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Men of the East


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#61 Vithar-133

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Posted 24 July 2007 - 02:48 AM

Men if the East, all the way.

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#62 robnkarla

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Posted 24 July 2007 - 04:29 AM

All right, I'll be starting the poll once the release is out :p

If you feel like it, follow the link to enjoy the Evil Men buildings in screenshots I took for reference in the 2d art:

http://rjrotwk.the3r...nshots/screens/

#63 Dalf32

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 12:10 AM

i think khamul needs 2 b cheaper. evil men currently hav 3 4000 heros and khamul wuld mak a good 3000 hero imo.

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#64 mr_g

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 07:59 AM

I don't really play with Evil Men, but I feel they have a good potential to be a good enemy
I never have AI when I play against them on any map (original, rj revisited)
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#65 Distant

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 10:53 AM

Bug report time. With the release of v.1.05.02 I loaded up Evil Men (working title, I know) just because it was new to me and I wanted to play with new toys. I saw it mentioned earlier that there is some hard coded thing preventing you from allowing Evil Men and Rohan from using create-a-heroes. A terrible shame that, as that’s a faction killer for me. I love bringing in a custom hero and I’m not sure I’d ever play a faction that denied me that. Also probably hard coded, but I wanted to bring up the lack of profile stats for your new factions in the profile stats screen. Anyway, on to the good stuff. I derived these bugs from an 8 player skirmish map against some AIs that took good advantage of my distraction.

Easterling Warriors missing “requires building level 2” in their build tooltip.
Easterling Barracks in red health animation did something that I can only refer to as literally “flipping out”. (I believe this was already pointed out by Dalf32, but the problem is still there.)
Battle Tower expansions on the initial Evil Men fort does not animate construction. (Not so much a bug as something I’m sure you just haven’t gotten to yet.)
Haradrim Lancers don’t completely clear the Haradrim Palace when they spawn. One of them pokes his head out, but the rest stay in the tent where I’m sure it’s nice and cool. Perhaps even air conditioned.
Tavern builder tooltip says “research Mordor upgrades” on both panels.
Poison Arrows research tooltip in the Tavern says “Requires level 3 orc pit.”

That’s all I managed to write down before my nearly undefended camp was overrun. And now as the caffeine fails me, I go to sleep. More breaking to follow in the coming weeks.

#66 Jepa

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 01:42 PM

When I play against evil men they don´t build anything, so face them is no match :grin: Same thing with Rohan.

#67 Allathar

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 01:46 PM

Haradrim Lancers (the infantry) can't purchase the Banner Carrier upgrade, even if researched. Their string says 'research upgrade at orc pit to enable' or something like that.

Haradrim Guard cannot purchase forged blades and banner carriers, it says at BC 'this unit has already received the upgrade'

Haradrim Archers barbed arrow shot won't trigger. I upgraded the unit with it, but nothing happens.

Corsairs and Rhun Brigands can't purchase BC.

Wain riders commandset is missing

Soldiers of Rhun can't purchase Forged Blades.

Rhun Riders are getting lovely pink when Heavy Armor is purchased :grin:, also the animations of their BC is missing

Easterling Archers can't purchase upgrades, and their string says 'Elladan' when mouse is hovered over

Edited by Allathar, 26 July 2007 - 02:00 PM.

It has been reported that some victims of rape, during the act, would retreat into a fantasy world from which they could not WAKE UP. In this catatonic state, the victim lived in a world just like their normal one, except they weren't being raped. The only way that they realized they needed to WAKE UP was a note they found in their fantasy world. It would tell them about their condition, and tell them to WAKE UP. Even then, it would often take months until they were ready to discard their fantasy world and PLEASE WAKE UP

#68 mr_g

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 02:47 PM

on 1.05.02
Haradrim Archers can't be upgraded and they are named Elladan when I put mouse on them

Soldiers of Rhun can't have no forged blade

Rhun Riders have Gondor Knight voice

Brigands can't be upgraded

Harad Warriors are named Gondor Soldiers on the palantir picture

Easterling Captain doesn't have battle stance and can't capture building

Guardians of Black Scorpion can only have heavy armor

No alliance in the Inn, but maybe this is normal for the moment
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#69 Zyzzyva

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 03:54 PM

To add to what mr. g said:

Mahud Cheiftain still 'has' ellandan (I think)'s powers, but in reality has no powers

Easterling Captain doesnt get Bounty until lvl 4 and its faded out until then, but i noticed that my lvl 5 mahud cheif and lvl 3 easterling captain getting resources for kills :grin:

Black Serpent Guards seemed relutant to attack my enemy's Gondor units unless I ordered them to directly. They attacked most of his buildings but when they reached the fortress they sat around as it and his units killed them.

Haradrim Warriors still seem very weak, but maybe this is intensional

EDIT:

Forged Blades still turn to logs behind buildings (with the shadow figures)

Rhun Riders still can be built at the lvl 1 rhun cavalry building (and they seem weak to me)

The Hero revival prices are messed up. To revive a lvl 1 mahud chief cost 2500 and to revive a lvl 7 easterling chief cost 3250. HTey are both originally 1500

Edited by Zyzzyva, 26 July 2007 - 08:22 PM.

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Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt. We do not. It is wisdom to recognize necessity, when all other courses have been weighed, though as folly it may appear to those who cling to false hope. Well, let folly be our cloak, a veil before the eyes of the Enemy! For he is very wise, and weighs all things to a nicety in the scales of his malice. But the only measure that he knows is desire, desire for power; and so he judges all hearts. Into his heart the thought will not enter that any will refuse it, that having the Ring we may seek to destroy it. If we seek this, we shall put him out of reckoning.
-Gandalf

#70 Vithar-133

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 05:21 PM

the Easterling battle tower shoot out of the base of the tower and there is no outer limit (for farms) for the evil men.

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#71 Zyzzyva

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 09:55 PM

Some last few things I forgot to mention in my edit was that for some reason (maybe on perpose) Evil men gain way more resources than other factions (like 48 at around 100%). Also, The Sorcerors spells (except for mighty rage) cost nothing, and the sorcerors do not regenerate. Imo, the two resource buildings should be slightly different, to incourage mixing of structures once the Sub-faction part is implemented. Maybe make harad farms collect normal, and then make wind mills collect less than regular but allow the wind mills to ... i dont know, maybe have a speical ability that makes the resources fluctuate, just like a real windmill would. This would make a purpose to building the resource building of the culture your not using. Also, I was playing evil men and I found that it was quite hard to finish off my enemies. Right now, Evil Men has no siege and no elite units. I got them down, but I had to build about 5 mumakil to finish them off. The best melee unit that evil men has really is the normal easterling warriors and the cosairs. I was thinking that evil men lacked either an strong fighter from harad, or that soldiers of rhun might be made more elite. Two ideas I had were to 1: Make Soldiers of Rhun more expensive (since there are already easterling pikemen) and have them with a toggle spear and sword. This is different from the usual toggle to make it original, but would also give an elite unit to Evil Men. Of course, it doesnt really solve the problem once the sub-factions are implemented as harad has nothing elite. Perhaps a neutral building of khand could be implemented, that is expensive but has elite soldiers and lvl 1 and elite cavalry at lvl 2. 2: I thoguht that at the tavern, you might make a lvl 3 or 2 unit that was the sellsword. This could be a single unit that wielded a sword with a powerful attack like the beserker, eexcept with no splash and not as good against buildings. Then, at lvl 2 or purchase, it gains the toggle torch ability, which allows them to wield a torch that cannot target units but does good damage to buildings. Also, the transfer could be slow, to prevent sellswords from, when wielding the torch, turning around, slaughtering units attacking it, and then attack the building again. It would be vulnerable while using the torch. Perhaps this could go at lvl 2 with the cosairs, and then at level 3 you could build a mercenary company. This could be very expensive, maybe 2500 or something like that, but it summons two hordes of swordsmen, two of archers, and then one of pike or cavalry. These hordes could be commanded together or seperatly. Of course I dont really know how hard this would be to make, its just some ideas

Edited by Zyzzyva, 26 July 2007 - 10:00 PM.

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Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt. We do not. It is wisdom to recognize necessity, when all other courses have been weighed, though as folly it may appear to those who cling to false hope. Well, let folly be our cloak, a veil before the eyes of the Enemy! For he is very wise, and weighs all things to a nicety in the scales of his malice. But the only measure that he knows is desire, desire for power; and so he judges all hearts. Into his heart the thought will not enter that any will refuse it, that having the Ring we may seek to destroy it. If we seek this, we shall put him out of reckoning.
-Gandalf

#72 Nazgûl

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 10:47 PM

I hope you don't mind if I just say: I LOOOVE the EvilMen faction. :p Awesome work, and I should probably not even have tried them cause now I want EvilMen for SEE even more... lol. :p

Only one thing: where are the Easterlings? :D

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#73 Vithar-133

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 10:52 PM

@ Nazgul: the builders for evil men have a switching commandset

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#74 robnkarla

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 10:55 PM

The porter has a switching commandset that will let you get to the easterling buildings. When the faction is complete the interaction between the two subs will be more prevelant. 1.05.03 will have a lot of Evil Men stuff in it.

#75 The Best Guest

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 11:48 PM

Yeah Naz it is just like your good men builders :p
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#76 Dalf32

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 11:48 PM

evil men r shaping up vry well, and wen ther closer 2 finished im sure they will easily b my 1st or 2nd fav faction.

in reply 2 Zyzzyva:
evil men DO hav a siege unit, they hav mumakil which happen 2 b quite powerful, they jsut need a ranged siege, which i believe ther was sum brainstorming about (i cant remember).
i havnt noticed any extra resources frum the evil men, and i dont c any reason 2 make the evil men resource bildings completelly diff frum every other faction, that just dosnt mak much sense 2 me.
the sellsword idea is interesting but may b really difficult 2 implement (it sounds so).

and a request, on l8r posts PLZ put sum spaces in ur post if its gonna b that long. as of now it quite hard 2 read and concentrate on. thats jsut me tho.

"A wizard is never late, nor is he early; he arrives precisely when he means to."

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#77 hudfa

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:28 AM

First of all, a very fun faction, a good adition to the evil side. Some minor problems:
-no ai
-no rhun cavalry heavy armor skin
-rhun cavalry banner carrier has no animations
-some heros have all powers available from level 1
-fortress building plot remains when fortress is constructed
-faction could have some unique powers
-that power...oh, what is it called...whatever, the industry power, it dosen't work on rhun buildings.

#78 Zyzzyva

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:38 AM

and a request, on l8r posts PLZ put sum spaces in ur post if its gonna b that long. as of now it quite hard 2 read and concentrate on. thats jsut me tho.


Aye Aye Captain :p

Anyways. I agree that in a way Mumaks are siege, but their not only slow and weaker than rams, their weak to pikes, which makes it hard to get them to the enemy base safely. However, as I said, with use of 5 mumak I did win the game

Resources. Well I was just thinking that "what is the point of building mills if your harad in .03" The answer is none. However, despite the fact that i was trying to find ways to remdie this, it neednt be remidied. Its just why have two buildings when youll only build one? Why not just make one neutral?

Sellswords. Im not a modder, so I dont know if this is possible, but I was thinking along the lines of giving a beserker new skin and voice, taking away splash and building damage, but then make the torch, once lit, actually do something other than set off bombs and and look pretty. Can you make it so that when torch is lit you have -damage on units and +damage on buildings?

For Siege. For close Siege it could be like the trebucet in Age of Empires 2.Maybe it could be faster than other siege but must unpack and pack. Make it a wheeled ram pulled by horses to battle and the riders dismount and swing ram. Maybe can walk but is much slower. Variag Ram? For Ranged Siege I cant really think of anything other than a ripoff of gondor siege. Perhaps to make it original, it can switch to throwing sand, which instead of making units flee (heads) stuns them for a few seconds. I dont use alot of ranged siege so I dont have many ideas
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Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt. We do not. It is wisdom to recognize necessity, when all other courses have been weighed, though as folly it may appear to those who cling to false hope. Well, let folly be our cloak, a veil before the eyes of the Enemy! For he is very wise, and weighs all things to a nicety in the scales of his malice. But the only measure that he knows is desire, desire for power; and so he judges all hearts. Into his heart the thought will not enter that any will refuse it, that having the Ring we may seek to destroy it. If we seek this, we shall put him out of reckoning.
-Gandalf

#79 Nazgûl

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 03:08 AM

Yeah Naz it is just like your good men builders :p


I'm ashamed... :D if ANYONE should have seen that - I should... :p
Awesome. Love the faction even more now. Someday I wish this for SEE too... :p

// C}{riZpc_punch.gif
"Do not come between the Nazgûl and his mod!"
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I S.E.E. YOU! <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


#80 Lord_Denethor

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 06:22 PM

Did anyone post or notice how Khamul's Shadow of the Beast Power affects not just enemies but allies? Its a demoralizing passive ability.
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"The Rule of Gondor is mine, and no others!!" -Denethor II, Lord and Steward of Gondor




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