were done logically. So, by using that logic, we could conceive some sort of unit like that and have it fit. All that we have to do is take advantage of the resurces that we do have: Tolkein's works (mike) and our imaginations.


PS: To tell the truth, I don't think Tolkein would consider ever playing WoW. Doesn't seem likely at least.

Edited by Vithar Megilaglar, 27 January 2009 - 02:40 PM.

[{IP} Aridor]

Tolkien would have no problem with people expanding on the world. It was his desire to create a mythology. So as long as it stays logical and consistent with the way he made his world.

[Scryer]

Even so, wouldn't the sorcerer-cult units be for MOTE (Rhun) instead of Angmar anyways ?

Okay to bring us relatively back to Angmar, I'm going to suggest a couple of Ring Powers.

This first one will replace the Avalanche power. The reason why I'm suggesting a replacement is because there's a good chance that it could get moved to Isengard. This is my idea, I'm just quoting it from another post. So the first 25pp power that I'm suggesting is:


Blizzard 25pp:

- It would have a large casting targeted-area.
- It would start out like Angmar's Fell Wind power but then it would build up and blow away more units. It would give out ice damage (or whatever kind of damage the Ice Arrows give out) and there would be lots of snow effects.
- It would cause pretty decent damage to buildings but it would be more of a unit killer than anything.
- After it has finished, if there are any units still alive in the center of the targeted area, they would become immobile. This would be equivalent to the Sorcerer's spell that causes units to become immobile.

and this would replace that god-awful wolf summon power;

Night of the Nazgul (needs better name..) 25pp:

- Summons Akhorahil, Khamul, and Dendra Dwar (these Ring Wraiths can be changed) at level 10.
*- These 3 Ringwraiths also have their Fell-Beast mounts
- They would be a timed summon... I'm thinking that they would share the same timer as a balrog.


*As corrected by AA IP'er

Edited by Scryer, 27 January 2009 - 08:56 PM.

[{IP} Aridor]

I like them somewhat especially the Nazgul one. Only one thing the Fellbeasts weren't around until the WotR

[shadowfoxt]

I think for 25pp there should be more than 3 nazgul.

[Scryer]

I like them somewhat especially the Nazgul one. Only one thing the Fellbeasts weren't around until the WotR

Point taken, you are absolutely correct on that. Then I suppose that they would all have horse mounts then..

And i don't agree with having more than 3 Nazgul for the summon because their level 10 powers are pretty powerful. Which is why I have chosen those 3 Nazgul in particular.

[shadowfoxt]

true i guess. Never picked up on the level 10 thing sorry

[{IRS}Athos]

@ Hasfusel: I think that your additional sorcerers draw too much inspiration from... you guessed it, World of Warcraft.

@ Scryer: Those powers look good. I'm assuming that the wolf model, scaled down, would then be used for werewolves?

[Wanderer∞]

The sorcerer idea wasn't just meant specifically for Angmar. I meant it to be used by any faction. I just didn't agree with the concept of getting rid of the unit all together.

[{IP} Aridor]

There is model being made for the werwolves.

[Hasfusel]

@ Hasfusel: I think that your additional sorcerers draw too much inspiration from... you guessed it, World of Warcraft.

How dare you. You have three seconds to apologise before I go up inside your head.

My idea was that Sorcerers were bad men who wanted so much power they were prepared to give their souls for it. They were subsequently enslaved by the bad Maiar in exchange for evil powers. Tolkein would have no problem with that, I reckon. It would work with Men of the East, too.

And the special Nazgul summon sounds quite good, although I might rather make it summon weaker versions of all seven other Nazgul. And yes, you know what I'm going to say so I won't say it.

By the way, it is suggested the Fell Beasts are monsters from Rhun. They weren't specifically created, I think. So technically they could have existed then but the Nazgul wouldn't have used them.

I had an idea for the 25pp Angmar summon; it's a little radical and might be impossible to code, but...

Night of Shadows

The whole map is engulfed with darkness, boosting all your supernatural units (Wraithes, Werewolves, Sorcerers and Vampires) for a short while. Most importantly, 10 Wraithes, a Vampire and a Werewolf will spawn on the map in locations near enemy troops/buildings (if this cannot be coded you could have it as an ordinary summon where you choose the location), allowing you to wreak havoc amongst the armies being built by your enemy.