1712 replies to this topic

[system_707]

Also i don't think Hobbits should be in the arnor faction maybe gondor but defo not Arnor. Also arnor's inn allies is rohan isn't that a bit boring maybe a completely new unit? I also think Eärnur should be a hero he was at the battle of fornost. http://en.wikipedia....ttle_of_Fornost

Edited by system_707, 26 March 2009 - 06:05 PM.

[Captain of Arnor]

Don't follow Wikipedia for anything related to LOTR. Its wrong 9/10 times, or it gives indefinite information and leads to missed guesses.

The hobbits were in Arnor, since the Shire was part of Arnors territory, but they never took place in any of the battles of Arnor against Angmar. Except for the final battle for Fornost, when a company of hobbit archers were 'said' to go with Earnurs army from Gondor to liberate Fornost and drive the Witch-king from the north. (I don't believe that. I say hobbits don't belong in Arnor, nor any of the combat factions, except as heroes - Merry, Pippin, Frodo and Samwise.)

Arnors Inn alliance isn't done yet. They're still talking about what to add.

Me and a few others have recommended that they add Gondor as their inn-alliance faction, from which can be recruited Gondorian Swordsmen, Archers, Pikemen and Earnur as their hero.

Go play the Gondor faction and capture an Inn. Then you'll see the Inn alliance system as it was meant to be.

[Uruk King]

Personally I think Gondor Inn faction for Arnor could be a bit different from the Gondor in the alte Third age. Dragonforce mentioned something like Gondor Swordwielders, Gondor Marksmen and Rhovanion knights would be a good start.

I also hope to see some form of cavalry in Arnor.

[Captain of Arnor]

I agree that the two Gondors should be different, but its fundamentally the same thing. Gondor Swordwielders...that just...doesn't flow right. The name is off. Gondorian Swordsmasters, perhaps. Gondorian Marksmen sounds good, but Gondor was never known for its Knights. I think it should be pikemen, since the only pikemen Arnor gets are the cruddy Hobbit pitchforks and the Elven pikemen, but those are late-mid game to late game.

Edited by Captain of Arnor, 26 March 2009 - 09:58 PM.

[shadowcreature]

One idea I had in mind was perhaps downgrade the current Numenorian Knights and make them Arnor Cavaliers for level 2. For the sake of uniqueness I suppose have them strong against infantry and pikes(long spears:p), but weak against archers. For the replacement, the Steelbowmen as Arnor's elite.

[Captain of Arnor]

I definitely agree with Shadowcreature. The Numenorean Knights are not only overpowered, but they're too limited to count as decent cavalry. Arnor needs a good stable long-term cavalry for early, early-mid, mid gameplay. I think Arnor Cavaliers or Arnorian Knights would be pretty great.

Steelbowmen could also be an interesting elite unit, but something like Numenorean Warriors would be better, with switchable weapons, able to go from steel bows to swords - of course, their steel bows would be more powerful than the swords, but they'd both be epicly powerful.

[Dragonforce]

Rhovanion was known for its knights. Look at the name
Yeah, that name sucks but swordmaster are in the Rivendell already. Also, It could be Gondor veterans.
@: AA IP'er: First I thought only anti-unit siege weapons but that makes Arnor waek in siege situations. They could have some "merchant" trebs maybe? Or summon?(Bad idea)

[Captain of Arnor]

Thats true. Hmm...

Gondorian Swordsmen, I still think, is the way to go in that case. I mean, theres not going to be anything special about them, right? They're just going to be swordsmen. Lothlorien Swordsmen, Rivendell Swordsmen, Gondor Swordsmen - thats the way to go I say. But thats just me. XD If its a pickle, don't go out of the way to call it a dill pickle - just say its a pickle.

Anyways. Maybe Arnor should get one trebuchet. Like Arnorite recommended earlier, one that has to deploy and be sat down on the ground / planted / braced before it can fire. And you know, I was thinking...a rolling trebuchet is a very bad idea.

I built a real trebuchet one time with a few friends of mine (it was over twenty feet tall, was using many stones as big as my chest as counterweights, and could shoot a water melon a hundred yards, we measured it) and the force of that thing when it swung up to shoot was insane. It would've been moving around all over the place if we had put wheels on it, and the end result would've been a horrible injury to one of us. All catapult / trebuchet siege weapons should have to deploy and plant / brace themselves before firing...its just common sense. XD

[Uruk King]

Thats what I want to see in the trebuchet too, mechanically speaking it was the most superior forms of seige, both in Middle-earth and in the Real world, if all its real world physics were implemeted into the current model, it would be too over-powering, unless there is something preventing it from being all powerful.

Perhaps the steel-bows could be an elite unit for Arnor, but they should have a Toggle to swords as well. Arnor's infantry was one of the finest in Middle-earth, like Gondor's. it seems reasonable that they should profess in swordcraft as well.

Edited by Uruk King, 27 March 2009 - 06:59 AM.

[Captain of Arnor]

If a trebuchet could actually plant / deploy / brace, it would have greatly improved range but slower firing time and, I'd think, reduced accuracy. I mean, when I was messing around with the trebuchet we built, we set up targets all around the impact zones but rarely, if ever, hit any of them.

Arnorian swordsmen were supposedly the finest in the land. But from what I've read, the steel bows of Numenor would greatly outweigh the swords of Numenor. So primary weapon should be steel bows, while switchable to swords, but super strong in both. I think they should also get some type of mass unit buffs, or special attacks, at two certain levels.

They are Numenoreans after all.

[shadowcreature]

Concerning the trebuchet idea, I like the idea of setting up and such. For the game, since it's aimed at rushes, how about having a passive ability? Both two seconds for set up and repack. It kind of reminds me of the Dwarves' extra armor deploy for some reason.

As far as steel bowmen, I'm ok with them having a toggle. But I agree with Captain of Arnor that bows should be the primary weapon.

[Dunedain Lord]

I definitely agree with Shadowcreature. The Numenorean Knights are not only overpowered, but they're too limited to count as decent cavalry. Arnor needs a good stable long-term cavalry for early, early-mid, mid gameplay. I think Arnor Cavaliers or Arnorian Knights would be pretty great.

Steelbowmen could also be an interesting elite unit, but something like Numenorean Warriors would be better, with switchable weapons, able to go from steel bows to swords - of course, their steel bows would be more powerful than the swords, but they'd both be epicly powerful.

that sounds suspicously like the elf elites...........
and there are WAY too many of those
just immensely powerful bowmen would be fine

[Captain of Arnor]

Man, not everything has to be worlds apart from every other thing in the game.

They were Men, not Elves. I've said this before, but nobody besides the Elves should ever get an elite unit that uses nothing but the bow - the Men were not the archers the Elves were, steel bows or not.

The primary weapons of Men, yes, even the Men of Numenor, were swords. If they have bows, they should also get swords. Thats all there is to it.

The way I figure it is that archers should either get a new upgrade in the Blacksmith - the steel bow upgrade, since there is room for another in there. Or the Arnor elite unit should get a group of Numenorean soldiers, five in the horde and a total of three hordes, who can switch between swords and steel bows - with the steel bows being the strongest weapon they can use.

Edited by Captain of Arnor, 28 March 2009 - 02:56 AM.

[Eärendur]

Maybe Arnor's elite unit could be Steelbows (even though I like the Steelbows as an upgrade), and they only have bows, but have a power like Faramir's Knight/Ranger toggle.
So they only have bows, but can mount, and when they mount, the also switch to swords or lances. Maybe the get the Archer/Knight Toggle power at level two, and a power that grants them, say, triple damage plus knockback at level 8?

BTW, what do you think of the new name?

Edited by Eärendur, 28 March 2009 - 04:58 AM.

[Captain of Arnor]

I like the name. But there are many different Earendurs. Three, actually.

Are you the Tenth King of Arnor? Or the Third King of Numenor, son of Tar-Amandi? Or Earendur, the Fifteenth Lord of Andunie and one of the Faithful during Numenors waining?

Anyways. :D I personally think that the Steel Bow idea would go best in the Blacksmith, or in the Rangers camp, for use with normal archers. Steel bows should definitely be added to the game in whatever fashion, but the main weapons of the Men of Numenor and Arnor was first and foremost the sword. Steel Bows were a major part of their weaponry and armory, but they were experts in swordcraft - as were all of the race of Men, pretty much.

Elves were good with the bow, Dwarves with the Axe, Men with the Sword.

In my opinion, the Elvish elite units should be changed to reflect this. At least the Mirkwood elites. The Noldor were skilled with the sword, as were the Galadhrim, but the Galadhirm were also more skilled with the bow than the sword. The elite units of Arnor, weather or not they get the Steel bows, should, in my eyes, have the sword as their main weapon. And kick ass with it too. But I'm done with this.

Its beginning to get really really redundant, nobody seems to see what I'm talking about.

[Devon]

I agree, but I don't bother posting in Arnor and Angmar cause everyone there is crazy and uses fancy words to fight back

[dojob]

I do think mirkwood mhh should be bow-only though

[Captain of Arnor]

I agree, but I don't bother posting in Arnor and Angmar cause everyone there is crazy and uses fancy words to fight back

I do think mirkwood mhh should be bow-only though

Got two Project members on my side. :D Epic.

Edited by Captain of Arnor, 28 March 2009 - 06:14 PM.

[Eärendur]

I like the name. But there are many different Earendurs. Three, actually.

Are you the Tenth King of Arnor? Or the Third King of Numenor, son of Tar-Amandi? Or Earendur, the Fifteenth Lord of Andunie and one of the Faithful during Numenors waining?

Tenth King of Arnor.

Anyways. I personally think that the Steel Bow idea would go best in the Blacksmith, or in the Rangers camp, for use with normal archers. Steel bows should definitely be added to the game in whatever fashion, but the main weapons of the Men of Numenor and Arnor was first and foremost the sword. Steel Bows were a major part of their weaponry and armory, but they were experts in swordcraft - as were all of the race of Men, pretty much.

I think that Steelbows should be at the Blacksmith, there's room for one more upgrade and that way you could also upgrade your Archers with something on fortress maps.

[Dalf32]

Man, not everything has to be worlds apart from every other thing in the game.

the idea is to have the factions be very different from one another so that playing one is altogether different from playing any of the others. mirroring factions is a very bad idea and leads to a boring mod.

They were Men, not Elves. I've said this before, but nobody besides the Elves should ever get an elite unit that uses nothing but the bow - the Men were not the archers the Elves were, steel bows or not.

The primary weapons of Men, yes, even the Men of Numenor, were swords. If they have bows, they should also get swords. Thats all there is to it.

this is just silly. all of it is just silly. im confounded by the silliness, really.
why should every archer unit in every non-elven faction need to have both bows and swords if they are to have bows at all?
and simply because the elves are very good bowmen, does not mean that no one else was. the steelbow would have been the most powerful ranged-infantry weapon, and only the men of numenor would have been strong enough to wield it. that does not make them better bowmen, it simply means they had a better weapon. they would be innaccurate compared to the elves and would have relied on simply raining hell from above.