1712 replies to this topic

[dojob]

O.K.,
here is a rough draft of what I want to see in Arnor. I hope that this won't offend anybody.


---POWER TREE--


Tier One:
Heal
Rallying Call
Power of the Palantir

Tier Two:I
Elven Wood
Summon the Istari (same power, shorter duration)
Lone Tower (can be upgraded with Fire Arrows for 1.5 time normal cost, 75% of normal armor, has a 5 min. timer)
Enshrouding Mist

Tier Three:
Valor of Numenor (all allied Arnor and Gondor units receive double damage and armor, and earn experience twice as fast. Lasts for 120 sec.)
Cloudbreak
Bombardment

Tier Four:
Sunflare
Earthquake
--END--

--STRUCTURES--
Fortress, Upgrade Changes:
Remove Istari, Elven and Dunedain Alliances.
Add "Inner Walls" upgrade at 1500 cost. (Increases fortress armor and reduces damage taken by melee attacks, also increases fortress size - but not vision - like the Dunedain Alliance did) [looks like the outer walls of the Amon Sul fortress].
Add "Fortress Guards" upgrade at 1000 cost. (Has 8, vanilla BfMEII, Tower Guards patrol around fortress attacking nearby enemies, also increases fortress vision - but not size - like the Dunedain Alliance).
Add "Palantir Chamber" upgrade at 1750 or 2000 cost. (Increases the vision, size, and armor of the fortress like the Elven and Istari Alliances combined).

Arnor Barracks:
No changes.

Hobbit House:
Removed.

Dunedain Camp:
Remove Fire Arrows upgrade.

Elven Barracks:
Reduce size, add Silverthorn Arrows upgrade.

Blacksmith:
Remove Silverthorn Arrows upgrade.
Add "Archery" upgrade, and Fire Arrows upgrade.

Arnor Workshop:
Rename "Arnor Siegeworks".

Arnor Statue:
Changed to look like this:

Only repaired.

Arnor Well:
Changed to look different (no suggestions ATM).

Arnor Wall Hub/Arnor Wall:
No changes (Wall Hub).
Add Postern Gate and maybe Catapult upgrades (Wall).

-New Structures-
Beacon (selected on Builders Palantir like Ithilien Outpost for Gondor) :
Looks like this:

Can garrison 4 units/hordes (non-mounted and mounted).
Elven Alliance, Dunedain Alliance, and Istari Alliance can be bought here.

Arnor Training Grounds:
Works like a second barracks. Can train Cardolan Barrowguards, Fornost Bladebearers, and Annuminas Steelbows. Add "Swordsmanship" upgrade, and "Spearmanship" upgrade. Could look like this:


--END--

--UNITS--
Dunedain Soldiers:
Renamed Arnor Soldiers, slight damage and armor increase, now trained at lv. 2 Arnor Barracks.

Dunedain Archers:
Renamed Arnor Archers, slight range and vision increase, now trained at lv. 2 Arnor Barracks.

Arnor Royal Knights:
Removed.

Hobbits:
Removed.

Hobbits with Pitchforks:
Removed.

Dunedain Rangers:
Replace Longshot ability with Ambush Formation (available at lv. 2. Causes rangers to become invisible and go into aggressive stance and form a wide ring, dealing slight extra damage to enemy units inside ring and taking slight extra damage from enemy units outside ring. Canceled when ordered to move).

Mounted Dunedain Rangers:
Add Longshot ability at lv. 3.

Dunedain Captain:
Removed.

Rivendel Riders:
Should be allowed to combine with like hordes.

Mithlond Sentries:
Removed.

Mithlond Archers:
Should be allowed to combine with like hordes.

Spearmen of the Havens:
No change.

Imladris Captain:
Removed.

Arnor Trebuchet:
Removed.

-New Units-
Arnor Sentries (150 cost):
Early-game unit, trained at lv. 1 Arnor Barracks. Toggle unit, very weak, can be upgraded with either "Swordsmanship", "Archery", or "Spearmanship" upgrades. Once upgraded, unit becomes either a swordsman, spearman, or archer unit depending on upgrade. Cannot receive Forged Blades, Heavy Armor, or Fire Arrows upgrades at any time. Can receive Banner Carrier upgrade.

Arnor Spearmen (300 or 350 cost):
Mid-game pikeman unit, trained at lv. 3 Arnor Barracks. Look like Arnor Soldiers and Archers but wield spears (duh) but no shields. Can enter Porcupine Formation. Can receive Heavy Armor, Forged Blades, and Banner Carrier upgrades.

Annuminas Steelbows (1550 or 1600 cost):
Archer only MHH, trained at lv. 3 Arnor Training Grounds (5 units per horde, 3 horde max) that look like this:

Powers:
Lead Them Forward or Archery of Numenor (lv. 1) - All nearby allied archer-type units gain +25% damage and +10% armor.
Heavy Arrows (lv. 3) - double damage + knockback (like the witch-king's normal attack) to nearest enemy unit.
{Optional} Arrowheads of Iron (lv. 8) - one-hit-kill.

Fornost Bladebearers (750 or 800 cost):
Elite (not MHH) swordsman unit, trained at lv. 2 Arnor Training Grounds. (Elite swordsman unit. uses Aragorn model but has same skin as Steelbows. Can be upgraded with Forged Blades, Heavy Armor, and Banner Carrier).

Arnor Catapult (1000 cost):
Siege unit, trained at lv. 1 Arnor Siegeworks. Fires single projectile. Can be upgraded with Flaming Munitions upgrade. Must deploy (like Dwarven Demolisher, becomes immobile but receives armor increase) to fire. 3-man crew, crew have skins like Arnor Soldiers and Archers.

Cardolan Barrowguards (450 cost):
Mid-game Spearman/Archer toggle unit, trained at lv. 1 Arnor Training Grounds. Can toggle between spears and bows. Can receive Forged Blades, Heavy Armor, Fire Arrows, and Banner Carrier upgrades. Could look like this:


--END--






If anyone has any ideas for more units or anything else, please don't hesitate to say so. And I hop that this did not offend anyone. And I'm sorry about this being sooo long.

No offense taken I'd just prefer to keep things as they are and add a few elites to flesh out the human part of the faction and maybe a few buffs or reductions (I never liked Mithlond sentries, so I guess they can go as long as cav and spearmen of the havens stay), so you don't leave Rob with too much modelling, skinning, and coding to do.

I'm against the adding of Training Grounds in particular because it seems to me like it'll shadow the Arnor barracks; not only can u get a pike/archer toggler unit from lvl1, but u also get better swordsmen and archers, it's pretty cheap, and 2 of the 3 sentry upgrades come from there. Why would people use Arnor soldiers or archers in the midgame when they could get Cardolan Barrowguards, Dunedain, or Mithlond Archers? By the time Arnor spearmen come out, wouldn't you rather have a heavier pike unit (spearmen of the havens) or pikes that can switch weapons?

I do like the adding of stationary siege weapons, beacons, and the idea behind adding more elites to Arnor, but I'm worried that units may end up becoming too situational and may be shadowed by others And ofc the getting rid of Hobbits, I'm never gonna let that happen easily.

[Captain of Arnor]

I'm afraid I'm with Dojob on this. Arnor has been created from the ground up basically, and its come out good - it should stay as is, only with some small changes here and there. Adding an MHH, removing hobbits and some elves. The buildings, to me, are fine. And I also like the Arnor Swordsmen and Archers like they are. Adding the Arnor Sentries, while an interesting idea, is a noticeable step towards Angmar and Rohan in my eyes and it doesn't sit really that well with me.

The ideas are all interesting, but its too much of a change, in the end, to a faction that really, honestly, doesn't need a huge revamping change. Not like Angmar does anyway.

[Eärendur]

It's O.K.
I just thought that there were some (or most, although I really don't mean to brag) ideas were really good. It was all a rough draft anyway, not a polished product, just some stuff I put together late at night. Maybe if I got some more feedback on what was good and what wasn't, I could make a final, polished, draft.

[Dunedain Lord]

taking away trebuchets from arnor takes away a major strategy
heck
















no

[Gr1m]

I'm afraid I'm with Dojob on this. Arnor has been created from the ground up basically, and its come out good - it should stay as is, only with some small changes here and there. Adding an MHH, removing hobbits and some elves. The buildings, to me, are fine. And I also like the Arnor Swordsmen and Archers like they are. Adding the Arnor Sentries, while an interesting idea, is a noticeable step towards Angmar and Rohan in my eyes and it doesn't sit really that well with me.

The ideas are all interesting, but its too much of a change, in the end, to a faction that really, honestly, doesn't need a huge revamping change. Not like Angmar does anyway.

While I agree that compared to Angmar, discussing alterations to Arnor is hardly a priority, I do like the idea presented here. Arnor at the moment feels very clunky imo.

[Dunedain Lord]

does angmar rlly need that much work done? Just replace trolls and sorcerers........bam. Done.
And I agree with everything except for the trebs. THey must stay.

[Devon]

And cost more or get a slight nerf

[Gr1m]

does angmar rlly need that much work done?

Yes, it really does.

[Dunedain Lord]

And cost more or get a slight nerf

er.................no

[Gr1m]

And cost more or get a slight nerf

er.................no

Is it too much to ask for an explanation as to why you disagree?

[shadowcreature]

imo Arnor is fine at the moment. The Arnor Sentries sound like a fine Level 1 unit, while the Steelbowmen sound like a suitable mhh replacement.

[Uruk King]

Not to mention a bolster of human elite units, Fornost Bladebearers ect.

[shadowcreature]

Ah, yes that as well. Cheers for the reminder. If at all possible, maybe reduce the number of Arnor units in a battalions, but give them an overall buff to better reflect Numenorian Men.

Edited by shadowcreature, 15 April 2009 - 07:18 AM.

[{IP} Aridor]

Reskin the House knights that the fiefdoms have. They'll work capital.

[Eärendur]

The Arnor Towers need a reskin, they don't have a door, and that makes it pretty hard to position them before you build them. Many times in the past I have built them with the "entrance" facing a cliff so the units couldn't garrison. It's probably not that hard to just add a door (like the door of the Gondor Towers) at the entrance of the Arnor Towers. Is it?

[Captain of Arnor]

Dunedain Lord, the Arnor trebuchets are very heavily overpowered. I don't even need to use trebuchets at all at any point in the game, unless my enemy decides to throw some walls up. Any talented player doesn't need them, even if they do add another strategy to playing as Arnor. If you're that dependent on them, come up with another strategy, I say.

Or give a better reason than 'no' as to why they shouldn't be nerfed.

They need to be very heavily depowered, AI needs to be adjusted so that they don't spam them by the dozens every rush, and they need to be reskinned. Thats pretty much the bottom line.

[Uruk King]

I think that there just needs to be a general cost increase for Good siege weopons so that the AI can't spam them in full lest they run out of resources, my reasons standing that the forces of evil had the manpower, resources and time to mass construct siege weopons, as well as pressure from their leaders. In BFME, you could get an Evil seige weopon discout for building a furnace, which follows the fact that the evil forces (at least Isengard and Mordor) were all about industry and mass production, but you couldn't get a discount for a trebuchet as Gondor, you'd onlly have enough resources to buy a few becasue they were really expensive. The only faction that I think can be spared the cost increase due to their craftsmanship are the Dwarves,

[shadowcreature]

I think cost should be upped for Trebuchets as well considering a brutal Gondor and Arnor having that discount spams them like mad.

[{IP} Aridor]

Make the trebs stationary like in AOE 2. The current model of the wheeled treb would be extremely dangerous in the real word if it could even fire at all.

[Uruk King]

I agree, trebs should have to deploy to fire.

But back to Arnor; could at least one of the kings of Arnor get a mount? It's seems rather limiting to have all of Arnor's heroes bound to walking, unless of course Glorfindel is added.